Mr. Wright,(wrong) Mr. Black(white), the KEYSTONE KOPS (KK)!

Mr. Wright is Mr. WRONG! George Black says that its white, is Inspector Clouseau and his officiating gang in that game are the KEYSTONE KOPS! Let’s review everything that Mr. Black,(er… white) the KK and Mr. Wright (er… wrong) said on this matter: There was a fumble, no, there was no fumble; there was a touchdown, no there was not a touchdown; there was no whistle to end the play, no you don’t need a whistle to end the play; the refs looked at the JumboTron, no they didn’t look at the Jumbo Tron; The CFL has a play review system, no they don’t have a play review system! They finally got it right; no they were wrong, when they were right, and they were right when they were wrong! Whew we need some clarification no; maybe not, it is now all as clear as mud to us! Let’s get the CFL to appoint a ROYAL COMMISSION to get us the real right answer nah, that would be too political now, wouldn’t it?
The CFL is continuing its long-standing policy that their officials NEVER make mistakes. Deny! Deny! Deny! QUICK! Hah, a new, that’s it, there was this old er….new rule. Yah that’ll get them. Tell them anything! Tell them anything! The suckers won’t know any better!

I had nothing to do with this.

As I said I missed the play when it happened, but I just finished watching the replay on this site. After watching it over and over, I am convinced that (despite the fact that I'm a Ticat fan) Avery was down.

It's also clear that the officials were still discussing the play, and had not set the ball for the convert.

If they looked at the JumboTron, then they certainly made a mistake by doing so. But I don't believe they did.

And check the rule book: the ball is not live until the whistle. The play ended when Avery hit the ground. And it looks to me like he still had the ball in his hands when that happened.

I agree that Avery was down. I have said so since the beginning.
I don't know whether or not the officials looked at the jumbotron but I still believe that Toronto should face some sort of consequences for showing the play in the first place

I didn't see the play, so I can't comment on if it was correctly called or not, but what I would like to ask is if the CFL officials are ful-time officials or not. What I mean is, do these officials hold other jobs and then also officiate CFL games, or is being a CFL official their only job?
This is one of my big complaints about the NFL, because their officials are not full-time officials either, they do have other jobs and do this on the side. The NFL should go to full-time officials and the sooner the better. In major league baseball with full-time umpires, other than calling balls and strikes which some days get very creative, the umpires do an outstanding job and are probably right about 98% of the time. You would think with all the money the NFL has, they would have full-time officials, but they don't, and replay takes longer than it should, but even that has improve alot from when it started.

The football rulebook is not that complicated. Believe me, I officiated football games for 7 years and the only thing that an official has to concentrate on during the run of play is to believe his eyes. The problem comes in when an official who has a particular area of the field under his scrutiny refuses to make a call in another official's area of scrutiny. An example of this is when a head linesman will not call a lineman for holding or illegal procedure, because it is in the field judge's area or the head referee's area of scrutiny or responsibility. They simply will not make a call in another officials turf area, literally! It should not be a full time job. Video review alone will fix what is wrong, because the officials know the rules. I am convinced of that. It's their focus and concentration on pass plays and fumbles as well as penalties that they need to focus on. They know how to apply the rules. All they need is a bi-annual eye exam and the permission to call a play no matter on whose turf area it occurs.

I saw the game and while it appeared that Avery was down, there was not an angle that showed the ball pop out. Every angle was unable to factually prove without a doubt that the ball came out after his knee touched the ground. You can argue all you want. I watched it many times. Avery is covered by too many guys when the ball comes out and nothing shows him hit the ground. The refs never blew the whistle and it was ruled a fumble. Under NFL review rules, upon the review, there would NOT have been on video evidence that it was NOT and since the ref did NOT blow the whistle, the call would stand. I say again: If the instant replay rule was in effect THERE ISNT ENOUGH PROOF FROM THE AVAILABLE ANGLES TO PROVE THAT AVERY WAS DOWN BEFORE THE BALL CAME OUT, THUS THE CALL STANDS.
Maybe not all but at least HALF the CFL refs need to go to Referee school and learn how to make tough calls on the spot instead of embarassing the League and incorrectly swinging momentum.

What kind of an argument is that?
Every angle was not unable to show that because I saw one angle and he was down. You are only seeing what you want to see.

Oh and by the way I have a news flash for you ------ This is not the NFL its the CFL so quoting the NFL rules is pointless.
You may say that this is a embarrassment to the league but I have never seen a CFL ref get the coin toss wrong.

