Riders sign DE Devon Hicks

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After reading additional info on the net about him, i think this could be a very good signing, guess only training camp will tell.

I guess this means the young gun from TO isn't the next greatest thing since sliced bread and is able to replace Perry.

Mike please explain your logic. If Hicks is good that means Flemmons is not? The Riders traded for Cates. But they signed Griffin the running back from Oklahoma this winter. Are Miller and Tillman saying this now? Signing Griffin means Cates is not that good. That would be same logic as signing Hicks means Flemmons is not that good.

Riders sign good player or may have. Mike says that means Flemmons isnt best thing since sliced bread. How can anyone say this? Mike is negative.

Austinpowers, you were the one trying to defend getting nothing for Joseph…oh wait we didn’t get nothing we got Flemmons and some other guy. And it was we need Flemmons and he should be great and can step in and replace Perry.

Well what happened we go out and find another DE, because they aren’t all that sure of Flemmons can fill Perry’s shoes. Am I surprised at this move no. Was my not thinking Flemmons was that great being negative no…was my pointing out that they brought in another DE being negative no.

In terms of Griffin and the other guy they recently signed, I would be very surprised one if they are given a real shot to unseat Cates. I suspect the two of them were brought in to replace Holmes. With Holmes gone, the riders don’t have return specialist. Both Griffin and the other guy have significant experience at it.

Give me a break Mike. They went out and got another DE. Big freaking deal. That really has no reference on whether Flemons is good or not. Maybe It has more to say about John Chick???
Its called signing players for Training Camp. If they work out, great, they don't, oh well.
It doesn't mean they don't think Flemons can fill in, Its saying they are making sure he can by bringing in Competition. Or sorry do you want Tillman and Miller to Anoint players as there starters and then not bring anyone in to challenge them.

They signed 3 wr's just now too.

Tillman must really be having monster doubts about the big contract he gave Dominguez.

Well Flemmons can play both DE and DT so we will see where he ends up. And as others have pointed out, this is what football teams do, they bring in players to compete for positions at training camp.

Mike, you continue to confuse me, in this thread you seem to suggest that bringing another player in to compete is some sort of surrender and yet in another it is what a team should do:

Bring another young quarterback. If you need to make a change, it is better having more competition. Someone with experience would help on the depth chart. And if he beats out some young guy who is one of the so called stars to be, then it is to bad for that star to be.

Well, to be fair, it was his OTHER personality thay posted that one. The two often do not see eye to eye.

There are a couple of posters here who will find fault in every single signing or trade the current 'rider management will make, so take their criticism with a grain of salt.

My original comment in this thread was pointed at the cool aid drinkers. I think we all know who you are. You know the ones that said, Flemons is the next great DE for the riders. He will be greater then Perry. We didn't get robbed in the Joseph trade, we addressed the need with a player who can start.

You guys seem to think I am against this signing, I am not. In fact, I think this signing demonstrated my point that we traded Joseph for almost nothing.

It demonstrates 1 point. You always see negative. Just like Oxbow said. All negative since Shivers left. Hicks may be good player. He may be bad. He may be great. But how does he have anything to do with Flemmons?

Almost nothing in trade? What makes you smarter than Miller and Tillman? Miller coached Flemmons in Toronto. But Mike knows more than our coach. Tillman thinks January is good tackle. But Mike knows more than our gm. The draft hasnt even come. But Mike knows player Riders will draft with Argos number 1 pick is almost nothing.

Almost nothing Mike? Thats what you know compared to our coach. And our gm. I didnt like the Joseph trade. Said it 100 times on here. Why? Because I dont like trading Joseph. But I will say this. Im not so cocky to think I know everything about January and Flemmons. How good they are compared to our coaches and our gm. Or about the Riders draft before they even have the draft.

Austinpowers I suggest you go drink your cool aid. The sarcastic comment was directed at people like you. Lets start by looking at comments

Both happen to be defensive ends. Mr Flemons as you have quoted is the could be next the rising star. So if he is the next rising star why bring in Hicks, unless you aren't 100% sure.

What has shivers got to do with this thread nothing. I suggest that you forget about hating shivers and go back and drink some more cool aid.

See the first point...here again you have implied the Flemons is really good. Well if he is that good why bring in someone to challenge him. January is 1 of 10 offensive lineman we have under contract, we will see if he starts and plays.

By the way, it isn't Toronto's 1st pick,it is Toronto's second round pick.

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Just to add to the draft pick issue, how many has Tillman traded away in the last year. He if he valued them as much as you imply because you can get good talent, then he wouldn't have traded them. However, maybe he is a little more realistic in believing the draft is a crap shoot. You don't know what you are going to get.

See above oh by the way of the 4 years in the draft the riders have 9 of 24 on the roster. The banner year appears to by 2006 where we still have 4 of 7 players drafted. But normally we average 1 or 2 per year.

I guess we can count on the draft pick as a definite starter.

So the riders traded away MOP Quarterback for two player who may make the team and who may be able to start and unknown draft pick.

