recession and the CFL

I know this is off topic…well kind of…because i think it relates to what could happen to the CFL in general if things get really bad.

Im sure you all been hearing in the news about a possible recession in Canada this year if things get really bad like how they are in the US.

I live in Oshawa and i see the impact that the auto industry and GM in particular is having on the economy in Durham Region. Thousands of people have lost there jobs…good paying jobs and the economy is taking a beating for it. The housing prices are really expensive and noone can afford the average house price of 250,000 plus. Even apartments dont fair any better.850-950.00 for a 2 bedroom apartment. 700 plus for a 1 bedroom. Who can afford prices like that when those so called 20/hr jobs dont really exist anymore?? A lot of the big companies are hiring employment agencies to recruit staff for there companies and paying them 12.00/hr tops. I know how it is because im in teh same vote, trying to make it on low wages and paying high rent costs.

Hamilton doesnt fair any better either. My dad who is 58 years old, just short of retirment, is a general machinist and his company folded and moved to poland. He got a little bit of money from his company but not enough to live on. A lot of places wont even hire him because they keep telling him he is too old. Even if he does get another job it sure wont pay him the 23.00/hr like he used to get…those days are long gone. With property taxes going up and everything in the cost of living going up i have to admit im scared for my dad and wondering what hes going to do to make ends meet. A guy who has been paying taxes since he was 16 years old and who has been working all his life shouldnt have to worry about being a year or two short of retirement. The government should help out people like my father but instead they throw him to the curb…DONT YOU JUST LOVE THE CANADIAN GOVERNMENT??

Now your probably asking yourself, waht does this have to do with the CFL…well in a way it does.

The thing is, with people making less money and the economy starting to fall apart and with gas prices possibly going up to 1.40/Litre this summer, there is less spending money to pay for things like tiger cat tickets to watch a game. It makes things worse when we dont even have a winning season year in and year out and the ticket prices keep going up. I know this year money is a lot tighter and i know for myself im a little hesitant to be spending too much on tiger cat tickets when i know the economy is unstable and job security is not there anymore. Im always on edge whether or not i will be laid off because i know with the economy the way it is…the company i work for is not making as much money in sales like they were a year ago. Its really scary.

But what can you do…It will be interesting to see what happens this 2008 year. Only time will tell

Allan

this system is going down the tube. the problem is monoplies. back in the day,(not my day, now is currently my day)there were laws against owning monoplies, which no longer exist. there were competition between honest business's, one gas station would charge 47 cents, another would charge 51 cents, another 44, etc. now they all charge roughly the same price. you may see small differences, but nothing major. It is because they are all controlled by EXON. EXON made 40 billion dollars profit last year, yes profit, after expenses and everything. Why does a company need 40 billion dollars when many people are struggling to get by? how many people can afford a vehicle/insurance/fuel now days? not very many. someone needs to come up with a system that is a mixture of communism and capitalism.

Hey There OshawaGuy Allan

Times have certainly changed. And times will certainly continue to change. I empathize with the boat your Dad is in, when companies decide to pick up and move to other countries, it certainly tears at the fabric of a community. $23/hour jobs are out there, lots of them actually, but that is of no consequence to folks like your Dad who would either require lengthy retraining or someone willing to take him on only for a few years until he's ready to retire. Rock, meet hard place.

As far as the GM/Oshawa troubles, this has been brewing for a very long time. This does not make it easier, but considering a move to a more diversified local economy may be in order for some. Personally, my wife and I are originally from Sudbury, and we had to come south about 10 years ago because at that time , opportunities did not exist for us. So sad, move on, so we did.

Hamilton is not having an easy go of things. But with recent announcements, and the city trying to focus on company attraction, things are improving (insert nay sayers here). I hope this rut that Eastern Ontario is in passes quickly, for all involved.

What it comes down to is priorities.

OskeeWeeWee

David

Although this thread is not about football, per se, its an exceptionally good read.

In terms of the small amount of the thread that does actually pertain to football, the current recession will definitely take a bite out of profits.

Football, of course, will not be the only enterprise to suffer. Anything connected to the dollar, will take a hit.

How nice it must be that 34,000 Parliamentarians in Ontario are making in excess of $100,000 per annum.
Occasionally, we actually see the fruits of their labour.

Good post, Oshawaguy!

I don't think it will have an effect at all. The recession in the US hasn't hurt the NFL or MLB one bit. Most NFL games were sold out last year and will probably be sold out this year.
The biggest effect on attendance at CFL games will be the product on the field.

