This Year's Attendace

They must be doing fairly well, just look at the tickets sold and the price of the tickets that are sold. Most of the season tickets sold are in the Box Seats, close to $100, gold at around $77, Silver at $60, bronze $50 the cheap end zone seats are $22 but there are only a few hundred of them.

Mitchel said that they need 22,500 at an AVERAGE of $50 a ticket to break even. I think that the 15 - 17,000 season tickets must average over $60. They are also counting on another 1500 or so tickets in the Private Suites and the Club suites, they are probably going to be in the few hundred dollars per ticket. Also the "naming rights" is another source of revenue, so I think they will do okay in the new stadium.

I wouldn’t say bigger or even better, however what it offers is new revenue streams.

480 high end tickets in the 30 private boxes
700 high end tickets in the club and lounge area
400 high end tickets in the group hosting area.
22500 regular priced tickets between the goal lines.

That’s a total of 24080

1580 specialized seats at 150.00 each (cheap) is already $237000.00 revenue per game. According to the CFL itself each team should budget for a one million dollar gate per game. If this is to be the budget the team will require another $763000.00 of revenue from the other 22500 seats or on average 33.92 per ticket. Or if you use the 22500 @ 50.00 as the Ticats do, then the average becomes 40.00.

The stadium is also expandable.

Bob Young has said from day one that his goal is financial stability when he passes this team on to the next owner and the new stadium makes that possible.

Any new modern stadium would have all these fancy seats.

If that's all they needed with an additional 22,500 seats to be sustainable then why all the hullabaloo about never playing at WH, or thousands of parking spots, driveway to driveway blah,blah,blah, visibility from a highway, proximity to a highway, IWS location is why there are no naming rights...

For all the mistakes the city has made the Tiger-cats have made their fair share as well.

Sorry, but their credibility is suspect at best.

Again Captain, as a non WH stadium fan, I completely agree with what you are saying. It is so weird that WH didn't "work" when IWS does "work" for the Cats. More accessiblity at IWS site but WH had a site with more parking as it turned out and a site some influential city politicians wanted, including of course the Mayor at the time.

All I can say is there is/was so much going on underneath the covers and "whom was friends with whom" sort of thing that we just don't have all the answers. Or some very personal issues on a person-to-person basis from the big players here that we will never know.

But I'm with you on your general premise here. :thup:

Maybe I can summarize - you don't f....k with Bob Young. A very nice man, not large physically, meek looking but you just don't want to get on his wrong side if you want something from him.

And Bob doesn't care what you think about his credibility at all, or what anyone thinks. He's one tough cookie, you don't like him, that's fine in his books. This city had no idea what they were in for when Bob Young bought the Cats. They found out. And that being said, thank you Bob for coming in to save the Cats. :thup:

So Captain, are you able to keep being a Cat supporter for a team and organization that in your mind lacks credibility, if that is actually the case? :?

WAIT A guys are forgetting "THE TIMELINE".

When the deal was made to accept IWS II, it was made after the deadline had expired to have an agreement in place (the Pan-Am committee) and at a time when the other venues could not be agreed upon and accepted in order to have it ready for the PAN-AM games.

If Bob Young hadn't agreed to IVOR WYNNE II then there would have been no Pan-Am money for a new stadium ...PERIOD...AND...the money would have gone to Mississauga or Brampton who were standing there with their hands open to accept it!

I too would have liked something other than the present site (Confederation Park was my first choice) but at least we have something new being built and I for one am very pleased that Bob young and Scott Mitchell were wise enough to say "hey, it's not our first choice, but we will make it work".

As for the attendance...I think they have done well with what we had for weather and the an-field product. (Don't get me started on the coaching decisions... :roll:)

I'm sure that "down the road" as the team settles in and shows some stability in both product and attendance, that some of the "temporary seating" put in for a Grey Cup Game, will become permanent. :thup:

WAIT A MINUTE...your forgetting something else. We were all led to believe that there was no money for any new stadium anywhere, and that we could only afford to demolish and rebuild half of IWS, using the existing north half.

Funny how that changed and all of sudden and presto! -- there's all this 'new' money for a completely brand new stadium once the city agreed, thinking there was only enough for half of a stadium. I think that's the only reason the city agreed to IWS2.

This whole process stunk!

I will say I do appreciate your passion with the site that you wanted for the stadium Captain. Good on ya. :thup:

In 2005 you need to remember that they were receiving very little in TV and sponsorship revenue. The average TV audience was at 300,000 now it is more than double that. Aside from the actual raise in TV revenue to its current 1.8 million per team. sponsorship money is way up knowing that there product will be seen by many more people. via TV audience. I do not know how much the Pizza Pizza is paying for there name being pasted all over the dugouts but they got a lot of airtime with the many views of players on the sidelines.
A new stadium will come with additional season tickets. The stadium has been left with plenty of room to add additional seating in the end zone. for such overflow crowds along with areas for standing room only tickets. I could not have been more perfectly done with the Federal and Provincial government flipping the bill for the Pan Am games in hopes of gaining a summer Olympics

I'm not sure I'm getting your point. My post was in response to the OP in regards to this year's attendance.

