Who should have been axed, Cleo Lemon or Jim Barker?

Cleo went 11 for 15 last game with 3 flagrant drops. It's not his fault that the play calling sucks (draws on 2nd and 10, 6 yard hitch passes on 2nd and long, NFL-type nickel and dime stuff).

Lemon did a pretty good for a QB who had no QB mentor to learn the CFL game. I think the Argos axed the wrong guy.


Lemon should not have been invited back after the fiasco of last year.
The fact that Barker was stubborn in continuing with this project and since he did not bring in more QB's to compete for the position, save and except Jyles, in my opinion makes his situation very dicey and depending on the rest of the schedule he could be toast.
For sure, one of his two positions would be removed as in this day and age one person cannot due justice to the GM and HC jobs.

I'm pretty sure Barker's job is on the line if this Jyles as the savior thing doesn't work out. We don't know what Lemon was actually fired for (though it sounds like a locker room incident), but no way should he have been pulled and left to sit while Dalton Bell threw the game away.

IMO the time of combination GM/coaches has passed. You need a guy dedicated to the job.

Couldn't agree anymore. Barker needs to fire himself.

That could be how it works out, Barker finding his own H C for 2012

Can't blame him for sticking by Lemon, Many NFL fans would be following his progress, too bad for them it didnt pan out, Why Lemon was # 3 on the Bill's depth chart?? seems they are the ones who have trouble with scouting , like most NFL teams, They CUT players like Fantooz to make themselves look good, but reality is they are not as good as they are hyped!!

Hopefully Barker stays with his CIS QB talent hunt and CFL fans can have a QB or QB,s worth interest !!

Lemon does not / did not have the arm strength for the CFL. He is much more suited for the US brand of the game. This is a prime example of how the Canadian and US version of the game are different. He, to me, seems like he would be a lot more effective on a field w/o such a far sideline.

Jim Barker acquired a QB in the off-season because he saw there was an issue. Jyles could do great things with the Argos, and will, I believe, if nothing else provide a much improved Argo O. It is unfortunate for Barker that the one really big move he made in the off-season has not played yet. He already had a pretty decent D, and a great ST, solid O for the most part...just not the right pivot.

Jyles has the arm strength that could make the Argos speedy receivers a scary thing. I am not sure Jyles is the final answer for the Argos, but I think it will be a huge step in the right direction, and will at least give the fans a more entertaining game to watch.

Lets review this in a few games.

did he really :stuck_out_tongue:

I absolutely agree that Barker must at least give up one of his titles, either GM or HC, but I'm at a loss to decide which one it should be. On one hand, he hasn't been able to gather the high-quality talent needed to turn this team around. He's certainly not the same type of GM as Eric Tillman or Bob O'Billovich. On the other hand, he doesn't seem to be the right type of Head Coach for this team. If he has to appear as a bully in front of the players, or if the players don't really respect him as much as they need to, then there's definitely a problem.
However, I do believe that Barker is a better coach than Bart Andrus, so it wasn't a complete slide downwards! Perhaps if a new GM were to be found, and that GM were to be able to find some real high-quality talent for this team, then maybe keeping Barker as a Head Coach wouldn't be such a bad thing as it appears now. It won't help the team for this season, but, better late than never! :?

If he's going to give up one, it has to be HC. A new GM would want to bring his own coach in, and that type of situation gets dysfunctional in a hurry.

He could move upstairs and hire a HC (who could then hire assistants) without the same issues.

I woud like to see barker coaching the giants.

Lemon wasn't 3 on the bills depth chart, I think you are thinking of Gibran Hamdan.

You mean those speedy receivers who couldn't catch a ball even if it was handed to them? Toronto has zero talent at WR.

Nobody knows how good Argo receivers are because they haven't had a QB who can throw past 6 yards in the past two years.

Barker is a whiny winnie the pooh !!

Why would you throw it to them 40 yards down the field when they're dropping the 5 yard catches and can't get open 40 yards down the field?

Dalton Bell has the arm strength to throw deep and it's not like he had open guys to overthrow wildly. This is the worst group of receivers in the CFL and no QB will look good until that's fixed. Jyles might be a small improvement, but if you expect the offense to suddenly put up 40 points a game you're dreaming. A QB is only as good as the guys catching the ball.

Are you still feeling the love for Jim Barker? I know Jyles was rusty, but that performance in BC was pitiful :oops:
How many games do you give him to turn things around with Jyles?

Love Barker he is a really good coach and good for Aegos, they need alot more that just a new qB, but getting rid of Barker doesn't change the Argos.

If Barker could come back to the Stamps I'd take em

Over Huff? :expressionless:

Cleo Lemon deserved the axe. You can’t have a guy laughing at his teammates misfortunes.

Jyles performance in BC was pitiful? Seriously?
Hate more haterade somewhere else please. Jyles second half was better than any half save maybe one of football Cleo Lemon has played all season.

He's younger, faster, smarter, and has a better arm then Cleo Lemon. He is a CLEAR improvement at quarter back.

If you want to see a pitiful QB game, you should have watched Buck Pierce today.