As for politicians earning more than $100,00 a year - good luck to them, its a thankless job that I wouldn't want. Everyone hates you and blames you for their problems.

34,000 parliamentarians??? I think you mean public servants!

I don’t begrudge anyone making big bucks, that’s fine, no one said the world is fair and all that. But when you combine the fact that some people are making way more than they should while others aren’t making what they should, combined with the fact the rich get richer and the poor poorer with the middle class group getting smaller, western economics is in trouble I think in the future, big trouble. But I’m no economist, I just know that I see the people at the top making sure they are taken care of and their top buddies at the expense of people at the bottom. At the end of the day, when all sh*t hits the fan and a company closes or whatever, all that matters to the few in control is that they escape with their pockets full. And that is sad.

But its all these Union guys at places like Ford, GM making $100,000 plus, with their fat pensions. These companies can't compete anymore.
Steelworkers collecting a bigger pension than our military guys - that's the problem. Yes the rich get richer, but who are the rich?

I've seen a couple of big dives in the economy since the 1960's. Your concerns were voiced then too. House prices have always been too high, jobs were lost...but football teams have survived. Its the bad owners who kill football teams. Luckily we don't have that problem.
But somehow people seem to muddle on through the bad periods and the doom and gloom.
Just look south of the border right now and look at how bad they have it.We are still better off than they are and better off than many other countries despite some of the idiots we have in government and business.
You will make it through and so will your Dad.
I hope you can make it to some games this year.
Regards from Peterborough......

Apologies for my error in saying that 34,000 parliamentatians were making in excess of $100,000 per annum.

I should have called these thieves civil servants.

(Ouote Mikem)
But its all these Union guys at places like Ford, GM making $100,000 plus, with their fat pensions. These companies can't compete anymore.
Steelworkers collecting a bigger pension than our military guys - that's the problem. Yes the rich get richer, but who are the rich?

I don't think the big bucks are going to Union Leaders or the steel industry, per se.
The real big bucks go to CEOs in hospitals, of all places, along with a comedy of other "errors" we generally refer to as human beings.

I think there is a ton of problems first off we bring in temps from other countries to do jobs for low low wages they work overtime but never get paid for it these people except it to me this is a huge problem. they say they do jobs that canadians wont do for those low wages. i think alot of this immagration and temp from other countries is driving wages down as they will accept and do a job that tradionally paid 20 + an hr for a lot less. well and free trade has been the death of this country it seems the only thing weve gotten out of free trade is trading our well paying manufacturing jobs over to other countries and new jobs are coming in at half the wage. yes the government is boasting all these new jobs created etc low unemployment but id love to see how many of these jobs are actually jobs a canadian can like comfortably on. with all these low paying jobs who is gonna by the new cars housing etc? i dont see things gettin better either its scary very scary

This is a very intersting read to say the least. We have people blaming unions, blaming free trade, blaming Government too.
How about we all take 1 big step back and all take a good look at ourselves. How many of you or family members shop at the store with "Rollback prices"? If anyone says "I do" well you are also to blame as the more you shop at these type of stores the more you drive the economy into the ground. The more you give them your money, the more they beat down the manufacture and then the manufacturing place has to move to save money and to be able to make cheaper product...we are all creating big bad monsters at retail (where most of our money is spent daily) so lets all be responsible and except it and blame ourselves too.

Also, to all of you in a union as well....blame your union as they are of no use anymore and they are also losing you your jobs!
(I haven't met anyone in 15 years in a union that can honestly say they aren't over paid for what they do and they don't work very hard either.....so accept responsibility!)

Hey I love the company with "roll back the prices" - great service, great prices and a better attitude than that other company that has the big Z.
Why do you think the "average guy" shops there? One of the few places where people on minimum wage can afford!!
They are also a great community supporter - yes I know that will p*** people off because they are headquartered south of the border.

It was WalMart that actually funded and got the Juno Beach memorial off the ground - I will continue to shop there and Proud to shop there!!! Yes they may pay minimum wage but a lot of their custumors are also on minimum wage.

By the way - there is no proof that a slumping economy or an economy in recession effects sporting events. NFL attendance not affected at all.

For you to blame UNIONS is a Total joke! Do you work at NEW Dofasco sorry thats Arcelor Mittal! So all the people at Amcan Castings, Tiercon Industries and Wescast Industries thats probably 2000 layed off and closed up in our area in the last two years that have gone because of our Government not protecting the Auto Parts Industries in Canada, cheap offshore Chinese parts! are flooding the market and to say UNIONS are the problem give your head a shake :roll:

Finally a topic I know something about!

