What is the ideal stadium size for each CFL team stadium

By a few years ago, I literally meant a few years ago (2009-2011). Sure there were some games where they just didn’t sell enough tickets to sell out, but there were a fair number of games where the issue was that there were rumours/hearsay that the game was already sold out, and so people didn’t even bother looking into getting tickets because they thought it wasn’t a possibility. This forced the Riders to actually have to put out announcements to media and such that there were indeed some tickets left to the upcoming game. Prior to 2005 though, it was definitely a different era; uncompetitive teams and an inability to financially compete with larger markets created a sense of hopelessness about the team. The salary cap completely changed that and created the even playing-field, and ironically enough it catapulted the Riders into a situation where they could reverse the tables and one-up the larger market teams by “buying up” the talent were the cap not still in place.


Also, in reference to Cameco and PCS… it should be noted that those are so large because they industries were nationalised and these were the provincial crown corporations for Potash and Uranium back in the day. They were subsequently privatized in the late 80s and 90s. At present selling the other major crown corporations Saskatchewan still has (SaskPower, SaskEnergy, SaskPower, SGI) would basically amount to political suicide, and legislation would require the party to campaign on doing just that. They cannot be sold without it being clear that it was a goal of government.

If Saskatchewan had nationalized all of it's potash and uranium, and then didn't give it away for next to nothing like they did... Last year the citizens of Saskatchewan would of paid no taxes at all ,and every single citizen would of recieved 5 figure cheque in the mail. The combined profits of agrium,mosaic, Potash Corp, Cameco, etc approached 5 billion dollars. For those of you counting at home ,that is close to $50000 for every man woman and child ,that was stole from people of Saskatchewan. That potash benifits the state of Minesota(where Mosaic pays their corporate income taxes)more then Saskatchewan, where they pay next to no royalties. Canada is the stupidest country in the world.

don’t compare nationalized companies in essentially republics (to use a broad term) to that of democratic societies. If you think for 1 second that thhose profits would be turned anywhere near 50% back onto the people directly you only fool yourself.

As for that 5B…Agrium made 1.9, and over half of that was from outside of Canada.
about 10% of Mosaic is based in Canada
…why would these profits go to Canada/Saskatchewan again?

Cameco and PCS were privatized because it was becoming very difficult to sell the product. At the time, for example, the US was basically ready to blacklist Canadian potash, and the US was PCS’s bread and butter…their hands were essentially tied, because the issue at hand was the monopoly that the nationalization create…it was essentially being viewed as unfairly subsidized and not fair to the open market…fair statement really…and large tarrifs were placed on its imorts. Areva, for example, is dealing with a similar issue being French crown, which is why they attempting a dominating a lot of T&D a few years back (transmition and distribution)…because if it is your grid, then you buy the power that is on it…theirs. The market downturn was horrid timing, and they were forced to dump a lot of that off…it was a brilliant strategy with horrid timing, and they are really feeling the effects now.

You make it sound like Canadian companies are these timid little outfits begging for a piece of the pie. Some of these companies have been involved in their fair share of foreign reapings…off the top of my head, google Talisman and Sudan and see what you get. If you have never read anything on that I think the reults will really shock you. Mixed in a civil war and literally plowing over villages because they were in the way of pipelin construction for lines that had basically no safety protocols. Talisman’s was basically forced out eventually, and lost a pile on the deal…it is why they are not the big dog in NG now…still darned big, but they had to do a pile of restructuring. This is but one example, but is always the one that jumps to mind first for clear reasoning

The ironic overarching problem is their television coverage.

Sure, the league gets alot of financial stability from a nice network contract…
but the broadcast quality is sooo good these days
that many people would rather sit comfortably at home to watch the games.

At the same time, the league needs their product to appear “desirable” on TV
so they don’t want to display a bunch of empty seats.

The NFL has also started to voice concern about this issue recently.

Mosaic has 4 potash mines… three are located in the province of Saskatchewan.
Why not go ask the citizens of Norway if they want their oil privatized? Do you honestly think that they don’t enjoy getting paid to go to university, or that they hate having free daycare. They probably hate those things as much as they like letting forigners into their country to screww up their economy. That’s why they don’t do it. That is why they did not join the eu and that is why they are the most successful economy in Europe. The sad thing is that Norway only has oil… Canada on the other hand has the highest quality diamonds on the planet…the second largest oil reserves in the world, Ontario has more gold then anywhere in north America, Saskathewan has potash and uranium… bc is loaded full of trees… i could go on but whats the point… Canada has systematicly given all of those resources away for next to free. bc cuts down tree that are worth up to $50000/ piece and barges them out to Washington to milled by Mexicans making 12 dollars an hour. Meanwhile 2/3 of the mills are closed in BC and the stumpage fee is set at something like $35. yes we give away 700 year old yellow cedars for 35 dollars!!! We are so stupid that for years the Americans tryed to force us to charge more for our wood, but we refused and shut our mills down instead… This country is so stupid that it is ridiculous.

