Ottawa and Toronto ..

OK. Here's a topic I think many of us can agree on. I've watched this league for many years and am constantly amazed by the poor quality of the officiating. In fact, what's really surprising is not that the league is once again viable but that anyone would even bother to watch a game where the oucome is determined beforehand by the officials. I'm talking in particular about the Ottawa and Toronto game on Wednesday. The league has now posted an idiotic explanation of an incredibly bad call on their website. Do they really think this will fool anyone? It happened halfway through the third quarter. Toronto fumbled and Ottawa scored. At that point, Ottawa would have gone ahead and the whole complexion of the game would have changed. I actually taped the game in question to send to a friend in the US and have replayed it a few times. The tape confirms what I and everyone else originally saw. You can CLEARY see the ball falling to the ground before anyone was tackled. No ifs, ands or buts. They got it right the first time and then blew it. What happened to change their mind?? Nothing. Perhaps the better question is what what did someone say to urge a ref to overrule a right call??

At the beginning of the season the league experimented with video replays. I suggest that Wednesday's fiasco serves to underline the desperate need to move forward with that. Every other league has video replays. Why not the CFL? Could it be that the league wants to keep some discretion in their officiating to help bigger market teams like Toronto wind football games. The Argos should have and deserved to lose on Wednesday. But now I wonder.

First off all you had to sent it to a friend in the states to have it reviewed?
I only saw it one on the sports news and I see it was not a fumble. Avery was down before the ball popped out. I am a life long Als fan and a life long Argo hater an I will say it again, it was not a fumble.

The short answer to your quesiton is no. I'm actually a Tiger Cat fan hoping Ottawa would lose. I taped it because someone who used to live in Ottawa a asked me to. I only reviewed it because I knew I was right the first time. Watch the replay, mate. The ball is falling to the ground as the crowd of players shifts to the right. I brought this up because it highlights just how bad the refs are in this league... REALLUY Bad. We need replays or the credibility of the game will really start to suffer.

Funny I never asked which team you are a fan of.
I agree we need the replay but the as it is now the refs get only one shot at it and they have to make a desision. They dont get the kuxury of seeing it over and over from multiple angles. You say you say it the first time? Well good for you. Dont tell me you have never complained about a call only to have the replay show you were wrong and the refs were right.
Furthermore there is a big debate going on right here right now about whether or not it was a fumble. It is just about split right down the middle. We cant come to an agreement after seeing it countless times yet the refs have to after seeing it once, and in this case in my opinion they got it right

It wasn't a fumble and the REFS got the call right.

Why would any REFS favour the ARGOS? The ARGOS had allot pen. than OTTAWA DURING THAT GAME.

Actually, it was a fumble. Too bad I can’t post the clip on line, but I can assure you that the ball is falling to the ground as the pack shifts to the right. You do have to look, but it is there. Perhaps I state the case too strongly about bias in officiating but I think that it does exist. The real question is really simple: what’s wrong with having video replays? they exist in every other major sport, why not the CFL? The technology is readily at hand and the truth is that it does work. It would do a lot for the credibility of the game. As to the suggestion that I’ve complained in the past about calls where the ref has been proven right, I have to confess that I’m one of the silent majority who has said very little to this point. Wednesday’s game I think was the last straw. Your’re right “ro 1313"” that you didn’t ask me what team I’m a fan of, but your tone suggests you’re actually a Toronto fan.

The gentleman seem to think that I am Toronto fan. What do you think?
I am a fan of the Als and a fan of the game. Is just becoming a PITA when every game there are posters who will criticize every call.

I mentioned in another post.

I would love to give the complainers an opportunity to ref a game with a half million people watching on TV with the benefit of replay. That way we could see how the complainers measure up against the CFL refs.

Now that I thing about why not apply for the position and if you make it come back here and see what is thought about your performances......

