QB Measurements

There is an interesting post on the Montreal site measuring on QB throwing velocity.

Just looking about I see QB’s being measured on ( especially NFL):

Size-height and weight
Handsize
Speed
Jumping
Velocity

No where do I see where accuracy is measured. I remember Dunigan saying that accuracy is the most important of all physical things a QB has.

I wonder why it isn’t measured in any obvious ways. Maybe it is just assumed that it becomes obvious.

I remember Buono said the Lions had difficulty deciding one year between Buck Pierce and Jarious Jackson. He indicated they tracked EVERY throw they each made thru TC and preseason and Pierce was the more accurate of the two. First and only time I heard that accuracy was quantified.

I would like passes catchable added to passes attempted and passes completed ?
there would be a grey area of what constitutes a catchable ball ?
or should a catchable ball be only ones that are dropped ?
should passes blatantly thrown out of bounds count towards pass attempts, as this also affects the completion percentage ?
passes attempted vs catchable balls will give you a more accurate QB efficiency as the onus is on the receiver to give the stat of passes completed.

Why is Wally and Huff able to find new CFL QB's while many others are dumbfounded in locating a QB for the future ?

That always bugs me when some teams just steal others and produce duds . The Argos found a couple but now
their GM is gone because of a few mysterious trades mid season but it seemed their cupboard was always full of promising talent .

I would place accuracy as number one as well . Just look at Mc manus or Wilkinson not the most athletic but they delivered a catchable ball on time .

Tom Brady's accuracy is his greatest asset . He executes when not hurried like no other QB ever seen . If you look at the RB's it was Burris's ability to throw accurately and execute that changed the most for them from year one . Just look at E Jackson and his no drops the past season as a reflection of that .

There were a lot of drops and poor route running by receivers that first season .

I think it boils down to philosophy.
Popp used to say " who cares about the back-up". Nobody got reps but AC in that system in games or practices.
Lapolice when HC of Winnipeg shocked me when he said " I've talked to the back-up maybe 2-3 times a year". That was shocking.

Buono has said that his back-ups are huge. He has said they have always scrutinized #3 very carefully. If they are not ready to supplant #2 by end of year two they are replaced. In fact he gave Reilly one more pre-season game to prove himself in that regard or they would release him. Reilly has recounted that story often and how it woke him up.
As mentioned above Buono developed a measureable way to show accuracy.
He splits reps in practice

Campbell in Edmonton split reps and paid little attention to body shape. He used to say "how could I. I was a skinny receiver who ran a 10 sec 40.

Huf was a back-up QB mostly in his career. He knows the value of developing that role.

Scouting could be a big part of it. When it comes down to , why do guys like Wally and Huff keep finding QB's.

It can also depend on the system.
Glad you brought up Wilkinson.
He went through 2 systems in BC and Toronto were he failed.
Went to the Esks as a last hope, excelled in their system and started a dynasty.

As much as I do not like the Esks, I always liked Wilkie.
Brilliant QB with clock management, reading defenses, leading and very accurate tosses.
BTW, he did have the best o-line ever. That helps.

Here is another example. Drew Willy.
He was the second string behind Chase Clement when they played for the UFL LV Locos.
In 2010 Clement was the top rated passer in the UFL and was the 2010 Championship MVP.

When clement tried out for the Bombers, I thought the CFL would have the next star.
Well , he did not make the Bombers and the guy ( Willy ) not good has him made it in the CFL.
Sometimes it is just who fits into a system.

Wally is king of QBs....no question...but whom exactly has Huff found? I say that with an immense amount of respect for the man...I love the way he grooms players...but who has he actually found for QBs? It wasn't Bo...that was 100% a Murphy find. He inherited Burris, then picked up established vet Kevin Glenn and Murphy found Bo

Your right John Murphy deserves credit for finding BO . Surprised he hasn't found a wonder kid QB yet for the Riders he sounds well connected to the Texas talent pool .

He actually has at least one QB in mind that he thinks is potentially another big one, just not presently available. Murphy has a pretty good track record of finding some gems in more than just QB as well. Charleston Hughes was snatched from obscurity and has become a premier player in the CFL, Stanley Bryant got some NFL looks but was largely unknown and overlooked because of his school.

Two steps I guess...
Finding and Grooming/Development

Sometimes grooming/development I think is the more important step. Often I think the raw talent may be found by teams and then left to rot.

Accuracy is important but it doesn't do a QB any good if you don't have decent velocity on the ball.

You need to throw it fast and get it there quick.

A lot of QBS have come to CFL training camps and don't get far because they're having trouble getting the ball all the way over to the far side of the field.

Whats one thing Burris had? Good velocity.

There are some QBs who did start but their velocity was subject and they were prone for the pick 6.

Accuracy means little without velocity

Brady is accurate yes but he also has really good velocity when he throws that ball

I agree on the velocity / arm strength . Burris whipped the ball quickly and Brady as well . When I think of arm strength alone I also think of Troy Smith strong arm no accuracy . If you look at lofters like Ray he is able to do it as well thru accuracy .

The flats in the CFL is no place for poor velocity [b]if you sit in the pocket [/b]. Many guys like Wilkie would roll out to cut the distance to the sidelines  . He had average velocity and some say not even that .

Having receivers and an OC that manages the strengths and weakness of the QB is also a major factor .

I remember Wilkie well. He was very accurate — I can remember him dropping high-arcing bombs into the corner of the end zone, usually for a TD, but slow on his feet and his arm strength was definitely average at best.

You Wilkie guys ever see him play basketball? Unbelievable point guard. The Esks used to form an off season touring BB team. Highbaugh at 5-9 could dunk and kiss the rim. Lemmerman was good as well.
Wilkie played both sports at Wyoming. Still lives in Edmonton.

And can you imagine him and his body trying to be accepted as a QB today? Makes you wonder...

Nice Daughter too. :wink:

Accuracy relates to another hard to quantify characteristic- that of situational awareness.
It requires visual scanning, depth perception, excellent hearing, analytical ability, and the ability to process multiple inputs while under pressure.

There has been some research on this but it's been limited. Interestingly, good teachers have a very similar ability- you know the ones I'm talking about.... the ones with eyes in the back of their heads.

In both cases we might call it 'spider sense' and because it is composed of multiple qualities working together under pressure it is hard to measure/

In the college game things move slower and systems are key so this quality is less important. We've all seen the college star who doesn't make it in the pros and who has that 'deer in the headlights' look.

You CAN - to some extent - teach this through experience and coaching but there are those who are born with greater degrees of this quality. With this even a slow QB with a weak arm can pick apart a defence by executing a minimally decent pass to his 3rd or 4th read on a regular basis.

spoken like a true academic..hahaha

Thank you. But I'm more of a practitioner. Got the terminal degree late in life and always preferred working in student services and teaching to straight research.

But we digress....

Any takers to discuss situational awareness? :smiley:

The Esks had a tradition of fielding a pretty good basketball team team. I worked at a small Christian college in Edmonton in the 90's and they would come in and - most years - clobber our team which was pretty good for the league it was in.