Lawless whinnnnes about Henoc Muamba being a free agent

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If it wasn't enough that these College guys have to sign Pro contracts for the same money as a kid signing as a Private in the military. Lawless wants them tied up for 4 or 5 years and restrict their mobility.

Yet, the minute these kids become free agents, General Managers are beating each other up to sign them :wink:
Every time the CFL has negotiated with players, its been fun and games to keep their books hidden and skrew them over.

I am advocating that media guys and reporters work for a max. of $46 000 a year for five years :smiley:
Lawless once again is out to lunch.

Hell, if it worked like the real world, they'd be free agents, period. When I came out of university, a random company didn't have the option to say "if you want to work in the field you trained for, you have no choice but to work for us at whatever terms we dictate."

Nothing wrong with players becoming free agents at the time they do right now. If he's proven he can play at the CFL level, he should be allowed to get whatever salary the market is willing to pay.

No kidding. Average career is 4.6 seasons and dough boy wants them restricted for 4 to 5. :roll:

My opinion, it should be on an option year, if a team chooses to not exercise the option, they still retain the player's rights for that year, and the year after.


He has some good points. I see nothing wrong with a team having the right to match, making the player a restricted free agent after 2 years.

As for the numbers you are both way off the mark. The rookie minimum is 50k and if you think a Private makes 50k you need a serious education on military life. A full incentive Private is still short of that mark and a new Private makes less than $15 an hour. And Lawless is way off the mark saying after 3 years Winnipeg has "hundreds of thousands of dollars" invested in him. Probably in the 200k - 250k at most. That's not "hundreds of thousands" by any stretch.

Both of you are so far off your numbers are in the hyperbole range. :roll:

Right to match does not give the player the right to play in whatever geography he wants. That's a big thing, that Lawless ignores and has important cost/income importance for many CFL'ers. Free agency is free agency, right to match in a cap league is not free agency.

You didn't hear Taman complain to the media when he lost Butler and a half his Canadian talent. Hervey didn't cry to the media when Laurent walked. You won't hear Popp complain when Edem walks... You lose some and you win some. Winnipeg signed a bunch of other team's free agents in the off season.

Then you have the issue of possible collusion in a league with 9 teams that is not transparent and where ownership has shown over and over again that they will cook the system.

A Private walking out of the recruiting center makes around 2900.00 a month. Most CFL rookies end up on the practice squad at 600.00 a month 2400.00 a month. a formed private makes 4100.00 a month about the same as a CFL rookie who would be on the roster the entire season (how many of those are there every season? 1 to 4...) So in some cases the ODD CFL rookie will make more but in many many cases will make less.

Effective with the ratification of the 2014 CBA, all first CFL contract players must sign a standard player contract of one year, plus one additional year at the team's option, which effectively makes it a two year contract. This is contained in paragraph 15 of the standard player contract, which provides the member club an option to renew the contract on the same terms for another year at a minimum of 100% of the amount of the contract plus 100% of the amount of bonus payments specified in the contract, excluding any signing bonus. After fulfilling their option to renew a contract in this way, the member club will not have another option to renew the contract in this way. This option is available to member clubs for an additional year on any length of contract. There is no limit to the length of a contract. Starting in 2014, veteran players signing a CFL contract that is not their first are not required to have a team's option year added to the contract, therefore they may sign a single year contract. Teams must inform the player in writing before the expiry of the contract their intent to exercise their option to renew the contract. Players who do not have their option year picked up must be placed on waivers.

What I am saying, is if a team doesn't use the option to sign, that NFL teams can opt to pickup the player if they want, but the team retains the rights to the player for two years afterward if that happens. I'd also like to see CFL contracts be two years, plus and option year, where the player can use the option year to catch on with an NFL and opt to get out of his contract. Basically, make it an option for both team and player, and if the player opts to leave, the team keeps the rights to him for a year and a bit.

Thanks :thup:

Screw him, we signed Ian Wild.

Didn't really know him, so looked him up. Wikipedia is, at times, simply amazing. Someone's on the ball.

Professional career[edit]

After going undrafted in the 2012 NFL draft, Wild signed with the Buffalo Bills. He was released on May 14, 2012.[3]

Wild signed with the Winnipeg Blue Bombers prior to the 2013 season. On August 22, 2014, Wild set a franchise record with 14 tackles against the Montreal Alouettes.[4] He served as Winnipeg's long snapper. On January 23, 2015, Winnipeg released Wild so he could go to the NFL.[5]

On January 31, 2015, Wild signed with the Pittsburgh Steelers.[6]

On September 21, 2015, Wild signed with the Winnipeg Blue Bombers.

personally I'd like to see that the CFL team he left for the NFL have an option to have first dib's on him when he wants to return to the CFL irregardless of how long he was in the NFL for, and if they cant come to terms within a specified time limit then he becomes an unrestricted free agent.

Now you want to break it down to try and make it fit your incorrect math?

