What is the ideal stadium size for each CFL team stadium

If you believe MlS attendance figures... I have some oi wells to sell you in Ontario.

TFC is the worst... they draw 5000 or less and call it 16K..lol

The thing is how it looks and many people think there doing great.

Other then Seatle …no teams are profitable… Van and Portland would make money, but their designated player eats up too much and thus they are break even at best. EVERY OTHER TEAM LOSES MONEY. The New York Red Bulls have been a colosal flop since they can’t even come close to filling their new stadium. The Montreal Impact had to slash their ticket prices substancially once they figured out that only 10000 people would pay the prices that they were asking. There is essentially no TV revenues for the clubs(well under one million dollars per club) About the only substancial revenues the league recieves is from suckers who shell out 30 million for a club.
I don’t even believe that they actually pay that much, it’s more of a PR stunt to say that they do. The MLS is not in any way a success… TFC went from having 16000 people on their waiting list to having 16000 empty seats. TFC would lose money if they just had to pay their regular roster, nevermind the designated players they bring in… The whole league is a joke and no one and I do mean no one watches their games on TV. Their TV ratings are actually worse then the IRL…Trust me, if you can’t draw IRL numbers, then you have no hope. I believe the WNBA gives the MLS a run for their money. Seatle are the Winnipeg Goldeyes of the MLS. They are the one exception to the norm. Without the Cascadia region… the MLS would be in dire straits.

NASL signed Pele back n the 70s. Soccer was the big coming thing back then too. Beckham's signing a few years ago was supposed to make the sport big time....again. Never worked, just like the NHL's (3x) failed plans to expand into the sunbelt. Soccer will always be a big participation sport (but a niche sport) because it's fairly cheap. But I don't think soccer will ever be a top level spectator sport in Canada or the US.

I think soccer will be a top sports for fans but not the Mls it will be Nasl/Usl.

Soccer is quite big in North America... it's just the the MLS stinks the joint out. EPL games draw better viewership the MLS games both here in Canada and in the USA. For every soccer fan in North America, only 1 out of ten will bother watching the MLS on TV. A higher percentage will actually go to the games initially because there is no other games to go to. However, once the stink of the MLS seeds into their pores, then they stop going to the games.
TFC is a great example of what the MlS is all about. TFC, never at any point had a following on TV. I remember back in 2007-2008 seeing TV ratings on The Score that had 14000 fans nationwide watching their games. The CBC did substancially better, but still had a hard time cracking 100K.
As for the great attendance they had the first few years, it was solely due to the fact that TFC filled a vaccum of ex-pats who desprately wanted something to call their own. The fact that most fans could not stand the product, but went to the games to sing and drink and throw streamers on the field and to act like asshats in general ,fooled people in the Toronto media to think that TFC was successful. I called the eventual demise of TFC years ago. I realized that if people were not watching the games on tv, then their interest in the club was at best a passing fancy. Obviously, having terrible teams has not helped matters, but i believe that even if the team was successful that the overall quality of the MLS has been the biggest reason why TFC can't get 5000 actual bums sitting in their highschool stadium. Yes, don't forget they play in a high school stadium, that is a huge factor as well.

good point. the Calgary stadium sucks when full, especially from a family point of view. It was recently discussed on here....if they had more accessible facilities (washrooms and concessions) I firmly believe more people would attend. I know several people in Calgary that only go to games when I am there because they hate the stadium...but they would definitely go to more at another venue, and likely 40-50% of them would be season ticket holders.[/quote

Well my buddy and our girlfriends would go every chance we had... 4-5 games a year. But it just got
to be too downtrodden.We'd still go if they fixed the place. Like I say, great sightlines.. but modernize it... you want to charge people $85, make sure we can sit in a seat not a bench, and that the bathrooms are within hiking distance...and have the concessions fairly close too. How much money are the Stamps losing 'cause of this? I thnk we're all on the same page here...why can't they get their s**t together and get this done? Ken King??? Anyone???

SHHHH, only the Argos get called out on their attendance numbers. You can't report that TFC or even the Raptors lie about their attendance numbers or your Leaf access is cut off. When you think about how the media is controlled and so bias for MLSE teams, it really is very sad

Exactly and you have to asks yourself, why do people still think that TFC is selling out, when in fact, not counting games at the Dome, TFC has not sold out BMO in 3 years!!!!!! Most members of the sports media in this city feed at the feet of MLSE and if they don't then their Editors do and their is nothing worse then your editor getting a call from MLSE or corp sponsors of MLSE cry about a story they don't like. Never forget the Sportsnet reporter who told me he got crap for pointing out there was thousands of empty seats at the Raptor game

I have to admit... i'm just speculating on the actual crowds at TFC games... But when you watch the games on TV it is reminds me of Ottawa Renegade games that were rained out during there final season. It appears as though there are only a few hundred people in the whole stadium. The sad thing is....it's not raining.

This looks much much better then the games they played last fall. Those games were half the size or less of these crowds.

[url=http://video.tsn.ca/?dl=soccer-mls/latest/1/0/900156/clip/442]http://video.tsn.ca/?dl=soccer-mls/late ... 6/clip/442[/url]

I watched this video and considering the stadium holds 20K… you would figure that it is around the 10k point. There are about as many occupied seats as full ones… Even a total optimist could not say there is more then 12500 in this stadium… to be fair, you cant judge it by the begininng of the game or the end of the game. People started to leave once Dallas went up two goals. If you forward the video to 3:30 you see a good view of the blind side of the stadium. It actually looks better then the camera side of the stadium. It is still hard to tell though because the camera angle can be decieving. this crowd ctually looks good from some of the crowds i seen last season. Of course mlSE had to cut season ticket prices back to 2007 levels (about half the price of 2011 levels) so in reality the team is losing piles and piles of money. would speculate that despite playing 50% more games that TFC attendance is probably about the same as argo attendance. The difference is… tfc does not recieve any league revenues (wy under 1 million dollars a year) and TFC also pays a designated player or two which in fact drives their player costs higher then the Argos. the only saving grace for tfc is when they are able to sell off one of their players, they recieve 20% of the money.

