Why only 22,500 seating for new Stadium?

Does anyone know why the latest figures put out by council/ODC announced the new Hamilton Stadium would seat only 22,500?

A few months previous to this disclosure, the same agencies disclosed seating for 25,000 from the current approx 30,000 yet even recently dropped that figure down to 22,500. Why the low total?

Why such a dramatic decrease of 7,5000 when Labor Day, playoffs, and Grey Cup games would require additional seating to accommodate demand?

And if the Cats had formidable winning seasons,(dare to dream) 27,000+ average wouldn’t be out of the question, thus it does seem to be a non sequitur to build a 22,500 seat stadium which would easily make it the smallest venue in the CFL.

The answer must be somewhere in this 678 pages and counting thread:

[url=http://forums.ticats.ca/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=55543]viewtopic.php?f=5&t=55543[/url]

but I don't have enough time to wade through them for you. :oops:

[url=http://forums.ticats.ca/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=55543&start=10140#p1198763]viewtopic.php?f=5&t=55543&start=10140#p1198763[/url]

The link contains a post that references a recent radio interview of Scott Mitchell where he clearly indicates "the capacity is going to be much higher, or certainly somewhat higher than what's being reported and of course there's nothing to prevent us from augmenting the stadium ourselves."

[url=http://www.sportsnet.ca/video/36625003001/40223747001/PTS-Ticats-new-stadium]http://www.sportsnet.ca/video/366250030 ... ew-stadium[/url]

Oski Wee Wee,

Russ

22,500 plus Box seats and Private booths bring it to close to 25,000. The team can get more revenue from the lower seating capacity by charging more for decent seats. It's rare to get more than 25,000 for a game now so why would they want empty seats in a new stadium. According to the city's report dated Feb 2011, the stadium site will only be able to support 25,000 permanent seats and up to 35,000 with temp seats for a Grey Cup. The present stadium could seat 29,000 because of the narrow slabs and the bench seats, individual fold up seats take up more room and a stadium using the same footprint will seat less than 25,000.
And the budget is $152 million.

I'll try and be a little more helpful in this response. :oops:

I would imagine that most (if not all) seats will be within the goal lines unlike the present stadium where (I think) only about 20,000 (or even less?) are between the goal lines. Much better seating (more room) plus all seats between the goal lines equals being able to charge more per seat, on average, over the present 29,000 seat stadium. The team will likely wind up with positive cash flow on such a downsizing.

Would the CFL execs approve a Grey Cup game a stadium with only 35,000 available seats? That would make it the smallest Grey Cup in the past 40 years and likely the lowest revenue producing event in decades..(unless Cup ticket rates are greatly increased to make up the difference)

and thanks for the info guys. Much obliged pard'ners. :cowboy:

Yes, if the team pays an indemnity to the league for the lost revenue (e.g. $2 million). We shall see what the revenue-generating potential of a Grey Cup will be once we get harder facts on what the final permanent seating capacity number is.

Oski Wee Wee,

Russ

MLS, $40,000,000 expansion fee and able to hold the championship game in a 21,000 seater.

Grey Cup is good in a 35,000 all things considered as it is not an American based "huge" league out there.

To my knowledge MLS is not nearly as popular as the CFL, and Grey Cups are usually played for 45,000++ seating as the Grey Cup is considered a traditional/historic game in Canada....

And if the CFL doesn't recognize a smaller CFL market like Hamilton for the Grey Cup with Hamilton putting up 35,000 seats and fairly high prices for tickets, boo hoo on the CFL in that case and they can go shove it you know where. The city doesn't even have as many hotel rooms as London, Ontario I believe reading something a while back.

That is the biggest problem - no hotels in Hamilton. The city has one of the biggest convention centres in the country but the problem is they can't attract big out of town conventions because there are no hotel rooms. With the closure of the Connaught a few years ago, there is ONE hotel in the downtown.
If Hamilton hosts a Grey Cup it's Toronto that benefits.

