PGA Tour vs LIV Golf

Somewhat of a surprise but Sir Nick the Prick, as he is often called, is “retiring” from his “lucrative” broadcasting job. Perhaps he has found another definition of “lucrative”. We may see him commentating for the LIV Tour yet.

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Hilarious. Dear Leader Monahan was in the midst of a press conference during which he extolled the virtues of Brooks Koepka, while at the same time LIV was announcing that Koepka would be joining their series.

Expect more doublespeak from Monahan and McIlroy.

The PGA Tour is fighting back by announcing new LIV like limited field no cut tournaments with considerably more money that was suddenly “found”. These were the type of tournaments the PGA was referring to as “exhibitions” last week.

McIlroy, a veritable doublespeak star, continues to criticize players for accepting Arab money when it is well documented that he has accepted over $5 million of Arab money in the past and has won the “Race to Dubai” three times, proving that he is a better golfer than a businessman.

Many media keep crediting LIV with victory in battle after battle in what may be a long war. Five more top 20 players and the quality of the Tours will be virtually equal.

Today’s update and Monahan’s press conference comments:

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Just as I had prophesied early in this thread would be done because that PGA insisted to be holier than others and open this can of worms that is very old!

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An excellent take on the sanctimonious bunch, including Brandel Chamblee, trying to wrongly paint the LIV golfers as participating in sports washing. Some of the same points about the hypocrisy of this position already made on this thread. I agree that the issues in play here have nothing to do with sports washing.


The European Tour has taken action against their players, although somewhat limited and different than the action taken by the PGA Tour. This applies to events co sponsored with the PGA Tour, such as the Scottish Open, which many players play the week before the British Open.

The European Tour seems to have forgotten that their Fed Ex Cup is called the Race to Dubai and is rife with Arab money. More backflips and hypocrisy.


From the very same men who are chums with the likes of folks in charge past and present at UEFA, FIFA, and Formula 1!? No way you don't say! :unamused:


It's like some, see below, that believe the "should have avoided" sort of argument. I think there is an argument that the PGA Tour could have avoided this mess if they opened discussions fully with the LIV people and basically avoided this mess. Perhaps as some say Zalensky "could have avoided"... type of argument. Don't know. These are difficult decisions with ramifications of course as we see in Ukraine and in pro golf. When you're dealing with a bully who isn't just a bully but has a lot of power behind being a bully, be careful what you decide because the fallout can be very bad for very many. Of course comparing golf with the Ukraine-Russia thingy is stupid in so many ways, ie. who cares about a bunch of golfers, it's really not "big news" the golfers are all rich anyways with a great lifestyle with freedom to boot, and I agree with that but there are some parallels.


Like Zalensky, the PGA Tour is testing the resolve of their opponent. Agreed it is similar in principle but of course golf is not life and death. Maybe both will eventually be resolved once the strutting and posturing is finished.


Would love to know what the "reasonable demands" were but don't want to sell my e-mail address to do so.


Oh well, I put this here just because there was not quite enough fire in this kitchen and look who has commented and weighed in now! :open_mouth: :roll_eyes:

Okay, I'll be around, but I think I will step away for a bit from this thread.

This feels kind of like putting fireworks in some abandoned shed and running away, so please forgive my guilty pleasure this time. :smiley_cat: :grin:

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"In Russia, demand with reason is reasonable demand too." :unamused:

I figured Trump would weigh in. Two of the LIV events are being played at Trump courses.

It will not be me who lights the fireworks in the shed. As I find Trump never says anything intelligent I will continue to ignore him as best as I can. There is also a reasonable chance that he will not be able to run in 2024 given the evidence the January 6th hearings are uncovering. He therefore won’t be able to make good on any of his threats against the PGA Tour and their tax exempt status.

I think the discussions on principle on this thread occurred relatively early. I try to focus on new developments. This is going to go on for awhile, although there will no doubt be gaps when nothing new is happening. That will be countered by more players leaving or influential figures speaking out.

I still am fascinated to watch how things play out. Even though it is limited to golf right now a blueprint is being laid for every sport in the world. It remains to be seen how successful that blueprint is , but it is not impossible that this will become the most important sports story of the 21st century so far.