I think we have 3 or 4 DEs under contract now. And they will come to camp and compete for Perry's job. And for Chick's job. That is how it works. Competition is the nature of the beast, and nobody is ever guaranteed a job in football. However, I believe the point Mike was making, like it or not, is why trade your MVP QB to get a DE when obviously, that same knowledgable GM thinks the other guys he has signed will be able to compete for the job. So they think Flemons can play. Great. Do they not also think Hicks can play? Or why bring him in? So maybe if Hicks can play, we could have had BOTH KJ and Hicks....?
The point is, we don't know if either Flemons or Hicks can play. So the KJ trade was a crap shoot--plain and simple. Because the same can be said about January. And even a 1st round pick. We gave up known, quantifiable talent to obtain unknown, largely unquantifiable prospects. It is done all the time in pro sports , and it almost never works...(although I believe this is the first time in history that the defending champs have traded the defending MVP)

Anyway, back to Hicks.
Looks like a decent prospect to me. As we have a glaring weakness on the D-line this year, I hope we sign a couple more guys and may the best man win the job.

Oh and I love the receivers we signed!! Positive enough for you Austin?
Yah gotta love those names-- DaVon Fowlkes, Roosevelt Kiser and Princeton Shepherd.
2 midgets and a giant!

Hey Arius and one of the WR can play quarterback to.....but lets not go there as Austin will tell us we are being negative.

It's the giant that was the QB? 6'5".
Might make for some interesting trickery if he can crack the starting roster...lateral to Shepherd, the throw to a wide open Durant...Touchdown....

But seriously, I am much more excited over these types of signings than when we announce an old NFL cast-off looking for his last chance to play....

Like Airus, I am not too excited about an older NFL cast-off being signed. Many who try out up here in the North, are either under achievers or problems or both. Sometimes they are a little too small for NFL game like many of the CFL's better linebackers and defensive backs, but generally they were disappointments down south.

For example, Brandon Lynch and Kyle Mitchell will get another shot at making the team this year. I like both of them. They are fast, versatile, undersized younger players. Lynch is a little small for linebacker (he will compete with Sean Lucas), but as we all know, one of the 3 linebackers on the defence is generally a glorified defensive back. Mitchell is very small for a lineman but he is fast and versatile (he will compete with Kitwana Jones I think). I am more excited about these two getting another shot at making the team full time rather than some NFL cast-off.

I like the signing of younger players who are having their first (or sometimes second) shot at making it at pro-ball. They generally will have less of those nasty habits that coaches need to break them of.

Glaring weakness? Says who? We lost 1 player. Fred Perry. Our head coach likes Flemmons. And he coached him. But Arius doesnt know Flemmons so we have a glaring weakness. Maybe Miller knows more about him than you. More than me. More than Tillman. Since Miller coached Flemmons why not trust him? Glad our gm listens to his coaches not you and Mike. Tell me this Arius. How much did we know about Chick last year? And where are all the people from last year? The people who said this. We have a glaring weakness on the d-line because we lost Nate Davis.

Maybe we should do this. Let Flemmons play. And January. And Jyles to. Before we decide they arent good players. Or bad trades. I didnt like trading Joseph. But it would be arogant of me to think this. Flemmons and January arent good enough. That I am smarter than gm and head coach. Miller coached Flemmons. Tillman scouted January for sure. Ive never watched Flemmons or January practice. Or play really. How about you and Mike? But you know better than our coach and gm?

We will know more by Labour Day. Maybe I will change my mind about Joseph trade. Maybe not. But I want to see them play 1st.

Austin I am having a hard time understanding your position. We traded an all star in Fred Perry and got a back up quarterback in return.

We traded away MOP QB got a back up DE in return and injury replacement player in January and oh yes a 2nd round draft pick.

So for our all star DE we get a back up. The strategy is replace him with a back up player and/or someone new brought into camp. But lets don't say we might be weaker at DE because Miller and Tillman haven't said we are weark. BTW you kept saying Miller coached him in Toronto....Miller was coaching offense not defence there...although he would know about him he was likely busy looking after his own players.

We traded a MOP QB away, and in return we are going with a QB who has been a back up for the past 4 years (was happy to renew his contract as a back up) and three unproven quarterback. But because Miller or Tillman don't say look we will be weaker, but say well you know Marcus could have started last season and it is time to see if the young guys can play, you think we are not weaker at quarterback.

The facts are we traded away two all stars and never got 1 legitmate starter (non-injury starter) out of two trades.

I don't think either Arius or myself believe 100% these new additions to the team are dudes and can't play. But we aren't annoiting these players even being close to the calibre of players they will be replacing like some of the rider fans are doing.

It is very simple. Tillman and Miller will not come out and say, look going with Crandell this year is a risk on two fronts, one we don't know if he is as good as Joseph and two our lack of experince at backup is a concern. No they will come out and say...Marcus almost one the starting job and two with the age of our existing quarterbacks we need to look to the future.