Next Generation QBs

...good little article from TSN here analyzing the 'next generation' of CFL QBs...worthy of an extended discussion in this forum...

http://www.tsn.ca/cfl/story/?id=334032

...my opinion, Durant shouldn't be in this group, he is already a household name and proven himself as #1 in Riderville, for years to come...strange the article doesn't mention Dinwiddie because if DD goes down due to an unfortunate injury the good ship Roughrider has him at the helm, one would think...then again the article is about the nex-gen, and Durant is certainly in that framing story...

im sorry, but with calvillo, burris, glenn and ray all being 31+ ( calvillo being 38 ), it just negates this whole discussion.

all of those players still have plenty of gas left in the tank.

Fixed it for ya Red. Riders don't have a history of hanging on to their top players over time. A little Tampering here and there, or an extra 100,000 g's a year over what Riders think they're worth, and there outa there. Can't confirm, I tried to find out on this forum but with no luck, but I heard the contract was for 2 plus 1. That means when he is hitting his prime after 2012 he will go to the highest bidder. My bet is he plays out his career somewhere other than Sask.

For the future from the list in the article, beyond those listed below 31+, I see the most potential in McPherson and in Jyles.

With his current TDs to interceptions, his career with them about even, more fumbles than touchdowns, general inconsitency, and worst of all not even a 60% completion percentage, Durant is one of the most overrated players in the league for sure (brace yourself for the homer onslaught from that Rider Nation). Durant still has a few years to turn things around of course, but should he not in the next two years I think he can go the way of Bishop or Joseph. Of course all the same if enough homering Riders love him that much despite these stats, more power to them. :lol:

I'll take McPherson or Jyles, each about even in my view right now, over Durant right now for that matter.

As far as the rest of the list forget it except perhaps those with not enough of a playing history to know anything like Bell or Tate.

For sake of picking younger players up via the NFL who have spent more of their career on the bench than playing, here was my list as posted a few weeks ago:

[url=http://forums.cfl.ca/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=59959#p1001581]viewtopic.php?f=1&t=59959#p1001581[/url]

Shaun Hill it turns out now will get a start in Detroit this weekend with Stafford out, but he turns 31 in January.

On the bright side for sake of these NFL guys whatever their age is that most if not all of them have few QB miles on them as far as wear and tear such they are more youthful at 31 than say your average starter in either league.

As the example of Brett Favre shows long after those set by other legendary passers, something usually goes wrong with the knees, ankles, or hips long before the strength or accuracy of the arm.

I think there a lot of quarterbacks who won't see much playing time for a while. As stated by drummer_god, guys like Ray, Printers, etc still have a lot of game left. Some of these up and coming quarterbacks might be burried on the bench.

Take the Lions for example, Casey Printers (as veteran as he may seem) is 29 years old. Travis Lulay is 26 (turning 27 later this month), so not much younger but far less experienced. I have a hard time believing Lulay will be given a realistic shot to quarterback the team barring injury (which is a common stepping stone for young qbs).

At this point there isn't really an established quarterback in the league who appears to be done. Calvillio might be the closest, but at 38 he's still the best quarterback in the CFL.

For the future from the list in the article, beyond those listed below 31+, I see the most potential in McPherson and in Jyles.
I've been touting McPherson for about 2 years now. Even as an unknown element...I took one look at him, did an exhaustive background check...and KNEW he'd be simply dominant in the CFL....and he will. I got nothing but disrespect for my troubles...especially from Alouettes fans who thought I was crazy pushing for a look see at an unknown quarterback in the era of the GREAT Anthony Calvillo.

Now,...with Calvillo's immobility exposed for the dangerous weakness it is.
And after what will one day be considered a mediocre start...
Adrian McPherson's name is searing through the blogosphere.
Not that I'm disagreeing.
I just think you're all bit NUTS.

:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

Adam Tafralis should be on there instead of Quinton Porter. Porter has not progressed at all since last season.

You are spot on despite the howls from the homers and fans as usual.

At about age 35, give or take for genetic advantages or disadvantages, most athletes of whatever feature player or star status drop off like flies due to increased vulnerability to injury, the increased time to recover from injury or workouts that comes with age, and just plain wear-and-tear. For example any more most RBs are done by about age 31 any more for that matter on the early side of the scale. Few special teamers exist other than on the interior line over age 29 too if they manage to make it past their first three young years of hits, pain, and carnage.