Note FWIW in the ratings thread that I did a post, in relation to what could be if other sports seen as niche in the US played their cards right with American media, about Disney / ESPN's new and much bigger deal looming for a renewal with not only Saudi-sponsored Formula 1.

The point again there is any media types who want to weigh in on this matter and moralize generally can stuff it, for as we have been over even before more of the evidence was demonstrated, these developments are first and foremost all about the big business that is global sport and entertainment.

The whining complaints of the PGA are simply because they don't like losing a market fight yet never were challenged on such a front until now.

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Absolutely true. Amazing how the PGA suddenly found tens of millions.

Just a hunch, but I’m wondering if the Saudis (and other Arab countries) will set their sights on Formula 1 next. I don’t know much about that sport, but I think you do. Any idea how many $ it would take to buy Formula 1?

You are onto something, for it is only more in recent years that there have been more races in the Middle East and like others around the globe especially more outside of Europe or the Americas or Australia, there is some serious state-sponsorship and the politics that go with that as well.

As far as exposure to the growing American fanbase, this is the most money and attention ever received for Formula 1.

I was introduced to Formula 1 as a youngster, but its exposure on American television was minimal every year but for a few races such as Monaco (as does not make for a good spectacle given it is very hard to overtake on that circuit), because the American sports media pushed NASCAR and Indy-car all these years.

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Found an article about the local objections in Oregon to the LIV golf event being held at the Pumpkin Ridge course this week. This course is a lesser known gem and hosted the 1996 US Amateur, which was Tiger’s 3rd and final win of that tournament, and two US Women’s Opens. Again, although the anti Saudi points are valid, there is no explanation as to why Saudi Arabia should be singled out for censure while worse nations such as China and Russia get a pass. There is an interesting sub story about a Saudi hit and run driver who killed an Oregon resident and then was allegedly spirited out of the country by the Saudi government, adding a local reason to be critical of the Saudis.

(LIV Golf heads to Oregon, where local officials aren't happy Pushback on LIV golf Oregon -


But China and Russia ain't trying to operate a league in North America. Besides, don't forget Dubya allowed relatives of Bin Laden to escape the US from questioning when there was a wholesale lockdown of flights days after 9/11

The league only operates in North America in part. I also don’t think it matters much where it operates. There is no doubt dirty Saudi money behind LIV but there is also dirty Saudi money behind the PGA Tour and many players, including unofficial spokesman McIlroy have accepted that money. So has FIFA and Formula 1. The IOC has accepted dirty Russian and Chinese money. As someone else pointed out Bell accepts dirty Saudi money and uses some of it to sponsor the CFL.

I’m just trying to point out the inconsistencies and hypocrisy. If LIV is to be condemned then surely all of the leagues/organizations I have mentioned (and there are many others) should be too.

There is also no evidence that Bin Laden’s US extended family had anything to do with 9/11. In fact I read a few books on Bin Laden and he was estranged from virtually everyone in his family for years. The US knew this. He wasn’t sending 9/11 planning tips from his cave to US relatives that he had nothing to do with for years.

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The latest 3 players to defect to LIV and the last 3 before the tournament starts this week as the field is now complete.

In Ortiz they now have the top two Mexican golfers as Abram Ancer joined LIV last week.

As the article says, in Wolff they have one of the most talented young players in the world if he can get his personal demons under control.

It is interesting to note that not all player membership is guaranteed which sheds some light on the LIV process. The newest former world #2 amateur is on the LIV Tour for two years guaranteed but must finish in the top 32 to stay there. I imagine that other lesser known members of the LIV Tour have similar contracts. We’ll see how all that plays out. If more PGA players defect, which appears inevitable, they will either have to expand the fields or say goodbye to some of the lesser lights, probably with a healthy cheque in their hands.

I can’t find it in me to condemn a young player for setting up himself and his family for life when offered the opportunity to do so.

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An interesting Q & A from some editors of Golf magazine. I like the comment about it being “interesting” how quickly the PGA Tour came up with an extra $54 million in purses. This is what ringleader Mickelson and some others were critical of- that the Tour was underpaying them. It seems there is some basis for that view.

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