“Mr.Bungle”] Another non-sensical rant

Mosaic has 4 potash mines.. three are located in the province of Saskatchewan. Why not go ask the citizens of Norway if they want their oil privatized? Do you honestly think that they don't enjoy getting paid to go to university, or that they hate having free daycare. They probably hate those things as much as they like letting forigners into their country to screww up their economy. That's why they don't do it. That is why they did not join the eu and that is why they are the most successful economy in Europe. The sad thing is that Norway only has oil... Canada on the other hand has the highest quality diamonds on the planet....the second largest oil reserves in the world, Ontario has more gold then anywhere in north America, Saskathewan has potash and uranium... bc is loaded full of trees... i could go on but whats the point.. Canada has systematicly given all of those resources away for next to free. bc cuts down tree that are worth up to $50000/ piece and barges them out to Washington to milled by Mexicans making 12 dollars an hour. Meanwhile 2/3 of the mills are closed in BC and the stumpage fee is set at something like $35. yes we give away 700 year old yellow cedars for 35 dollars!!!! We are so stupid that for years the Americans tryed to force us to charge more for our wood, but we refused and shut our mills down instead.. This country is so stupid that it is ridiculous.
Wow, you really don't understand how Tax Sytems work do you. As for Norway there is no such thing as "free Daycare" or "free University" or "free Health care" EVERONE pays through the tax system. That's why they have incredibly high taxes. I would rather live in a country that has low tax rates and it gives ME the choice whether I want to pay for daycare or university or healthcare. Do you actually believe that our Health Care system is "free" lol, we have some of the highest premiums in the world and rapidly getting the worst health cares system in the world. I would rather have the freedom to decide if I want to pay health insurance or no health insurance, I don't like it that the government runs our health care system, but I live in a democracy and accept it. Ontario has a $250 BILLION debt and over 50% of the budget (taxes) go to health care. They are also running a $15 BILLION a year deficit and paying $10 BILLION a year in interest payment on the debt!! That doesn't leave a lot of money in the pot.

How do we “give away” our resources? We receive the “World Price” - when the Keystone pipeline is flowing we will be exporting and the US will be paying the world price for it!! As for your rant about wood, the federal government subsidizes our forestry industry and the US is at a disadvantage. That’s why the disputes have gone in the US favour.

Just STOP your rants against the US - if they didn’t buy our products we would be in sad shape.
The Auto industry has been the most important industry in Ontario - the FIVE major car companies build their cars in Ontario with Canadian steel and 90% of the cars built here get exported to the USA. There are models of cars that are only made in Canada, the Chryslers minivan is one. When you buy one in California or in Alberta they are made in Ontario.
So if the US economy booms so does Canada’s. If the Americans don’t buy cars our auto industry suffers, the parts industry suffers and the steel industry suffers.
We are an exporting nation and that’s how we make money, we are not a “stupid” country as you say.
And stop your rants against immigrants, Mexicans etc!!

Well put. Its funny how Mr.Bungle talks up the merits of places he knows nothing about (and clearly has never been). If he’d ever been to Norway he’d know they pay $20 Canadian for a beer - with a HUGE portion of that going towards tax. I love how socialists never allow the facts to get in the way of their idealism. LOL

Odd how so many people think everything they want or think they need should be free. Just absolutely no concept that nothing is free - someone always pays somewhere.

And though I disagree with much of what you post, mikem...I could not agree with you more on the last one. Sick and tired of people putting Americans down for looking to their best interests. Commentator Gordon Sinclair put it best about 40 years ago. Too lazy to look it up but it's gotta be on youtube somewhere.

America pays a higher percentage of their federal income taxes to healthcare then any other country in the world... The fact that you pay 10 times as much for services on top of what the government is already paying is simply salt in the wounds.
Yes, Norway pays lots of taxes in Norway, but they live a standard of living that Canadians could only dream of. So it works for them. Plus, they all just go to Sweden or Denmark to get drunk..lol.
Do you want to know something about Mexicans in the USA? 70% of them go back on their own because they can't make a living in the USA. it's hard to make ends meet making $15/day picking fruit isn't it... Evil socialist countries like Australia have a minimum wage that is 18 dollars an hour so a fruit picker earns more in an hour in Australia, then a worker doing the exact same job makes in an entire day in the USA. Good luck on the American economy ever recouvering.

Ideal stadium is one built like an accordion. So its always full no matter how many people want to buy tickets.