And I disagree with the "small market" like Hamilton - it's the BIGGEST market in Canada - don't forget we have 6 to 8 MILLION PEOPLE that live within 45 minutes of IWS. That would make NFL cities envious. The only problem is that we only tap into a tiny proportion of the huge market and there are not a lot of football fans in this area.

Good news is that the Connaught Hotel will soon resurface as the Spallaci Group have recently taken over the property and plans to renovate and re-open by next summer.

And I disagree with the "small market" like Hamilton - it's the BIGGEST market in Canada - don't forget we have 6 to 8 MILLION PEOPLE that live within 45 minutes of IWS.

But the stadium to take full advantage of that needed to be right next to the QEW, Confed Park or Aldershot, with second choices CP railyards or East Mountain.

Numbers mean nothing when you are talking location and the fact remains, IWS location and West Habour do not take advantage any where near this biggest market you speak of. Just the way it is. And Bob knows this only too well. But it's FF money on the line here from Hamilton, big bucks, and it should go towards the current IWS location or WH even if it means lesser crowds, well that is what will happen. Fair enough.

Take me for example. Here I am, season ticket holder, wife goes away for the weekend for a horseback riding thing up north, takes our beat up van, I'm left with our Mustang. I don't go to the game Friday night because, well, don't want to take the Stang and park near IWS area, so I watch at home, we always take our beat up van. So how many people who live in Ancaster, Glancaster, Burlington, Stoney Creek with nice cars and don't take the bus will never set foot near IWS with a nicer car? Lots. 6-8 mill mean nothing where IWS is located, hate to say this but that there is the truth.

I hear you Earl. I drive my very nice white 2009 Toyota Corolla XRS to each game. So far I’ve been lucky. (No incidents) But I am worried every game.

At risk of repeating, but the club has all but stated that the capacity will be increased after the conclusion of the Pan-am games. Second point, now that they're re-building the stadium, I don't think that cap of 35 000 seats is accurate. I'm sure they'll be able to expand it to 40 or 45 K. Third point, Hamilton hasn't hosted the Grey Cup since 1996. It's unlikely that the long period between Grey Cups will change that much (it obviously wont be 20 years wait, but still). So if Hamilton is to host once in the blue moon a "small" Grey Cup I don't think it's going to be an issue. Grey Cups wont be a frequent event in Hamilton in any case.

I don’t know where you get this from, the city or the team has NEVER stated that the capacity will be increased beyond 25,000.
Originally there was funding for a 15,000 seat stadium and then it was upped to afford a 25k stadium. There is no money to build more than a 25,000 seat stadium and there is no room at the present site to build more than a 25,000 seat stadium. 35k seats for a temporary event like a Grey Cup. To build a 45,000 seat stadium like you suggest would mean another $100million plus at least, and it couldn’t be done at the present site. Get used to it!!!

Read the report carefully, especially the paragraph that talks about the footprint and what the site can hold. The city would never approve 45,000 for that site.

[url=http://www.nationalpost.com/documents/2011/01/hamilton_stadium_report.pdf]http://www.nationalpost.com/documents/2 ... report.pdf[/url]

I don't understand how a dollar value fixes a stadium's seating capacity because a report said so. There are many cost drivers in a building such as a sports stadium.

Won't the powers-that-be choose from a series of varying design proposals? For instance they could choose between perhaps one that takes the allocated money and makes it a 30,000 seater without cup holders or another that's only 20,000 with LCD replay screens for each club seat.

With a quarter billion dollars at our disposal, I reckon we'll get a half decent 25,000+ seat stadium.

With a quarter billion dollars at our disposal, I reckon we'll get a half decent 25,000+ seat stadium.

Sounds quite reasonable to me as well. And one that might attract investors for an MLS team as well perhaps, down the road should the NASL or whatever league this is called prove to be successful.

With a quarter billion dollars at our disposal, I reckon we'll get a half decent 25,000+ seat stadium.
A quarter billion? I thought the figure was 155 million?

Yes, 152 Million, and once the design is set and the stadium is built it's not a matter of the city and the team adding 20,000 seats. If the new supports for the South or North stands are built for 40 or 50 rows of seats that's it, they just don't "add more seats" even if there was another $100 million available after construction.