No, it is neither the unions, the government, nor the rich who are to blame.

In fact no one is to blame. Life is not fair. Life is just what it is. It is up to us to adapt, not up to the world to adapt to us.

So while the Chinese and Indians are making many of the old industrial items we used to make better and less expensively than we are, our standard of living is still higher than theirs and growing.

The fact is that for every textile job we are shipping to the far east we are creating a couple of high tech jobs at places like RIM.

When you buy a Rim Blackberry from Rogers for $500.00 about $50 of that goes to the manufacturing and assembly plants in Malaysia (or wherever). The other $450.00 goes to the designers and engineers at Rim in Waterloo or to the marketers at Rogers.

But for anyone who is suffering the dislocation caused by the rapid economic waves that seem to be surfing around the world, you have my sympathy. And I agree the government (meaning all of us currently employed taxpayers) have a role to play in helping out on everything from providing the less fortunate of us with great and affordable education to unemployment insurance.

But the fact is that Ontario is, on average, wealthier than we were 10 years ago, and we will be wealthier than we are today in another 10 years. This increase in wealth is going to create great opportunities for those of us well educated enough and motivated enough to take advantage of the opportunities economic growth will create.

Good luck, stay in school, and Oski Wee Wee!

Cheers, Bob.

8) If you don't want to shop at WalMart because it's an American company, then you are quickly running out of alternatives in the same range.

Zellers and The Bay are also American owned, but you still have Canadian Tire if you will only support a Canadian company !!!! However I don't think they sell underwear there, as of yet anyway !!!!! :lol:

Bob Wrote:
In fact no one is to blame. Life is not fair. Life is just what it is. It is up to us to adapt, not up to the world to adapt to us.

Totally True!

Bob Wrote;
But the fact is that Ontario is, on average, wealthier than we were 10 years ago, and we will be wealthier than we are today in another 10 years. This increase in wealth is going to create great opportunities for those of us well educated enough and motivated enough to take advantage of the opportunities economic growth will create.

Totally Untrue Bob.........As you know Bob, my line of work puts me in touch with many sectors (commercial and residential) and I am seeing extremely stressed people due to many increased economic factors..the amount of people, families and businesses that are hanging by a thread financially is staggering....sure, there is a lot of bucks floating around through credit but that's hardly an economic foundation to base things on.......personal debt is climbing and the economic stress that results is extremely damaging to the quality of life generally.........the personal and corporate bankruptcy rate in North America is an indicator of the grief out there.....

Point 1): Nebulous. "Life is just what it is??" Who's "us," again?

Apartheid? The Vietnam War? People don't just adapt to Berlin Walls. They eventually get around to knocking them down. And the people who put it up ARE to blame for it..:wink:

The Francis Fukayama "end of history" trip still rattled around some cafe chats in lower Manhattan until around midnight, September 10, 2001. Things tragically aren't so simple or packageable.

Point 2): Yup, folks are uptight. The worldwide credit meltdown that the Bear Stearns bailout highlights is going to be nasty when that impact filters through the entire system.

Here's a basic primer:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis

I would break out in a chorus of "Tiny Bubbles," but that wouldn't be apt here. It is a HUGE bubble that many of the people responsible for oxygenating it admit they don't have a handle on the scope of it.

I have a friend in Mississippi who has lost work hours because her housing firm is feeling the credit crunch head-on there. It may close by the end of the year. The real estate market and housing construction sector are really feeling it in the States.

Tough sledding is ahead, recession or "d-word."

Oski Wee Wee.

My slant on this topic is that we are to blame for this mess by our failure to think and act independently. We are innundated by mass marketers with their constant messages of instant gratification, ultra-choice, and non-existent consequences. Technology has distanced ourselves from the laws of nature and our role in this world. Special interest groups have hijacked our news services with ten second sound bites and their sense of entitlement. Socialists inject the political agenda with their secular utopian schemes, smothering the family with a self-serving tax burden. If we get back to the core values that founded this nation we'll be alright.

Oskie Wee Wee!

Ockham wrote:".....If we get back to the core values that founded this nation we'll be alright."

Ockham: At my age I have learned that you can't turn back the clock. You can live your own life that way but society, for good or bad, will continue to change and find its own values that work for a particular time.
There are just too many of us now for a single morality, work ethic etc. But thank goodness for those people who can still buck all of the trends and find their own way.