Yeah, been there. Beautiful country but if there is no way they could afford to live like we do in North America. They have a very minimalist way of life and nowhere as materialistic or able to consume as we do. There is no way the US can “recouver” :lol:

The reason Americawill never get better is because there is simply no middle class left anymore. No middle class left to buy cars and buy houses. Also there is no middle class left to pay taxes. The fact you have 30 million illegals using your sewer sysems, using your hyways andyes even your medical system and yet they pay no taxes is a huge drain. oh they work for rich people who pay taxes right? Well if yoou believe that rich people pay even close to 20% taxes with all of the loopholes and shelters then you r kidding yourself. Mitt Romney proved that... he was barely paying 10%

Well never say never. The middle class was considered destroyed in North America in the 1930s. Yet it came came back with a vengeance during the 50s and 60s and powered the economic growth of that time, until the oil crisis and incredibly incomptetent and corrupt government sidetracked it the mid 70s.

It is interesting that you say the mid 70s. That is because the mid 70s is precisely the point that our society started to separate the rich and the poor, and that average man(woman) started taking a pay cut every single year since... Yes, the median income has fallin every single year in Canada since1976. We have not once seen an increase in the median income in almost 40 years. The best example is that in 1971 that the minimum wage in Canada was about $2.75/hr... well when you go to http://www.bankofcanada.ca/rates/relate ... alculator/
you punch in the numbers and you come to a number of $16.50. Yes... the minimum wage was over 60% higher 40 years ago then it is now.

That’s pretty much it, a simple answer.
the 5 western teams all have season ticket bases over 22K and are safe bets to each average 30K+ most seasons.
All CFL stadiums need to be expandable into that 45-55K range for grey cups of course and should have no less then 40 private suites, 1K total luxury seats should be the min going forward regardless of stadium capacity.

I can see Toronto being successful with a 30-35K stadium, but right now they need a 25-26K capacity outdoor stadium(similiar to Ottawa) that is built able to grow to 35K.
The Argos were successful while they were in exhibition stadium, they could be again. Skydome seems to be the catalyst that has turned the Argos into a wreck. Prior to the start of construction on Skydome/RC the Argos has 15 straight seasons with 30K+ attendance average.
Since 1989 the Argos have only had 5 seasons of over 30K 24 seasons… coincidence or cause/effect.

So the mistake by the lake wasn't so bad after all.... What i don't understand is that both the CNE and Varsity sat empty for years and no on thought of moving the argos back. It wasn't until both were leveled to the ground that people were like... aw crap.. too bad those stadiums weren't around... why could there not of been a visionary that seen the future. I am sheerly speculating, but is it possible that by U2 playing that concert in 1997 in Montreal, that they not just the Als were saved, but the entire CFL and maybe even the MLS. Has there ever been a direct link between Mcgill stadium and the MLS's push for soccer specific stadiums?

I just researched it… CNE was torn down in 99 and Varsity in 2002. suddenly in 2003 the Argos wanted to move to Lamport stadium? Why didn’t this light bulb go off a couple of years before… then in 2007 they got screwed by MLSE… The whole thing is maddening when you realize it is 2013 and the argos are plying in a stadium that should of seen the wrecking ball 15 years ago. They are playing in a stadium that they have lost over 100 million dollars playing in and the primary tenant has lost close to half a billion dollars in… The only entity to lose more money on the Skytomb then the Blow Jays were the tax payers of Ontario. This stadium has been nothing but a total loss for anyone who has anything to do with it.They replaced the mistake by the lake with the worst stadium ever built in history. No wonder Ontario is preaching austarity…lmao.

Want another interesting fact about the Mexicans you speak of? 99% of those fruit pickers are in the country ILLEGALLY.

Just a dumb question: how exactly do you propose the US government legislate a fair salary for someone who shouldn’t even be in the country? Its not as though the low salary is flagged on the illegal migrant worker’'s TAX RETURN!!! Actually, I’d love to hear your answer to this one :slight_smile:. Just think, if you can come up with a solution you’ll be helping millions of people have a better life.

you really are naive aren't you?...lol. You actually think that the American government couldn't stop a full 10% of their population from not even having citizenship... What other country on earth allows this. The easiest way to stop this would be actual penalties (say in the millions) to companies who hired illegals. The easiest way for employers to ensure their workers were American citizens would be to require a drivers lcence abstract. if you don't have a drivers icence, then you are probably not a citizen.

While Mr. Is taking a big crap on our neighbors he might want to consider what he will do when oil comes crashing back down to 40 bucks a barrel (It always does) and it costs more than that to pump a barrel out of the tar sands where he works. Things in the US are very bad but we are tied to them like laces on a boot. The only reason we are in a bit of a better situation right now is that we are sucking every ounce of raw material and resource out of the ground, those resources aren’t infinite.