Who Should Be Told?

On "Clean out your locker day" CH Sports had a videotape comment from the coach saying that he believed the time was NOW, rather than later, to make some changes, with a suggestion that some players will be told VERY SOON that they won't be invited back. Unless such action is an attempt to show that "while the same sheriff will be in town, he's being forced to have a new attitude," I don't see any advantage, at all, to making moves like this right now. Why let someone go, freely, now, perhaps to some other team's roster, before you know who'll replace them, when they could maybe later be part of a trade package. You don't pay them in the off-season and you can release them later when you know who's coming to camp. When I look at the roster, I can't see who he might be thinking of other than DeAngelis, Hudson, Bauman, D. Brown, any of the 3 backup QB's, or PR players Lanskter and Harris. I'm interested in what others have to say on this.

......it's just a move to deflect any blame that should be at the coaches feet. ( especially the O-C )

I'm getting rather uncomfortable by the finger pointing at the players that has been going on from the coaching and GM's offices.

We aren't morons so we know some players screwed up in the execution of some plays last week, but we don't need the coaches re-living it every day in the media. (that's our job :wink: )

How about they point the fingers at their own failings for a change ie: preparation, game planning, poor offensive playbook/package etc.

because if they point fingers at themselves they know they'll be out of the job.Anything to stay on the payroll.

In public to reporters? I'm afraid not. How many GREAT coaches have taken responsibility for defeats in this league, the NFL, etc. after big defeats in important games? If I were running a football team or playing on a roster, I would want my coach to take the bullet and say "we were outcoached" etc. Fingers are pointed at coaches ANYWAY...hell, I'm not doing that in the moment because I need my digits to type! LOL

Marc Trestman, John Hufnagel, Rex Ryan...guys you want to play for because even though a Trestman and a Ryan are at polar opposites re their personalities and image, they are clear where the buck stops. Crystal clear.

Coaches who constantly deflect blame (Brad Childress is the intergalactic poster child for this) are justifiably reviled by their players. Demanding accountability from players demands taking accountability for one's own actions as a coach. It's a two-way street, IMHO.

The more important issue is what do the headset honchos do about their apparent and/or acknowledged failings. Charlie Taaffe failed in Hamilton because his whole outlook, demeanour, and method fed into the building sense he had little or no clue how to right the ship. I don't think he forgot how to coach, it was that he was unable to instill his offensive system in particular with the same vigour and focus as he did in Montreal in the 1999-2000 run. He would take the blame for losses, etc. and one would be left wondering...and what you you gonna do about it, Charlie?

Marcel is at a crossroads. He seems to have a good rapport with the locker room, but there is a sense the franchise has hit a ceiling two floors from the desired suite smell of success (that was deliberate LOL). He must bring in an offensive coordinator who can pull out close games -- big games -- where the Cats are not executing well. With the talent we have, it's a tipping point. Almost is totally unacceptable moving forward. Laying eggs in the playoffs ought to only happen to Larks, but in the real world, things aren't so clear cut.

Oski Wee Wee,

Russ

I believe the obligation to the team comes from both sides. We can argue and rightfully so that the offensive game plan was nothing special this year. However, Marcel is not the kind of coach that will get in a players grill if he screws up. I personally like a coach that has flair and is not afraid to stand up to a player. Each player is payed to perform so get with it. I am not fond of this player representative crap. These guys are professionals, so cut the crap and play each and every play.

I still not convinced Obie has brought in all the correct talent for each position. I don’t know who the player personal guys are for all the other teams. Other teams find the gems and we get the level of play we all watched on Sunday. One thing is blatantly obvious, we don’t have all the pieces for the puzzle yet. The off season should bring some pleasant surprises I hope and set the tone for training camp.

Does he get in the player's "grill" at team meetings? At practice? Is playing time tied to performance, talent considerations factored in? That's more important to me than histrionics on a sideline.

It IS about consistency in standards and making those standards clear. Treating men as men and being a man about that. Nick "the Nicktator" Saban "stood up" to players but weaseled out of Miami when he found his exit strategy to Tuscaloosa, so there has to be substance to the bluster.

Marc Trestman is the best coach in the CFL, IMHO. Combined with Jim Popp, messages that need to be delivered are. His staff is hands on and they demand results. If Hamilton can build its program to that standard, Tigertown will be where it hasn't been since 1972: the true gold standard of the CFL.

Oski Wee Wee,

Russ

I can't believe MB is pointing fingers at players. The only fingers that should be pointed are at the coaches. Now is not the time to play tough guy Marcel... You're about six weeks late for that.

How does anyone know hes not talking about the coaching staff aswell?

Threre is already a "Burn the Witches thread".

[url=http://forums.ticats.ca/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=62879]viewtopic.php?f=5&t=62879[/url]

Did he fumble the football? Drop the football? Throw interceptions? Miss a FG?