As for increased TV ratings, I always argued that that would factor more into naming rights, and visibility by TV as opposed to a highway location in which there is no, or little, national TV coverage for your product. (ie Mosaic Stadium)

I think I covered your point. Your point was that the stadium was built too small for the TI Cats football team. That could be true but the stadium was not built for the Ti Cats and the CFL, it was built for Soccer under FIFA regulations for the Pan Am games. It was built to those speciafications which include capacity size. In a way you are right in reference to money. Money alotted to the stadium was to meet FIFA soccer regulations. After the pan AM games Hamilton and the Ti Cats will inherit that stadium. If the City of Hamilton and the Ti Cats feel that the stadium does not have enough seating capacity then it will be up to them to finance the expansion of the seating capacity. With the Ti Cats and the CFL in mind the stadium was built so that seating could be added whether it be permanent or temp or a combo of both. The end zone section was left wide open for the addition of seating. The stadium was built at no cost to the Ti cats unlike the stadium in winnipeg which the city and the Bombers are paying most of the bill so they got to build it to their specifications from the beginning. The TI Cats on the other hand where given a stadium with a smaller capacity but at no cost to them with the exception of adding seats.
A very good deal that I am sure that Winnipeg and the Bombers would have loved to have. Adding 5-10 k seats in the end zone area could be done very quickly and cost effecient

Interesting. I hope the soccer fans and community in this city do support the soccer team and appreciate what they will have here, whatever team that is, that will play out of this stadium since it is a stadium meeting those FIFA standards first and foremost as you say CFLsteve.

In theory yes, but in reality this is being built for the Tiger-Cats. Really, does anyone care about Pan Am soccer?

If you’ll recall, the original formula was for gov’t to pay for a 15,000 seat stadium for Pan Am soccer and track and field, and that the Tiger-Cats (private funding) was to finance the extra 10,000 seats required for CFL football.

So in reality this stadium is being built for the Tiger-Cats. That’s what all the fancy seats and boxes are for as well. CFL revenue streams.

exactly my point but there was only enough money aside for the 24,000 seat stadium for the Pan Am games. The rest will be up to the City of Hamilton and the Cats to expand the seating capacity. The point being they got an awesome deal in getting the soccer facility with the capacity up near 25,000 and the proper space for the stadium to be easily expanded to 30,000 or more on a permanent and/or temp basis. You can bet that plans are already in place to have temp seating nearby and able to be put in place for 5-10 k fans in a day. Depending on how ticket sales go the more seating is most likely being planned to be in place for the entire seson if Neccessary. They took what was given to them and will expand accordingly.

And they've said as much. Hope it happens.

It will definitely happen. The CFL has cornered the market on temp seating. Getting the base built with the luxury suites and modern seating was the priority. This is similar to what is being done in Regina. there is only so much now to build an open air stadium but it will be built that a roof can be added at a later time.
I would envision that the stadium should sell the max season tickets available with the rest of the seats sold out before the season starts. Having seats in the end zone in place for extra tickets to be sold as the season goes on.

I hope they do care about the Pan Am soccer, it would be a black eye for Hamilton if they built the stadium and hosted it and no one showed up.
When you say "government paid for a 15,000 seat stadium" don't you mean "us taxpayers"? :lol:

As for expandable, someone can correct me if I'm wrong but it was my understanding that because of the building code that they can only put in temporary seats for special events such as the Grey Cup.
Temporary end zone seats can not be added to the stadium permanently, is a non-starter for that area.

For someone who has been so "in tune" with what has transpired with the "stadium talks", you are a little off-base on this statement. It all started out as a NEW STADIUM TALK. the thought of a re-fit of Ivor Wynne came along half way through the "debacle" and the participants at one time thought that with the money they had they could just do the South side and some cosmetic on the North side.

Then, they found that it was just as cost-effective to replace it all.

Perhaps this discussion should be moved back to the "New Stadium Thread", where all the "FACTS ARE THERE".

Either way, I don't really care, we are getting a new stadium, the sun will come up tomorrow and the Ticats will play on. :wink:

Arguing about something we have no control over is a waste of time. Lets move on...nothing to see here...we will get people to fill the seats that they provide. Hopefully they need to add more seats sooner than later. :thup:

For the record..

Well said woody however I will add that I myself can be accused of, according to my wife and others as well, of having an obsessive-complusive personality trait on some issues (not sure I have the 'disorder' form :wink: ). If Captain does have this trait as well on this issue, it is not something easy to just deal with, believe me, I know. :?

I don't believe the Building Code has requirements that appreciably differ depending on whether we're talking about temporary or permanent seating; particularly as it relates to occupant loads and exiting.

What a shame it would be if they designed and built something like this and not do it in such a way that it provides the opportunity to permanently expand the seating capacity if the powers that be so chose.

I haven't seen the RFP's performance specs so I can only rely on what Scott Mitchell was quoted in the local media as saying which basically was along the lines that even though they would open the facility with 22,500 seats, they could always add more seats in the future.

When I read that, I took that to infer permanent seats.

For sure kicker, that would be a shame as you say if that happened. Along the lines of MLSE having BMO Stadium concreted at the one end making it very difficult and costly to make the field able to accomodate Canadian football.

Surely though they won't make such a mistake here with the seating for IWS2. :?