Or, if not b4 the season, it should have been after this last one, but definately not in the middle, and after a win, no less...
I really dont think that it mattered much if the Riders won or lost that game, Shivers was done regardless... we can sit here an debate on how good/bad Shivers was, but its Eric Tillman's turn on the hot seat. The Shivers era is now history , so why not focus on the upcoming season and see if Tillman can actually give us what we really want-- A winning record, a home playoff game and a Grey Cup within the next 3 seasons.
how did he get Joseph to take that huge paycut?
Eric Tillman--> "Kerry, we need you to take a pay cut, or we will release you..."
I doubt it was liek that exactly but im willing to assume that was more or less the situation...
well Tillman is making alot of moves so far, and its lookin positive and if u get Clermont 8) boy oh boy :rockin:
"boy oh boy"?? Carm makin' an appearance online now?
I am sorry but I think Hopson needs defending here. First off, yes He is big and fat. so what, what does that have to do with his job performance or qualifications for the job. Or sorry are we still in grade 7?
As for his qualifications, i will speak a bit on it. First off he was a former player and was a member of the board of goveners as well.. So I think its easy to say that he wants the Riders to succeed and that they are his team.
When he was hired he was the Director of Education in Lumbsden. This job isn't the easist of jobs as you have to deal with all facets f the education system. BAsically you are the general manager of the education district.
Also when I see him on TV it seems he is composed, he speaks clearly and intelligently.
In my opinion he was and is qualified for the job.
Now as for his perfomance over the 3 years he has held the post.
Things that he has had a hand in doing include, deals with sasktel to get the jumbotron and other cross promotions (im sure you all saw the adds). MAjor renos to the stadium for the store, offices, and dressing rooms. New turf (coming this year). The deal with Mosaik (although it sucks it not called Taylor field) has brought a lot of money into the orghanization. other things were done but i am drawing a blank right now.
As for Shivers. Shivers was doing absolutely nothing, and I mean nothing, during the season. He was not trying to resign players, not trying to scout players, not trying to make the team better. He was sitting on his ass in Las Vegas. Was it too much to ask of him to come to work?? I mean he was getting paid for doing nothing. What did you expect Hopson to do. He wants the team to win, so he found a replacement. The fact that they won that game meant nothing. The guy had turned into a cancer. I think Hopson did a great job in firing Shivers. I think it was shivers that made it into a fiasco because he didn't just leave, instead he went crying like a little kid who doesn't want to share his toys. Shivers cared about only one thing and that was himself. Don't get me wrong Shivers did a lot of great things for this team, but in the end he was not helping the team.
Returning to Hopson, there are things that they are doing to make this team a succesful business as well as a succesful football team. They are getting rid of the old guard on the board that basically ran the team to the ground. There is a reason why our team has sucked so much, complacency and bad management. That is being changed. idiots like the guy who phoned in at halftime (name escapes me right now) and called shiv racist and all that crap. People like that are no longer being tolerated in the organization. The old boys club is hopefully going to be no more, and hopson is a big reason that is gonna happen.
I could continue but whatever.
Also I would like it to be known that I haven't agreed with every thing he has done, for example the closing of the university section. I understand the decision but that doesn't mean i agree with it.
But I would much rather have the current situation then the crap we had a while back with Al Ford and the old boys club who treated the Riders like their personal country club
I am sorry but I think Hopson needs defending here. First off, yes He is big and fat. so what, what does that have to do with his job performance or qualifications for the job. Or sorry are we still in grade 7?
Im in grade7 :lol:
Not a very good job of defending Hopson.
Most of the things you mention that he supposedly did, were all things brought on stream under Roy's watch, but only coincidently came to fruition after Hopson got his job. Things like the jumbo-tron, renos to the stadium and new turf were all in the works BEFORE Hopson was hired.
So he was a former player? First, he is a member of your "old boys club" that you diss so vigourously.
It was the old boys club that hired him and supports him. There has been no turn over on the board of directors during his 3 years beyond the normal.
And the primary reason Roy was fired, as well as others in the organization, was so Hopson could bring in his friends and his cronies and consolidate his power.
He was the Director of the school distict which includes Lumsden.
But that begs the question, how is being a high school teacher and career buracrat, who had nothing to do with football for 30 years, qualified to step into the role as CEO of a pro football team? Two years as a marginal o-lineman, 30 years ago?
He claims to be a businessman. He has never been a business man. He is an administrator. Which I suppose is indeed part of his current job. But I would have liked to see a real business person with a real football background in that position.
