That ship sailed 15 years ago why bring it up now? Varsity just not a good site.
BMO stadium is a much better place, it’s on the Ex grounds which many Argo fans wanted. It’s on a rail line, has tons of parking close to the highway.
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Why bring it up now? Because I still believe in having, if possible like Montreal, separate stadiums for high level soccer and football and if there is a possibility at Varsity or elsewhere in Toronto for the Argos and give BMO all to the TFC folk, then I think such possibility should remain in the spotlight to a certain extent and be considered by the powers that be if it would be financially feasible and make sense. There is a reason people in the sports biz say things like this:
““I think there isn’t a team in pro sports that would say that they wouldn’t want to have a purpose-built stadium for themselves, for sure,” Pannes conceded”
You don’t think Forge FC in Hamilton wouldn’t like what they are proposing here for Vancouver FC in Langley compared with playing at THF and sharing with the TiCats? Oh, I think they would love such a facility:
I see your point on Vancouver and on Montreal, but I don’t see how it applies to currently MLSE and their mindset about their Argos, which we have discussed repeatedly for years on this forum.
That situation does not appear to be changing in Toronto any time soon.
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Correct and as long as MLSE pays the bills keeps the Argos in the league, I am okay with that.
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I was at games in Regina where the fans could see tornados on the outskirts of the city. Still the band played on so to speak. I could never figure out why that happened that they did not evacuate the stadium.
Been to other games that there was huge lightening storms … Still the band played on. Then the CFL got smart and started weather delays but they did not have rules on how long to wait it out. One bad storm I was at had a very long rain delay. Lots of the fans stayed in the stands. Silly us I say now when I look back but we did sin that game vs the Eskies.
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I think long term
That MLSE doesn’t want the Argos to be really successful, just moderately successful
If the Argos were real successful and an oportunity for an NFL franchise happened It may /could /would appear to the NFL that they are hurting the CFL by allowing an NFL team in Toronto.
It is well known that the NFL always wanted to go global and Mexico City and Toronto being in their same time zones would be a no brainer for easy International recognition
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Why should Toronto be any different for pete sakes than Montreal on this? Teams want their own stadiums, period. There is a reason why tne NFL doesn’t play in baseball stadiums any more, bowl things where seats like Three Rivers in Pittsburgh where moved in the lower bowl for football. The NFL has evolved to remove MLB from their mindset just like the MLS will not play in NFL first stadiums as time goes by. It’s pretty basic stuff what will happen here as time goes by learning from history.
Montreal has set the gold standard here as far as I’m concerned and a gold standard is exactly that, a gold standard. Toronto and Vancouver need to learn from Montreal and eventually they will. You know it, I know it, and everybody else knows it.
I don’t know, but other than what is evident on the basis that is not sports and entertainment for two different areas, locals, and provinces, ask them?
The locals don’t show for the Argos, and at this point to me it’s not worth continuing to ask why rather than acknowledge the MLSE reality and deal with it.
None of that has anything to do with plans Montreal or Vancouver, and I don’t see anything to be learned unless and until there were to be new ownership, which if not the case by 2030, I’ll be too old to care any more anyway about that one too.
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As long as MLSE pays the bills, the Argos will live to play another day.
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Sorry, Toronto and Vancouver need to learn what I say is the gold standard in Canada for MLS soccer and CFL football, separate stadiums that simply enrich both franchises. That simple. Montreal has nailed this, to a tee. Any Tom, Dick or Harry of us here in Canada know this. As basic as 1 plus 1 equals 2. Hey, you live in the U.S. and I respect your perspective looking from the outside but not knowing from the inside just like I don’t know your country from the inside, I don’t live there in your country and I’m not an American.
A lot has been said regarding the stadium debate. To understand why things are the way they are right now, you only need to have a basic understanding of economics.
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MLSE was given control over TD Place by the city of Toronto. This equals a low rent situation. To go to another facility means a high rent situation in comparison.
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Montreal is in a situation where once the Big O’s roof is repaired, they could be enticed to go there if the rent is cheaper.
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Vancouver has cheap rent at BC Place. It’s highly doubtful that anyone will build another CFL specific stadium with lower capacity due to the cost.
The price of real estate itself is extremely high in places like Toronto and Vancouver.
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BMO Stadium and it was MLSE that paid for the $120 MILLION expansion. And MLSE pays the city $850,000 a year in rent and the city also gets a portion of the naming rights
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Sorry you are correct.
Good crowd for Toronto
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Maybe the league offices. I am not so sure that the owners want that at all. They really like their tight compacted 32 team league with balanced divisions and still get to market their own franchises globally. Believe me, If the league, and more importantly, the owners wanted to expand globally, they would have done it by now. I think that global marketing is a huge priority for the NFL and its owners, expansion is not.
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Over a few years now, NFL Commissioner Goodell has consistently mentioned that the NFL owners are very comfortable with 32 teams for all kinds of reasons as the league earns record revenues and profits.
The topic of NFL expansion is not even on the current radar as otherwise is stadium renovation, if not also prospective relocation, in places like Jacksonville and Kansas City.
There is no stopping the NFL train for a good while, though there is one lawsuit cited in the NFL thread that would cost the NFL billions that stands to be heard in the US Supreme Court on the NFL’s appeal. The NFL has otherwise been funding some hefty legal costs in the last decade beyond merely the NFL Concussion lawsuit settlement.
US$14B and counting should the NFL lose, well the associated legal costs well into the millions I figure over the last decade and lost regardless, is not chump change even for the mighty NFL:
And yes indeed as you mentioned, global expansion via heavy marketing of the NFL is indeed an area of expansion, and the NFL maintains a strong marketing presence also in Canada though I’m not seeing the direct interest in Toronto any more.
That ship has sailed for perhaps another generation, and like on more matters than ever, if it does come around again, I’ll probably be too old to care.
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Well said! NFL owners want to grow their fan bases much more than they want grow the number of franchises. Clark Hunt wants thousands of Canadians to be Kansas City Chief fans but is not interested approving a Toronto expansion franchise nearly as much.
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The NFL is about the NFL, yes. Soccer is an entirely different beast though. Perhaps the slogan is soccer is about soccer, nothing league-specific. Perhaps in soccer the most important aspect are all the tournaments which soccer uses to keep their leagues more or less alive in a secondary aspect. Leagues are almost sort of like fancy exhibition contests with the perception of supremacy that do make money for the owners. Whereas in football, tournaments are irrelevant. It’s the league concept that is first and foremost, basically 100 percent first and foremost. Soccer really plays into the nationality thing with the tournaments, again huge money makers. Football hardly at all with the nationality thingy apart from the CFL which trys to play into this like soccer, successfully or not so successfully might be said.
I don’t know, maybe I’m off-base somewhat here but that’s sort of how I’m thinking. Again I must admit I don’t understand all the nuances, at all, of the soccer world and how it operates.
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Absolutely. The NFL has no intention of expanding at this time, much less expanding outside the US. If and when they do my bet is that Mexico City will be the first outside US expansion franchise. Way bigger market than Toronto and way more football fans and interest. Expansion anywhere is minimum 10 years away, if not longer.
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