For every enduring player such as Damon Allen or Doug Flutie there are at least 15 guys who are history just for that position and many names forgotten due to injury serious enough, even after recovery, to debilitate them from performing even at par with the professional demands ever again.

Calvillo is the best there is in the CFL now, but at 38 highly vulnerable not only to injury as any QB but also biologically with a longer recovery time. Of course you would still love to have him, but you must as the Al's do have a capable backup to spell such a player given the inherent risks.

Akin to Brett Favre's situation, modern sports medicine makes for all kinds of creative suppression and numbing of pain if not also joint reconstruction and temporary fix-its, but the risk of the wheels falling off quickly and suddenly on any man at such age is just plain naturally far higher than a guy 10 years or more his junior.

Would love to see actual evidence of all these Als fans mentioned by Senior who apparently disrespected him for being a fan of Adrian McPherson. :lol:

Oh, wait, that evidence doesn't exist, at least not on these boards. Just about every Als fan who posts here recognizes what a talent we have in Adrian McPherson.

You know....I spent a considerable amount of time amassing evidence of the lack of respect people showed McPherson when he asked to be traded...and because the one incited the other...the complete hysteria that rained down on my head when I had the audacity to state that I didn't like Anthony Calvillo because he failed us in so many Grey Cups...and because of the almost COMPLETE lack of playing time his backups, including McPherson, received over the course of Calvillo's career in Montreal. I was "ordered" to prove my opinions about Calvillo's failures...although how one proves an opinion is beyond me...neither point is in dispute...so interpretation becomes opinion.

Quarterback is an unique position in sports. So much so that it's used in hockey and other sports...as in "Bobby Orr is the quarterback of that Bruins power play." A team lives or dies...rises or falls on it's quarterback. No matter what the circumstances of the game, what's happened on and off the field during the season...it's always, "Tom Wilkinson and Warren Moon went on to win 7 straight Grey Cups..."

It's probably not fair. But it's the way people see it. And considering that the quarterback directs the offense, and touches the ball on every down...and if he has the talent, killer instinct and vision to outscore his opponent on any given Grey Cup day...there is some validity to it. However valid...it's how most people see it...and it's why so many Montrealers have mixed feelings about AC. Now if he wins ANOTHER Cup.... :wink:

While it's true that some....including "discipline" had a balanced and sensible approach to the "no brainer" of needing to give an obviously talented QB like McPherson enough quality reps that he could feel his career wasn't slipping into obscurity...so many more were more than willing to see him "hit the road"....and even more were drooling at the prospects of his coming over to their side.

Still....there were other blog forums where my taking up McPherson's cause brought intense hatred and personal vendetta. While I understand the discomfort of seeing your quarterback hero slipping from Olympian heights...and the affront of someone pointing out any flaws in his game...and suggesting that a "young stud" like McPherson be given the opportunity to prove himsself....I don't understand the vehemence of some people's attacks.
Amusing yes...but confusing nonetheless.

Frankly I have no problem with defending myself. But I don't see any point of personal attacks on a football blog.

Then where is said “evidence”??

Did you major in hyperbole in University ? This is reminiscent of when Hamilton posters merely question whether or not Porter will ever develop into a CFL starter, you call that “Vitriolic hatred of Porter”.

Come on now. Name ONE, just ONE of these “so many more” that you claim exist.

Now with that I totally agree. But please understand that if someone happens not to agree with an opinion of yours, that does not necessarily equate to a personal attack.

So if, for example, a poster who doesn't happen to share your extremely high opinion of McPherson were to post something like "I don't think McPherson has the skill set to be a CFL starter", or, "I don't believe his defence reading skills are adequate", that would NOT be a personal attack on you; that would just be said poster expressing his/her opinion, agree with it or not.

Personal attacks look more like this:

If it wasn't clear from the post
That was a friendly jab...not a personal attack
Sorry if that didn't come across
Besides, by definition, personal implies an attack on a person...or one's person
Not a comment on general lunacy

As to some people demanding evidence...do a search
I am under no obligation to accede to your demands
And have no desire to hold your hands through what might be a painful memory

I have NO problem with people disagreeing with me...in fact I strongly encourage it
Just stick to football
That's what we're here for

And I'll add finally that this is the last time I EVER acknowledge any form of personal attack
Work out your own issues....I'm not interested

:rockin:

Thank you, MadJack. You've expressed my position on this issue perfectly. The mere fact of disagreeing with someone does not constitute a personal attack. We're all (well, mostly) adults here; we can discuss football without getting personal and lobbing insults.