It's because...well... soccer is only slightly less boring than watching paint dry.

I agree Saskie, except for the lower capacity thing...the stadium didnt sell out because the team usually sucked, or was mildly competitive...there was like a 30 year stretch where they were probably not picked as a GC contender. Tough sell.

The Riders and Bombers have excelled with fan support since 2007...the year cap inforcement was initiated and allowing them to be competitive. The clubs were generally not competitive because they simply could not compete with a club such as say Edmonton. With a cap in place, even in a 10 team league, it is highly unlikely you will see more then 3-5 year ineptness. It is pretty rough to draw fan support when you know that you can't compete out of the gate....it is like Walmart opening across the street from Jim-Bob's convenience mart.

W/O cap smaller markets simply can not compete. Look at MLB...perfect example, where small market success is the anomaly, much like it was in the CFL less than a decade ago...a league where you have basically a 75% chance of making the playoffs (yeah, I know it is more with the cross potential)...look at the odds in MLB.

The 2 teams that benefited most from the cap IMO were the Bombers and Sask, followed by the Als and then probably Hamilton.

Thanks for responding. My GF, myself and my buddy have contacted the Stamps about this...and the response we got was "well, what do you expect us to do?" Like it was a f**king chore for them. We're all in our mid 50s and would still go to games (and take friends, and we always spent a pile of cash in town, cause we stayed in the motel village and usuallly ate at Tony's) but the experience is just not enjoyable anymore. Thanks Stampeders.

It is so true.
I had not been to a game there in a while, and forgot how bad it was. I still attend games there, but it is my least preferable stadium if it is approaching capacity. At 75%...not bad. Like I said, I have piles of friends in Calgary that wont go because of the stadium. They actually attend more games away than at home lol.

No way would I bring my kid there if it was sold out...just not going to happen. The atmosphere and actual viewing...great. The seats, well, I personally do not mind bench seating, but I understand a lot of people hate it. for me the bottom line is attempting to get to a washroom a lot of the time, especially with a kid...I figure if your kid needs to go to the bathroom 3 times in a game you are missing 12+ minutes, and that is aiming for intermissions (yes, that is also including stopping at a concession after taking them to the washroom). My kid would not want to return, and honestly, would be turned off of the game.

very unfortunate. In the great city of Calgary, this has always been surprising to me.

On topic...it seems like most agree with that 32ish number, of course varying place to place.

[quote author="depopulationINC"][quote="GernB"game.

In the great city of Calgary, this has always been surprising to me.
Exactly. This is what is so frustrating. "We're the greatest City in Canada"...

Alberta as a whole is ghetto. they will have the oldest arena in the NHL once the islanders move to Brooklyn, and are soon to have the oldest stadium in the cfl (if you assume the 30 odd million dumped into Molson made it a new stadium)
They never nationalized their oil, so this is what you get. People die every day on the highway to Ft. Mac despite the fact they have pulled 270 billion dollars out of the ground since 1995. If Alberta's oil was nationalized, their would be a bullet train from Calgary that would get to Ft. Mac in under 3 hours.
Go to a library in Alberta and they ask you for 12 dollars!!! the whole place i a joke when you consider the wealth that is extracted from their province.
People in the Middle East don't even have to work ,because they get forigners to do the work for them, and they recieve money every month from the government.
Meanwhile in alberta the citizens are the workers, while forigners are the bosses, and the citizens gloat that they don't have to pay PST....LMAO.

Hmmm... perhaps if Alberta didn't send BILLIONS and BILLIONS of dollars in transfer payments to the rest of Canada each year we would have the money to build new stadiums.

Thanks for the laugh though :lol:

Thanks...I wanted to say it...lol.

oh...and yeah...I guess some people fail to realize that Canada does have a couple modest sized oil and gas companies...you know...the wee fellows...
Suncor - a fortune 150 company
Encana - A pretty big company in itself...a bit smaller now that it split off Cenovus, and proud owner of the Bow building...worth checking out!
CNRL - a fortune 250 company
Talisman - at one time a decade or so back the largest producer on NG
Pengrowth - Buffet's hot prospect the last 6 or 8 months...hey...Buffet is generally right.
Husky - well, they are a respectable sized Canadian outfit I guess

but i guess those dinky lil outfits are non counters for some reason.
Canada has a lot of Jr players in Natural resources...more than anywhere else hands down...that has created a pile of midsized companies. You start looking at some of these nationalized giants in other places and realize that if they promoted free enterprise that they would be split into multiple companies as well. Can nationalization be more economical...you bet...but I prefer my human rights, somewhat of an effort for environmentalism, financial competition, and...well...democracy, as flawed as it is.

there are lots of Canadian outfits petroleum companies...just like there are lots of mining companies. Are they Saudi Aramco, or PetroChina , or Gazprom (tough to compete with those Nationalized ones where they basically do not allow other players into the region...no competition is a wonderful thing right...can't even compare those), or BP or Rio or BHP...or Vale...well, no, but then few are that mammoth...but Suncor is #6 for mining in the world, Cameco is the #1 Uranium producer, PCS the largest in Potash