A full incentive Private makes the 4100/ month but that takes him 3 years to get to that pay level and that is for a full 12 months work. The minimum player salary as dictated by the Collective Bargaining Agreement is $51,000 in 2015, incremented by $1,000 per year for the remaining three years of the current CBA. Base salary plus pre-season compensation is paid over a five-month span, with playoff bonuses topping off compensation for an additional month of play for teams that qualify. Player salaries do not include earnings outside of football or endorsement and appearance fees.

The Private makes a little under 3k less, his salary has not changed in 2 years and he is paid for 12 months work versus 5 month. So in no case does a CFL rookie make less than a Private who has more experience in his job, works harder, for longer per year/month/day and risks more to get less than that CFL rookie gets for less than a half years work with no experience.

My math is not incorrect. I have a few kids I've coached who were in the reserves at 17 playing weekend warriors for a couple years who signed with reg force at 4100.00 one even got a bonus since he had a boiler room or welder similar ticket. Many of the guys they are taking now come from the reserves or come in with qualifiquations. Some start higher than privates

How much are guys like Anthony coady and others like him who pine for anywhere from a half a season to a couple years on the PR?

Oh and military start at 4 weeks paid vacation and more when they sail or operate abroad.

Fact remains very few rookies will collect a full 18 game worth.

Lawless is way off the mark by using the word "invested" at all. They don't have anything invested in him; they paid for his services and got them. That's it. They're entitled to absolutely nothing going forward.

That was over the top. Invested hundreds of thousands lol. He was their best player. They should write him a cheque.

Again you try to compare apples to oranges. A reservist gets the higher pay based on previous experience so you can't compare them to a rookie straight out of college. How about comparing them to a player who has done 2-3 years on the practice roster and is now made the team. Minimum salary 50k for 5-6 months work (which means 6 months vacation time) which is still way more than that full incentive Private.

34 years service here so you are not going to blow misimformation about pay by me.

I am all for free agency. The CFL has the best free agency system in pro sports. The only time that a player is not an FA is when he is drafted, or for the 10 days that he is on a neg list after he requests a contract.

Any league with a proper salary cap or at least decent budget parity has no need for restrictions on free agency. Free agency is good for players. Players deserve it. Careers are often short. Restricting their money is dumb. If a rookie or sophomore player happens to be an elite player in the league, he should have the right to earn elite money. Anyone who argues that rookies don't deserve money is full of it. Players are worth whatever the market bears. Anyone who argues that limiting rookie salaries is necessary to cut costs, I have have 2 words to whoop your agrument: salary cap. Everyone fits under the cap no matter their age or experience. Anyone who tries to argue against this tenet I will not even listen to it.

I can see an argument for a 'right-to-match' system IF you are talking about matching offers WITHIN the CFL. But Lawless' example is Muamba leaving Winnipeg for the NFL. You can't stop a player who's contract expires from going to the NFL (or any other league for that matter), and furthermore, you'd be a first class tool if you tried.

Ultimately, there would only be one example where any CFL club would even be able to AFFORD to match an NFL LEAGUE MINIMUM. That would be say Zach Collaros signing for league minimum in say Jacksonville and Hamilton matching that (approx 450 - which is Ray/Durant money - not out of line at all). I would be absolutely appalled if Collaros was denied heading south because Hamilton matched that offer. That would be ridiculous.

Like I said, I would entertain the idea of a 'right to match' system between offers from other CFL clubs only and the system that I would propose would be as follows. Every CFL contract has a plus-one option. If the team waives the option, the player can shop around, but once he signs an offer sheet, the original club has right to match, but if the team exercises the option to keep the guy one more year, the right to match is revoked. So the team makes a decision, keep the player 1 more year or let him find his price and match (or not).

That would be illegal. Or at least if the CFLPA agreed to that, it could be challenged in court and the CBA invalidated.

We also must remember that matching offers already exists in practice. Every year a handful of guys agree to an offer sheet with one club only to not fax back the signature and just show the sheet to their original club so that they can match it.

Dec 1st
Huf: We want to keep you.
Bo Levi: And I want to stay, but I also want to test the waters.
Huf: Ok.
Feb 15th
Bo Levi: Walters just sent me this sheet for 500k.
Huf: All right, I'll match. Use my pen.

The most famous public one was Richard Karikari back in 2006. Coming off a breakout season (may have even been rookie) he had 9 picks at safety for Montreal and was Canadian. Taman (of Winnipeg) himself leaked one night that he had agreed to terms with Karikari and the signing would be officially announced the next morning. But then the next morning Karikari re-signed with Popp and the Als for reportedly the same amount as the Taman offer (approx 90 or 95k). Taman admitted the next day that after he leaked the news, Karikari never faxed back the signed paper. This happens probably 3 to 6 times every year except we don't hear about it because most GMs aren't so dumb to leak their offer sheets to local radio before they are signed.