Well hey as an Eskies fan I am envious of course that in Montreal you have TWO capable CFL starters to ride as ours in Ricky Ray slips in his stock yet in some part due to the poor offencive line and awful play calling.

So quit your squabbling you sound a bit like a bunch of ninnies or chickens in a coup! :lol:

Also of course in Ray's defence there is the matter of key dropped balls that have not given him a break when he has made those breaks at least once in almost each game this season.

If even half of those dropped balls were caught the Esks probably wouldn't be in the 2-8 pickle they're in now.

[url=http://forums.cfl.ca/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=56335]viewtopic.php?f=15&t=56335[/url]

Here's a thread I had posted, with some articles with regard to the challenges faced by rookie quarterbacks in the NFL for consideration in regards to this discussion, especially for those hard on any first-year CFLers including even those with the NFL experience such as Lemon.

I think many fans will focus on the early rookie interceptions and pull the plug quickly on those rookies in any league.

As explained with some surprising evidence to put any rookie of any potential against high odds in the articles, rookies are expected to make more such bad decisions than average veterans to lead to interceptions anyway with the coaches knowing that going in with such a rookie and planning around it in their game plans (i.e. beefing up the defence and special teams to the level of outstanding becomes critical).

What is most compelling for sake of trying to judge the upside of any given inexperienced QB I think is the development or lack of development in foundational passing skills and accuracy at the pro level.

It's one thing to have a rookie decide to make a throw and then fire it relatively on course into the wrong arms due to a poor decision to throw in the first place or just plain good coverage to which the rookie is not accustomed yet at the pro level, but it's quite another matter if the rookie is throwing after a good decision yet cannot consistently strike his mark or is not able to get rid of the ball fast enough when merited to avoid a sack or fumble.

Adam Trafalis has a gun for an arm, he just doesn't get a lot of chances to use it. Quinton Porter on the other hand, I expect to be cut in the next few years. He has not improved at all since last season, if anything he's regressed.

[url=http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81ac030c/article/in-a-passing-league-what-is-with-all-these-ugly-qb-situations]http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8 ... situations[/url]

Not everyone here is also an NFL fan I realise, but don't allow that personal opinion to dismiss the reality of the relationship the leagues have had historically and continues to this day beyond a few players going from one to the other.

For sake of the current situation with next generation QBs, the fundamental problem goes far beyond the CFL as discussed in part in the above article and has gotten worse due to several key injuries.

Just this week for example I read also the following telling developments too:

A pre-season 4th-string quarterback who would otherwise be out of football more than likely is now a starter in Pittsburgh, and his backup is a former college quarterback who has played primarily receiver in the NFL

Some retired 38-year old guy I never heard of and whose name I don't even remember was signed as a third-string quarterback

An undrafted rookie free agent will likely get more playing time behind the awful starter in Arizona, and compete for the starting job, as soon as Sunday. This is all after they let go draft bust Leinart who is now the third-string quarterback in Houston.

And all that is despite Brett Favre's case in Minnesota as is overhyped as usual, as with Sidney Rice out he has no true #1 receiver, Berrian not playing up to par for his course and not a true #1, and now almost no #2 because Percy Harvin has had grave issues with migraine headaches. And so Minnesota ends up signing a guy like ...Hank Baskett? :roll:

I'd say the shortage at feature receiver talent has begun in earnest as well, but that's for another thread.

Look for any quarterback shining in either league this season, as the number of such new feature or star players at the position is at what might be a critical shortage, to get more hype than even quarterbacks get as usual.

With the CFL at least for Calvillo the attention has been merited no doubt, and if Burris can eliminate interceptions from his stat sheet he'll merit as much attention as well.

Drew Tate has gotten more and more meaningful reps this season and has progressed quite well. The Stamps are quite high on him being the heir apparent to Henry Burris. In Montreal, the Als are quite high on McPherson and refused to trade him away even though there apparently were some good offers thrown their way. There is no doubt about his tremendous athletic ability, and him being tutored be Calvillo can only help in his development. The only issue might be that after all this work to get these guys ready, teams might end up losing them to the new Ottawa franchise if the rumoured "only one QB can be protected in the expansion draft" becomes a reality.