I posted all the above on the thread about the proposed Longwood-Aberdeen McMaster owned site thread... It would seem it applies now more than ever. If the CFL is or can be a profit making business, then the smart play is for Mr Young to cut out all his dead weight "partners" in the City Government and go it alone, with whatever retail / corporate partners he chooses to link up with. And... as an aside... the average CFL crowd this past season was about 28-29,000... dont think too small re stadium size... go up to 35,000 and in the long run that will pay off.
There has to be at least one greenfield or renovatable (is that a word? lol ) site left somewhere on the QEW between the Peace Bridge and the Hamilton area... if the fans would prefer the team go South rather than West or Northeast of Hamilton. I recall as a child going up to Canada on fishing vacations and passing the Fort Erie Jockey Club racetrack... IF that is still there, and assuming that it is; that horseracing is doing as poorly in Canada as it is in most of the USA; then that might be a Great spot to check out. (understanding all the while it may be long gone.)
The obvious and best loction for the Ticats would be Aldershot - this has been discussed before. It has everything that Bob needs. You have the QEW, 403, 407 all converging in that area. It's on the main Rail line for VIA and GO.
It is in Burlington but you can't get much closer to Hamilton, you could walk from Hamilton.
But how does that seem better than have the government build and pay for it and the team keeps every penny and on top of that have the city pay the team to run the place ?
it's so easy to spend other peoples money tho isn't it .. maybe Bob doesn't want to spend any money ..obviously has no investors or the cost thing could have been worked out ... what happened to that secret naming sponsor that was to put up 50 million ? guess that was a ghost all along good bluff tho
I don't mean to single out this comment, because my thought applies to the entire thread:
Whatever you guys are smoking, I want some.
A CFL team is $15M per year business. In Regina they have revenues of about $25M, so that's the best-case scenario. There's no way in h-e-double hockey sticks that Mr. Young is going to build a $160M stadium for a $15M per year business.
Makes sense red. Only way would be if it is part of a larger development associated with the stadium ie. hotels, convention, restaurants that are money makers and would benefit from having the money losing stadium close by.
You seem to be the guy in the know Red, so what's the revenue of a CFL team, plus a soccer team, and maybe a hotel and a few other events? You present it as if he'd build a stadium and only use it for the ten dates a year a cfl team uses, i'd suggest he might just try and maximize revenue by maximizing usage. I do agree though that it wont happen, at least not out of his own pocket.
There are a few NCAA schools like Northern Iowa, Northern Arizona and North Dakota (I believe) among a few others also that have small, but domed stadiums. Bob Young should get an architect to draw up a plan for a 25-35,000 seat domed stadium with retractable or movable seating sections (maybe even a roof that opens or is retractable too) with a stage capability at one end so it can be used year round for indoor-outdoor events including concerts, hockey and basketball. And of course you want the playing field at max size to be able to accommodate CFL Football and Soccer (World Cup games one day? MLS one day?. Premier League teams on tour?) Presto, you have a facility that could be open 250 days-nights or even more with efficient scheduling and planning. One you can play every major $$$ sport except baseball in.
Would that cost a lot? Probably, yes. But...,, now Mr. Young can get a hotel - restaurant - nightclub - bar - retail complex attached. That means corporate partners to share the costs. Then with (NHL) hockey capability, you also might get Jim Balsillie back in the game as a potential partner. If he has partners it lessens his burden financially. And if the facility pencils out as a surefire profit maker, then you can afford to spend more to build it, in anticipation of actually getting that money back and then some. (Dont laugh, I'm sure the Olympic Stadium in Montreal makes next to nothing at all for anyone. Not to even mention all the money losing stadia we have often wastefully built for a variety of different sports and owners down here in the USA.)
It sure wouldnt hurt to talk to some of the colleges and universities in the States that have small scale Domed stadia. Find out about costs, architects, construction firms, mistakes, things they wish that they had or hadn't done, or included etc
This plan isnt actually what I would personally do or favor were I Mr. Young.*** But it might solve a lot of his problems and make his contribution bearable. Plus he might find every city in the Golden Horsehoe and Ontario Peninsula (except Hamilton probably) anxious to have him and his partners to locate it in their community. He might actually get some cooperation and be made to feel wanted, rather than like a sucker on tap to remediate some contaminated land with no highway access that the city seems to now be stuck with.
(*** I would find a community West or South of Toronto in Southwest Ontario that wanted my operation and build a basic stadium with seating of 35,000, expandable to 50 for a Grey Cup, but not so basic as to be unpleasant for the fans. Just to try to keep construction and maintenance costs down. By building it myself, I get all the revenue streams myself and have no rental expense. Plus, I control it and have no conflicts over dates or usage. My models are the old Expo's stadium Jarry Park and the new Vancouver Empire Stadium, engineered and designed for permanence rather than as a stop gap. I think people would be truly astonished to see how nice a stadium one could have, relatively cheaply with the proper design and planning)
Universities in the US have a lot of money, the alumni and the whole local community get involved.
There is no comparison in Canada.
Even in NFL cities that have rich owners they didn't build or finance the whole construction of their stadiums. In NFL cities the people support and want their local and state governments to build large world class stadiums. The people rally around their teams. Cities with much smaller population bases than Hamilton's have 70,000+ seat stadiums.
There is not the support from the local community in Hamilton for a stadium. I think most people would support the 15,000 seat stadium for soccer at WH. We get a decent soccer stadium and a great facility for track running events. We might even attract a few people to watch indoor cycling at the velodrom - wow that could be a great money maker.
The Ticats could play their home games at the Rogers Center, improve the train service before and after games. And its only a 45 minute drive!!! We could then host Grey Cups and have plenty of hotel space/bars restaurants.
I think most people would support the 15,000 seat stadium for soccer at WH
I won't go and watch soccer in this facility but maybe others will. I will go watch university there or a "bring back a CFL game to Hamilton" if that happens once in a while for old time sakes. But my money will be going to where there is a CFL team in the area if it's in Mississauga, Oakville, Milton or wherever.
The dream team in this situation (as far as I’m concerned) is Young, Ballislle (or however you spell it) and Foxcroft.
While I’m no expert (BY ANY MEANS) you build a multi-use facility, where the local government sees your worth, within financially healthy demographic area that is accessible, fill that facility with acts that people want to see, surround it with restaurants, hotels and bars and you’ve got a license to make money. Wouldn’t you think? Pipe dream yes but it just might work!
There’s a lot of mainstream acts, rock, country, and multi-cultural acts that can fill a 30 000 seat stadium, and even more that can fill half of the stadium for a show. The ACC is busy 200+ dates a year, a stadium like we’re talking about could be busy at least 100 dates a year and when not in use for shows or games, let little league soccer and football play there.
With proper management, all the revenue from said dream stadium would have to enable it to be paid off relatively quickly. 10 to 15 years, and still make money during that time.
BTW: I’m not eager to spend other people’s money, I’m trying to find ways outside of getting government support to build a stadium, keep the Ticats close, and enable the Bob and the Ticats to make money so they can exist for long time. I don’t think that’s such a bad thing…is it?