It's a classless move and he should be fired immediately.

Ask yourselves this: Would Trestman, Hufnagel or Buono pull such a public spectacle?
Makes me flinch thinking about it

Total lack of class from a coach trying to deflect his own short comings.

8)

No, but players aren't cutting it, they get, well, cut.

Depends on how the message is delivered. If someone can indicate a direct quote where Marcel throws a player by name under the bus, I'd like to see it. Assuming changes are going to be made, what is the problem with saying some players will not be invited back? Is "changes are going to be made" the proper code?

Telling the players soon or not? Timing is secondary to the content of why those changes are being made. Coaches get fired hours after seasons end quite frequently FFS.

There are consequences to having repeated playoff defeats. That's pro sports. I don't think the only consequences will be on the roster. What is one's definition of "very soon?" The Michael Bishop release in Saskatchewan made one's head spin with its suddenness. Players are released at different times during the off-season. For very diverse reasons.

If you're cutting folks at this stage of the cycle, the immediate inference I get is that they have little trade value. Just because Marcel mouths the words does not mean Obie is going to help jettison tradable guys. The evaluation of those players is ongoing as per the overall evaluation the team's roster and coaching personnel undergo.

My take is this: this team is close re the core it has. Changes have to be made in various areas of the team to upgrade, particularly in the kicking game and the secondary. I fully expect a heated 2011 training camp. Teams have to be prepared to evolve when simply getting to the playoffs. To win, you have to aggressively transform the roster from time to time. Jim Popp is not one to sit content with almosts. The Als have made numerous changes to the the roster over the years to strengthen the club's base and to give fresh blood to its program.

This racket is not for the meek. If Marcel is rubbing people the wrong way, maybe he'll need good advice from Obie re selling that aspect of his job. Better to be rubbing than to be rubbed out in professional football.

Oski Wee Wee,

Russ

The proof is who goes and why. The timing is the team's timing, not the media's timing or what the fans' immediate timetable may be.

I am pretty sure Bob, Mitchell, and Obie will review the situation. Change is coming. Marcel's long term future in Hamilton demands playoff success of a higher level than simply making it and hosting defeats.

Oski Wee Wee,

Russ

In today's Spec:

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No acknowledgment whatsoever about the coaching shortcomings. It's all the player's fault.
Thank goodness for Arland Bruce who led a group of players in running up and down the stadium steps in preparation for next season. That's the "never quit" kind of gesture that we need badly after two .500 seasons. Way to go AB3! :thup:

for sure should go

Mike Gibson
Marcel
Cobb

maybe

D'angelos
Wilbur --because he is an import ad we need a non import and punter
defensive backfield except Hinds and Dennis and Hebert

8) Well, since Obie made the exact same statement, regarding the players are to blame, then I would guess you want
  him fired immediately also for saying such a classless thing !!    <!-- s:roll: -->:roll:<!-- s:roll: -->

I've read the article over a couple of times,IMHO I see nothing wrong in what he said, at all.
Good for him to seeing that there are holes to fill and changes needed. The sooner the better
Marcel will improve this team.
Folks,yes we underachieved this year,but we've had 2 playoff games in back to back years,at home,ok,we lost both,but we have to go back atleast a decade when that last happened.

For those who are calling for Marcels head...it's not going to happen.
I think one coach that needs to be addressed(fired) is Gibson..he needs to go...not Marcel

catfan: Looking backwards to justify two 9-9 seasons and then being knocked out of the playoffs each time, is not the way I look at it.
We "underachieved" two years in a row with the same coaches and different players. We should have done a lot better. Blaming the players for all the problems is wrong when they have been playing under a highly questionable offensive system. I don't think the offensive talent on this team has been used properly.
I have no problem keeping Marcel as long as Gibson goes, even though he should have demanded better from Gibson. It would be good to see how Marcel performs with a different OC.

Indeed!

The coach is responsible for answering the questions that are posed to him.

"“I made the point to them — I wanted them to hear it first — that we were going to make changes and that this is performance-based business and our performance wasn’t good enough,? he said. “Unfortunately, we won’t be able to come back as a total group.?

[url=http://www.thespec.com/sports/article/276616--change-is-coming-as-ticats-say-goodbye]http://www.thespec.com/sports/article/2 ... ay-goodbye[/url]

My emphasis.

It's good enough for me and Kevin Glenn!

Since when does a head coach using the word "our" in "our performance wasn't good enough" (that includes him if you understand the collective concept of that possessive adjective) get pilloried for not including himself in the criticism? Only on ticats.ca! Ridiculous!

The coordinators and coaches will be evaluated. Mike Gibson is almost sure to walk. As long as Obie and Marcel are in place to be the ones to enact changes, I have no issue with them doing so. Period.

Oski Wee Wee,

Russ