Hiring Hopson was exactly the kind of cronyism you apparently dislike.
As for his TV persona, well of course he sounds wonderful on camera. He's just a big teddy bear, right? I continually hear a much different story about him from people who have worked with him in the teaching profession, etc., and now with the Riders.
And they don't have a very high opinion of him.
Now I don't doubt not everyone shares that opinion, but I believe where there is smoke, there is fire.
Let's examine the BS story he put out about the Shiver's firing.
Reasons given were that Roy was going to retire, he wasn't signing players, etc. Basically, he was fired for being a "lameduck".
Well, first, who made him a lameduck in the first place? Hopson. Though interestingly enough, when asked about that, he says he played no role in retaining Roy/Danny for the final year on the contract as it represented the appearance, at least, of being a conflict of interest.
Yet several months later, he claims he was fully involved in the decision to fire Roy midseason? Either it was a conflict of interest or it wasn't. That did not change in 6 months. So he was either wrong or lying about one of those scenarios.
On to player signings.
All those "free agents, right? There were not more than in a normal year, and historically, Roy has been very good at signing his own free agents.
The best 3 players on that list remain unsigned, so I do not believe Tillman has done a better job than I expect Roy would have. Certainly there was nothing in the 7 years Roy was here to expect he would have failed.
Dealing with the new cap was a big reason given.
Again, Roy was not even given an opportunity to adjust to the cap, so saying you fired him on that basis is saying you fired him based on an assumption he might fail, not any actual lack of performance.
Tillman's only accomplishments thus far are to cut good players that are "Shivers guys" and bring in players who are "Tillman guys. Of course we knew that would occur, but that has 0 to do with why Roy was fired.
In fact, so far, the turnover of players has been smaller than I expected, so I guess the fact that Tillman "resigned" most of Roy's guys is proof that Roy was doing his job--finding talent. Which of course was exactly what Roy was doing immediately before the firing. He was not sitting on his ass in Vegas, but had just finished a two week tour of NFL training camps. But yes, Roy spent lots of time in Vegas. Might be because that is where his wife lives, I don't know. But it never affected his job before, why now?
Another issue that was brought up was Roy says he didn't like or trust Hopson. Hopson expressed publically that was news to him.
Three things. First, it appears that he was correct not to trust him. Second, if you know Roy at all, you would find it hard to imagine that Hopson could be clueless of that situation. Third, the word on the street was that Hopson did in fact know that he and Roy were at odds.
Now the interesting thing here is, THAT would have been a justifiable reason to fire Roy. It still would have been a mistake to fire him midseason, but....
Yet of all the bogus reasons given to fire him, Hopson denies the one real (and likely predominant) reason for dismissing him.
Because as you say, hopson always sounds like such a nice, reasonable guy on TV, and admitting he couldn't work with Roy would tarnish that "butter won't melt in my mouth" image.
Which brings us to another issue. The "code of conduct". My god, listening to him rattle on about the "code" just makes me want to spit. The way the University section was dealt with is just a part of the greater issue. Now something needed to be done, but when someone starts running the show based on their ethics, and moral beliefs, it becomes a problem. And while the "code" is still a work in progress, if it resembles what Hopson says, it will be silly/stupid/dangerous. Now maybe the BoD will show some common sense, but one wonders why it has taken so long?
On to Mosaic. You'll get 0 concessions on that issue from me.
I think that decision was 100% a mistake, and I blame, not congratulate Hopson for it.
The small pitance we are being paid for the right to trample on 100 years of tradition and a longstanding community tradition of naming our streets, buildings, institutions after community leaders, is hardly worth it. In real dollars, the ticket increases this year alone far outstrip the $s Mosaic is forking over, so maybe as the fans are contributing 97% of the stadium revenue, we could have been at minimum consulted.
Given that Hopson publically stated that if one of Piffle's relatives had said no to the Mosaic deal, he would not have gone forward.
Well I have a few questions in that regard.
First, was anyone given an opportunity to voice a contrary opinion on the matter--either at City Hall or to Piffle's grandkids? The answer is a definitive NO. The announcement of the name change was made on a Friday. The Council only voted on it the following Monday.
Democracy in action. And no one but Jim Hopson got to talk to the relatives before hand. If you only hear oneside of an issue....?
But I have a more burning question.
Do you or anyone actually believe that if one of Piffles grandkids had vetoed this thing, Hopson was really going to nix a project he began working on nearly the day he was hired and spent 2 years on?
I don't believe that. In a direct email to Jim Hopson asking him that question, he did not even bother to respond. Yet he claims he always responds...