Perhaps the difference between our perspectives is that I've actually played the game at a fairly high level and today volunteer my time to referee in both a quasi competitive and recreational league. As to your suggestion that I apply for the job, I'd love to since most of the refs I've seen in this league simply dont cut the mustard. Would I be any better? I don't know. But I'm betting that I wouldn't have made such a bonehead call as the one on Wednesday. I wouldn't have had to, of course, if the league would do the right thing and introduce a policy of video replays for such things.

Well I am honoured to be in the presence of somone who has played at such a high level seeing how no one else here has :roll:

No offence but in my opinion you probably would have made such a bone-head call because it was clearly not a fumble.

The bottom line here is that we dont agree, and on pretty much every call 50% will agree with it and 50% wont. NO matter what the refs do someone somewhere will be calling them boneheads

My initial comment was not meant to offend, but you did seem to suggest that I knew nothing about officiating and would likely suck at it if I tried, which is clearly not true.

You're right about not agreeing. That said, whether it was a fumble or not (and it clearly was a fumble) I think the interest here and in other places clearly serves to underline the need for a video replay.

That would, in your terms, help to do away these postings from people you rather indiscriminately lump into the category of complainers. I really don't think it's complaining to point out problems with the present system. Then again, perhaps we'd disagree on that point too.

Well here is the kicker
You would be amazed at how many people here(not I) dont want video replay. Why? Because they claim it would slow down the game :roll:

I say they dont want it because it would take away the utlimate excuse for the lose, the refs

Finally, a point we can agree on !!! Cheers.

The "Can you do any better" statement is whacked. But I agree, video replay would may games 4 hrs long because there would be so many of them.

You certainly ARE NOT an ARGO fan…your team is MONTREAL.

YOU also love the CFL.Every league has reffing problems.Try being a REF in soccer , where your life can be at risk. :roll:

Humans make mistakes and do their best with split second discions.

I myself , have been mad at the REFING at times in the heat of the moment.
BUT, I believe that NO REF is out to “get” any team.

My major complaint was the large AMOUNT of pen. that seem to ruin the game for the fan.

We as fans , have the benefit of slow mo replays from every angle…so it is easy for us to second guess , every call.

Will I be happy when a call goes my teams , way…sure , who would not be?

BUT, I try to be fair about it.FLUTIE , DID FUMBLE IN the 1996 GREY CUP… :smiley: How many people have said to themselves…" boy did our team get lucky with that non call? "

good and bad calls happen to ALL teams, and it is part of the game.

I just missed that play, and while I saw a replay from one angle, I didn't see it from the best angle. But whether or not it was a fumble isn't even the real issue on that play.

The point is that, as I understand it, it was originally ruled a fumble, and apparently no official disputed it until they were lining up for the convert. Then suddenly the call was changed.

Without the benefit of replay, what prompted them to make the change?

Some say that one of the officials saw the replay on the JumboTron, and made the determination from that that the original call was incorrect, and corrected it. But that's like handing in an exam, realizing you made a mistake, and going back in to correct it.

The ruling of the officials is final. That's right in the rule book. Once the ruling is made, and no official disputes it based on what he saw during the play, even if they later think about it and change their mind, they can't change the decision: it's too late. God Himself can't come down out of the sky and overrule it. (Well, maybe if He did, they would; but we'll worry about that when it happens.)

Without replay reviews in the CFL, they can't change a ruling based on instant replay. Period. Even if they ultimately got the call right, they were wrong.

It's true that the complexion of the game would have been different, but would the Argos have lost the game? No one knows.

Some where Als all the way mase a very good point about it.
In a nut shell he said since no-one was 100% sure they allowed the play to continue and then conferenced it when the play was over.

Sounds good to me

How Can The Team One Cheer For Affect Judgement And Eyesight?
It was a fumble, no doubt about it! They had it right while the play was running and they screwed it up when they changed it. The League's reponse is Deny, Deny, Deny. Make up something quick! Quote some rule nobody heard of before and that one can't find in the rule book! Stonewall them! Tell them anything! Tell them anything! Repeat it fast and often until it sounds credible!
In summary, the CFL Head Office responses by Mr. Black and Mr. Wright are nothing but merely a huge load of HOT TOMATOES!
Mickey Mouse and Bush League!