This is just to clear up any confusion. The CFL officials do go to a referee school or training sessions prior to each CFL Season. They have the training, and the experience. There are seven of them on the field. If any of them saw the player Avery, down I am sure at least ONE of them would have blown the whistle. The whistle was not blown by any one of the seven guys in a striped shirt because he was not down prior to the ball coming out. Seven guys could not have gotten it wrong could they?

Calm down Ma'am. The only reason I Gave NFL rules was because "vincesport" said "video review alone will fix what is wrong..." I was simply adding to the conversation. As for the angles, I never saw an angle that showed both Avery going down and the ball coming out. All I saw was a bunch of players tackling him he then became hidden from the cameras and the ball pops out of the middle of about 5 guys. If you saw an angle that showed Avery hitting the ground then the ball come loose, then you must've been watching it on your magical tv that gives you more angles than I get to see, and thats fine by me. All I do know is that once the Touchdown is awarded and points are put on the scoreboard and the offense/defense comes off the field it is wrong to suddenly lie to the public on live tv and say it was ruled a tackle, not a touchdown because, it WAS ruled a FUMBLE and it WAS ruled a TOUCHDOWN. I couldnt care less who won that game i was watching for enjoyment. And I wasnt only seeing what I want to see because I only saw what I thought I was looking at which was later changed into something else.

you ruled it a td and fumble not the refs. they merely had a conference to discuss the play prior to making a final ruling. when they made the ruling they made the right one. nearly everyone by this point has seen the replay about 100 times and agree that while he may not have been on the ground he was down on top of other players and forward otion had stopped prior to any sight of a loose ball. that according to the rules ends a play. not the whistle. you could have had 100 camera angles and odds are the same result wouild have occurred. i realize that nothing at this point will cause you to consider you may be wrong but they did get it right.

Wow you guys are spectacular! And you're right too! The refs are great. This is not sarcasm, its a change of heart. The CFL officiating is Fantastic and if anybody sees it otherwise, dont argue just let it slide. Take it for a grain of salt. They are professionals and I think it's time we all just give them the credit they deserve. After all, don't WE hate it when we are at work and somebody tells us we are doing it all wrong. This has really opened my eyes guys, Thank you. Thank you all so very much. I mean that from the bottom of my heart.

Yours Truly and Thankfully

Number Five in 'eightynine

PS
I ruled it nothing. The refs confused me thats all. Lets be friends.

I wasnt joking guys. :lol:

Oh, and one more thing. Why do the Officials need to have a conference if no one blew the whistle and no one threw a flag? Could the JUMBOTRON maybe have played a role in their reversal? Remember everyone, the CFL does not have a video replay rule.

Like I said before.
There should be some sort of consequences for Toronto showing the replay while the refs were discussing the play.

To ro1313. No I don’t agree with any of that type censorship. The fans are entitled to see as much as possible. They paid for that right. Why shouldn't they be shown all the plays? The officials are responsible for their own actions. They are big boys. I believe that they would be more alert knowing that all plays controversial, or not, will be displayed. In most cases the officials are proven right. I remember when MLB tried to have the networks not show close plays at first base when instant replay was initiated. The networks won the battle and they also proved by the replays that the Umpires' calls on first base were very close to 100% correct. They need not hide behind their mothers’ skirts because of replays that are shown on the Stadium scoreboards.

Sorry but I don’t agree with you either. I don’t believe its censorship
First of all how often is there a conference in baseball? Rarely because the play usually happens in plain sight and the umps usually don’t have a blocked view of the play.
2) replaying the game on the score board gives an advantage to the home team. Sure everyone plays the same amount of games on the road as at home but they don’t play each other equally some teams play each other 3 times and the playoffs once.
3) I would not mind showing the play after the call but if it showed the ref to be wrong he might be inclined to give one back. The first call might not be a game decider but the equalizer might…

Showing the replay on a disputed call does not allow thing to be equal on the field.

I respect your point of view. The referees and other game officials are professionals. I don't believe that we have to baby-sit professionals. What happens off the field has nothing to do with what happens on the field. This is what the League office tells us.

I dont follow the on field off field point.

I agree they are professionals but they are also human. As long as there is no replay they should now be allowed to show the play because the refs will look. I dont play them because they do want to get it right

As far as i know, There is a rule stating that the refs are NOT allowed to view the video screen to make a call. As a Roughrider game go'er I know how much better it is to have the video screen showing Replays for the crowd as opposed to no video screen at all (we just got a Jumbo screen). The refs will make bad calls again in life. We all fuck up at our own jobs but we have to deal with it. The refs best be prepared for making mistakes because they will happen again and they better not just back down on their calls cuz of what "Jack" in the electroic control room thinks.