If one person could veto the deal, why not at least ask the fans, the season ticket holders, who supposedly are the real masters/owners of the club?
I bet when Mosaic changed their own name 2 years ago they had greater input than that...
Anyway, to sum up (an already far too long rant), even if everything Hopson said about his reasons to fire Roy were 100% true, it does not in anyway affect the reality that it was poorly handled and not the way class organizations do things.
The fact that I actually doubt the veracity of nearly every point Hopson made in justifying the decision should be besides the point.
When you realize the only two things of significance Hopson has done in 3 years is rename Taylor Field and fire Roy, it is awfully tough to change my opinion that he is not qualified for the job.
And as I knew him 30 years ago, I will also stand by the belief that the guy is not real smart....
nice novel bro! lol
Wow Arius, quite the rant. The way you praise Roy you would think your boyfriend there had delivered 7 straight grey cups to Riderville. You are entitled to your opinion and a lot of stuff is not in question, but to waist that many words praising a guy who brought us up to mediocre, I mean come on. And everyone is so hard on Tillman and Austin. They haven't lost us anything yet. Maybe in a year, and we are in the same position we can then tally the score on them, but for now, give them a chance. At least Tillman and Austin have some grey cups under their belt, whereas Shivers and Barret, 7 years of mediocrity and dissapointments and missed opportunities. I think we have all waisted enough time and words on those losers. Move on!
Very little praise for Roy, but lot's of negatives about Hopson. I suggest you re-read the rant!
I do however find it most interesting and quite humourous that people are so concerned that I am a Roy Shivers fan.
However: FACT: Roy Shivers did a good job.
Fact: Even GMs who do lousy jobs are rarely ever released midseason. I can't actually think of an example at the moment.
Fact: Roy was a lameduck GM BECAUSE the BoD/Hopson made him one, so then firing him because he was a lame duck is the height of hypocrisy and a poor business decision. Two wrongs do not make a right, even in the CFL.
I am not attacking either Austin or Tillman. They will be given every opportunity to perform. Do I think Austin was the best pick? No. But I am hardly hoping for him to fail. I just question his qualifications. But any of several people are capable of winning. Coaches are in many ways a dime a dozen.
I give ET a solid C because he is doing reasonably well, but a higher mark cannot be given until we see the results. My only concern at the moment is that we are becoming "Ottawa West", which of course was completely predictable, but I hope everyone realizes that all those Ottawa players made for a lousy team in the capital...
But I more or less like the Smith/Butler trade, you can never have too many Canadian o-lineman, so the latest signing was good, the new receiver (name escapes me) showed flashes of brilliance in Hamilton, so I like that move more than the DJ Flick deal.
I wish ET could sign Richardson, Morgan and Bush, but I am realistic. I doubt that the cap is a factor anymore, but all of those guys are "Shivers guys" and so ET may not be as motivated to resign them as I might like, but the reverse is true--they may not want to return now that Danny and Roy are gone.
Richardson definately was interested in going south, and would likely have done that regardless.
Plus we all know(or I think we know) that Richardson isn't a "good person", ie., he is a "bad boy" by the standards that Hopson wants to implement in his much touted "code".
Just to put a finer point on that issue, the "code" became an issue after Trevis Smith was arrested.
Interestingly enough, no "code" can ever prevent what was a tragic situation for Trevis and those involved.
Hopson just proves how goofy he is whenever he discusses the issue.
But I digress.
The reason I talk about Roy is primarily because while failing to take us to the next level, he did raise the bar significantly.
After Ford, fans in Riderville were numb to possible success. It was accepted by many that crawling into the play-offs was good enough.
Just occasionly getting to the Grey Cup was good enough. Roy did not accept that. I never accepted that.
The fans should never accept that.
And now that the Tillman regime has begun, I merely expect exactly the same thing as I expected from Roy and Danny. A home play-off game is the number one priority, and then we win the cup. Period.
Anything less and I will call for someones head.
Just like I did with Roy and Danny.
Just a novella this time, JM!
Just quickly pointing out that Tillman has 2 Grey Cup rings, (one of which was a gift in TO, as he took over as GM of the defending champs), while Roy has 3.
I did notice some of the Regina media were focused on the Tillman rings--Mitchell Blair for example. Conveniantly ignoring Roy's success.
But then Mitchel ain't to bright and he absolutely hates Shivers for some reason.
