Of course a Canadian QB should count as a NAT for ratio purposes, why not, they are CDN.
The only drawback I can foresee is both Brandon Bridge and Andrew Buckley would get huge raises on their next contracts.
Brandon Bridge "They should only call me a Canadian QB if I count against the ratio. Otherwise I should just be called a quarterback."
"At the end of the day I don't get to represent my own flag. I'm already seen as an American on the roster sheet and I actually think it would open up a lot of doors and would be great for teams if a starting Canadian QB could open up another roster spot for an American somewhere else. But as it is now, I'm not considered a Canadian."
Definitely should count in the team roster as a Canadian. But to avoid the need to have a second (and third) Canadian quarterback to backup a Canadian starter, quarterbacks should remain excluded from the designated international list. Basically, if you have a Canadian QB, that counts as one of the 21 Canadians required on the roster, and it would give the team an extra designated international.
But I would limit it to the first and second string quarterback. Otherwise teams would just grab any Canadian and have him stand on the sidelines with a clipboard in order to get another American on the roster..
On the other hand, allowing the Canadian QB to be the third-stringer and count toward the ratio might work toward satisfying both those who want to see more Canadian QBs and those who want to see fewer mandated Canadian starters.
The reality is that having the QBs as noncounters improves the odds of a Canadian QB getting a spot...I am all for it counting as a ratio spot but more changes to the ratio rules would be required. I think an SMS break or perhaps making a Canadian QB rostered a free spot would go further.
Remember...if you START a Canadian QB and they are a ratio player that if you replace them with an import that you would then need to pull another international starter off of O and insert a national...Unless you were +1 for ratio on O
I don't understand all the minute details of the ratio rules so I'm not sure if the answer to the OPs question is as simple as yes or no, however I do think they need to take a look at the rules and tweak them to encourage teams to roster and develop more Canadian QBs because clearly the current rules are not working.
Giving teams an extra designated international when they dress a national QB could be enough. But I like your idea of the SMS break, especially as a national QB would probably end up being paid a premium like other nationals. Another possibility would be not including them in the entire roster count at all, allowing teams to dress 45 players if one of them is a national QB.
That was the reason they were excluded in the first place. I'm thinking they could be added to the team roster counts, while still excluded from the starter count. It would just take an amendment to the designated internationals rule. International quarterbacks would not need to be listed as designated internationals, allowing them to be substituted freely (only one on the field at a time, same as today), but for every national QB on the roster, a team would get an additional designated international.
And the key word here is "encourage". Provide some benefit for teams that use Canadian QBs, but don't force them to do it. While I do support a quota for number of Canadians in the game, both on the roster and on the field of play, I don't think any position should have a mandated minimum number of Canadians filling it. Teams should be free to choose where to use those Canadians.
But not enough incentive to keep and develop them and that's the problem. Every sport has a position that takes time to develop and with football it's QB. Teams need to have a willingness to take the time to develop Canadian QBs.
Some good ideas so far. I think whatever is done they would need to exclude them from the starting numbers or the situation would just get worse. Right now if you're a Canadian QB and want a shot at the CFL you become a receiver.
Count me one as well like moses that doesn't understand all the finite complexities and details of the ratio rule but whatever ends up being the situation, I'd like it win-win meaning there exists more opportunities for Canadians to play qb in the league and be given a true shot and as well provide more flexibility for teams to play around and not have to worry about the details and complexities of the ratio rule because a Canadian is playing qb.
I want Canadians to be important in the CFL and a meaningful draft but not to the point that it becomes ridculous with teams having to scramble big time have way through the season because of injuries to Canadians and not enough Canadians available and end up pulling someone from working at another job who hasn't kept himself in shape enough. That just makes for less talent and the league suffers as a consequence. This is where the haters of the CFL have a point when it becomes ridiculous trying to find enough Canadians available. I totally get that.
It's great seeing a Canadian at qb but really no one cares if their team has all Americans at qb and they are a winning team.
Actually, they do not count as dressed national players. From the 2014 CFLPA CBA:
During each season, there shall not be more than twenty (20) International Players, which shall include four (4) designated International Players and which shall exclude quarterbacks on the Active Roster of each Member Club for regular season, playoff and Grey Cup games.
[E]ach Member Club shall ... establish its active Roster at:
(a) a maximum of 44 Players, including 3 Players who shall be identified as quarterbacks and 41 other Players, of whom not more than 20 may be Internationals, or
(b) a minimum of 43 Players, including two Players who shall be identified as quarterbacks and 41 other Players, of whom not more than 20 may be Internationals.
But you are correct that there is no benefit currently in dressing a Canadian quarterback. What some of us are proposing is that the quarterbacks would be included in the team roster quotas. What I am proposing is that teams that do use one would end up with a fifth designated international.
Haters? So that make me a hater then I guess. The topic of ratio has already been discussed over and over. There are many fans like myself that enjoy this league as much as any person that think the ratio is nonsense. While I am not here to start up that argument I simply want to make that point. Far as the OP goes the idea is a no-brainer, as long as we have to continue dealing with the ratio any canadian on the roster should be a national player.
Haters is the incorrect word. Rather I should say those that criticize the CFL in this aspect while still being able to be a fan. Haters just don't like the CFL, period, because it isn't the NFL. Fair enough ray.
Agree, a Canadian on the roster is a national player, no exceptions at all just because of the position a player plays.
Good point. While most "CFL haters" will claim that the ratio is one of the reason they don't like the CFL, the rest of the people who dislike the ratio, such as yourself,actually do so because they love the league and the Canadian game, and want it to be even better. While I don't agree with their stance on the ratio, I do appreciate their commitment to the league.
Let's assume most teams will still start an American QB. So increase the number of International players from 16 to 17 to accommodate a starting International QB. The two International backup QB's would then become Designated Internationals. So increase the number of DI's from 4 to 6 to accommodate the 2 backup import QB's.
So far so good, the ratio would be exactly the same as is currently used (with the 3 QB positions replaced by 1 Import starter and 2 DI's).
If a team employs a backup Canadian QB, that increases the number of remaining DI's available from 4 to 5. (Teams which employ 2 National backup QB's would have 6 DI's available in other positions).
If a team employs a starting Canadian QB, they get rewarded with an extra import starter in another position (with 17 International starters and 7 National starters including the QB).
Yes, if the starting Canadian QB is pulled or injured, and is replaced with an Import QB, then an Import starter must be removed in another position and replaced with a National. But since the number of starting imports has been increased by 1 (from 16 to 17), the ratio in that scenario would be the same as is currently used (with 16 import starters plus 1 import QB starter.)
So this way teams are not penalized in any way by starting a National QB. If he gets pulled for an import QB, it's only fair the number import starters in other positions is reduced by 1.
Not bad, although I need to let I sink in a bit. This is similar to what it was like in the '60s, and at that time, teams were complaining that they were being penalized for starting a Canadian QB. Of course, they only had two DI spots, not six as in your proposal, so it might not be as serious an issue now.
Just want to think if there's a way to abuse the rule to get an extra international into the game somehow. Because if there's a loophole in the rules, you know some coaches (cough O'Shea, C. Jones cough) will find it and use it.
Some might say that if a Canadian qb is good enough, forgetting any discussion about bias and being given a proper chance by mainly American coaches in the league, they will get their chance, with the way the system is now. I don't know. :-\