Good grief Arius....I love fiction but when fiction crosses over to reality it's called Delusional, I relly hope you're a mighty fine spin doctor and not in a straitjacket typeing with your toes....Just a quick comment, Billy-soups terrific unbiased post replying to your slander of Mr.Hopsons character makes me proud to be Green. That being said..... What Bar are you refering to? An overall 52-64, a puppet HC, a roster full of disfunctional untouchables, putting it simply, ET deserves EQUAL tenure on all fronts, for it's too early in this game for prejudices.......GO RIDERS
Slander means saying something that is untrue AND harmful to ones reputation.
Feel free to actually point out the untruths. Then once you do that, we can discuss the damage to reputation.
I'll give you an example of something not true from Billy's "unbiased" review:
As for Shivers. Shivers was doing absolutely nothing, and I mean nothing, during the season. He was not trying to resign players, not trying to scout players, not trying to make the team better. He was sitting on his ass in Las Vegas.As I point out in my "delusional" rant, Shivers was in fact away scouting at NFL camps even as the BoD/Hopson made the decision to fire him. I do not believe even one word of that statement has any basis in fact. So you tell me? What Billy said was clearly untrue, but was it slander?
And let's not forget, I am entitled to my opinion. I just so happen to have a lot of facts to support me.
So let's talk about that bar.
We can make this real simple.
What does the Tillman/Austin regime need to do to get over that bar? Apparantly you feel the bar isn't very high.
I'll wait for your response.
So basically Hopson is to blame Arius??? Is that what you have been getting at in all your posts, cause I am not sure, it took me a few reads. Did Hopson tell McCallum to miss the field goal in 2004? Did Hopson tell his players to lose 64 games and only win 52? Did Hopson convince the O-line to take umpteen many procedure calls at the '06 western final??? The way you put down anyone who doesn't share your dislike for how things are run, I just fail to see how that helps. We all want the same thing, and screeming at wind just isn't the way to get it!
By the way slander is spoken, libel is malicious defaming of a living person through a publication. I doubt this little forum qualifies.
Thanks for the definitions. I would never have figured them out on my own.
Hopson has a job to do.
I don't believe he is doing a very good job.
Roy Shivers had a job to do, and I have stated any number of times that I believe he should have been fired at the end of 2005.
Danny Barret had a job to do.
I have been of the belief he was hanging by a thread since 2004, at which time I would strongly have considered replacing him.
And certainly after 2005.
But retaining both those individuals on a one year contract was irresponsible. And that is the fault of Hopson and the BoD. And firing Roy midseason is the fault of Jim Hopson, and if you take him at his word, it was totally his decision. And that was a worse decision than the former.
And renaming Taylor Field was completely a Jim Hopson initiative, but no doubt supported by the BoD.
And I have barely scratched the surface of why that decision is totally misguided.
Hopson IS responsible for these things.
Now, show me where I say that Jim Hopson missed any fieldgoals?
Of course running with that line of argument, how many tackles have Roy or Danny missed? Field goals?
Did Roy have any procedure calls against him?
Then why was he fired?
If you don't like Roy as a person, fair enough.
I don't much care. If you try to claim that he did not do his job, you are mistaken.
And I repeat--but apparently I am indeed screaming at the wind--I am not attacking Tillman, or Austin. In fact I repeatedly give them a good grade.
They were not my first picks for those jobs, but while Roy was in his day, I questioned Danny Barret on the exact same grounds as I question Austin.
But Austin has even less experience as a coach, and frankly, in a rebuilding project, a fresh face, rookie coach might be a great idea, but I expect this team to win and win now based on the talent and so I expect that Austin's learning curve will need to be steep. Which I might add, is my point, so you need not struggle to find my deeper meaning anymore.
Tillman and Austin have inherited a team that is poised to win. And so they should not be given 7 years to tinker. They have 3. I'll assess the job each year just like everyone else, but my crystal ball says, if we do not finish first AND win a cup in those 3 years, I will be asking for someones head.
To put it more bluntly, I expect the team to get better because of the change.
And better means....?
Anyway, I am most certainly not blaming Hopson or praising Hopson for the onfield product as he theoretically has nothing to do with it--which of course is a good thing.
i personally didn't think danny or roy were terrible, but i liked the firing of roy mid-season(now anyways). we all new he was gone at the end of the year and we made a push to get tillman in asap so he could start righting the ship. i think he was able to evaluate our current situation immediatly and get to work on getting us under the cap. i give tillman a c+ so far and if he can get either bush or morgan back(prefferably morgan) that grade shoots up to a B+!!
I think firing Roy when they did was the most stupid thing I have ever seen...