, Durant would be alright.I agree on your Nichols range as well. It's early though.Lots of time to get things worked out although it is a good time to get the jump on teams ( Montreal,Toronto) who are in transition.
......If I were Durant and looking for a decent landing spot IF not re-signed, Mont. and T.O. train wrecks are not on my list...especially if the Bombers are in play....I wouldn't pay Nichols more than 300k and we'll talk later....He hasn't proven much other than leading the team to a one and done playoff game....He just isn't worth the kind of coin he is 'rumoured' to be asking....Also it's not like we're left with no options if he doesn't re-sign...Apparently Walters said he has plan B,C, and D in place...Just what they are, is in the cards he's holding close to his vest....We'll see...One thing I do know after hearing Walters comment on Nichols (rumoured) ask, is that it isn't happening at those numbers. We were 'Willied' once and were fortunate to escape...we aren't going down that road a second time.
Bombers got “Willied” cuz a few short years ago they didn’t have anything but trash at the QB spot - and Durant’s backup (Willy) showed reasonable promise (big arm, moderate personality, fairly young) but he was in over his head in terms of being bomber saviour - once he started tasting helmet, turf and forearm shivers on a regular basis he basically morphed into mincemeat with a #5 as his target! Plan B for Walters was releasing Boxcar Willy outright - but then he would never have met up with McHale’s Navy in Toronto and received 1st overall pick plus an all-star DB (JT Heath). Nichols has all the makings of a football version of Andrew Ladd (a perceived top player who quickly degenerates into nothing more than a mope drawing an enormous guaranteed salary). Ladd is worse than a mope - he was like that as a Jet - however with tons of ice-time he managed to fool the population - - - - feel bad putting Nichols as a Ladd-type character. I actually think Matt is a far better athlete and would be worth a shot at $325k to $345k with some bonuses for TDs, playoff wins and Grey Cup(s) won!
I think Durant has about 2 or 3 good years left before his body totally breaks down. Good passer, far better runner than Durant - can extend the pocket by superior footwork and evasive manoeuvres. Jury says - DD is about an 8.25 as a passer with Nichols an 8.0. As a runner DD is about a 7.5 while Nichols tops out as a 6. Field generalship its far closer - I’d put both guys as 8s (perhaps slight edge to Nichols, very slight).
Big play advantage goes to Durant! :cowboy:
Sask;n might be the best fit for Nichols with far better import and national WRs than the bombers. Sask’s o-line is slightly above average - the bomber line promises to be slightly better but events out cuz Durant is more adept at buying time than Nichols.
......Think you meant Durant was a far better runner than Nichols....Can't see Durant out running himself :lol: ............... But Lyle, I agree and he certainly has better escape ability than Nichols...2 or 3 years left is probably right, but I think that get's us to a Cup game and maybe a Cup...The team is coming together nicely and a qb. like Durant who has been there before would be a nice acquisition IF....big IF he can stay healthy.....We know also that the Bombers have expressed interest in Franklin...I'm sure that is plan C if nothing else works out..So Plan A...re-sign Nichols.............Plan B...pursue Durant........Plan C Franklin... is the way I see it.
Thanks for catching my misprint on Durant out-running Durant Papa. Good scanning capability - you should be working for the bombers as a spotter!!!
Have to agree with Plan A, B, C...... A for re-signing Nichols (at well under $400k), B. Making a play on Durant & C. Franklin. Wonder what it would take to obtain both Durant & Nichols?
My guess - Nichols for $315k, Durant for $295 (plus time bonuses) and DD Davis for $75/85k. That's about $700k for a QB budget. Bit more than Wadzilla anticipated, I suspect!
Ideal would be Nichols or Durant @ $310k, Glenn @ $120k, Davis @ 80k - - - - - that's around $510k overall - about a $200k saving to be put into other areas of need. However, only one proven starter on the roster - as one can no longer call 38 yr old Kevin Glenn a legit starter, certainly NOT Davis. :cowboy:
.....Penton now chiming in today, that the Bombers have let it slip, that Nichols definitely wants 450K to re-up, verifying what Lawless said....See ya..at that price....He's NOT a Bo Levi...not even close and he wants that kinda moola....Get Durant on the speed dial and give Glenn a bump up as well as Davis if Matt sticks to those demands...This guy is pricing himself out of the market. :roll:
Penton coming in on Lawless info kinda reinforces it.
So be it!
I suspect Nichol's agent knows Matt only has a few short years of CFL service left (he's approaching 30 and the bombers seldom priorize protecting their QB as item #1) so he's trying to do the Triple H eye-gouge with a rather ridiculous opening gambit.
Listen, we all know Matt basically saved the franchise last year - Willy had gone mope, O'Shea's job was hanging by a thread and Walters was certainly in no position to re-neg his own contract. Only Chris Christie, Jr. (Wad) was safe from contractual exfoliation.
So not a bad idea from Nichol's agent - the bombers are not gonna turn the keys over to a 5'8", 38 yr old career field mouse (Glenn), nor Dominique Davis. The agent knows the bombers will come back low ($250 to $300k) and he knows Durant would have at least 2 serious suitors (perhaps 3 or 4) if a chase ensues.
If 450 is the early ask - the bombers come back at 300k - that's basically the start of negotiations. Nichols # would finally come in at $350 to $365k response by agent and Walters - then its a matter of term and signing bonus. The higher the salary the lower the term.
Can see a few options:
$325k salary with 3 year contract, $100,000 signing bonus every year before season starts and typical bonuses for wins, TD passes and playoff victories.
$375k salary with 2 year contract, $75,000 signing bonus each year and bonuses.
Bombers might be coerced to $400k number, but if and only if they determine they have little to no chance of signing Durant or Franklin. $400k would be 1 year only, $100k signing bonus plus blah blah blah.
I agree with what you say Lyle if we are only talking Winnipeg but I wonder if there might be a team or two who gladly pay his demands. Montreal might be the forerunner with Toronto second.....I'm hoping it's all bluff and the two sides get together. Be a shame to waste such a productive year knowing next year would be a smoother path with much the same pieces...Although Nichols doesn't seem to be the QB we would desire, I think he has a big heart and an accurate arm. There are too many variables and unknowns going with Durant or especially Franklin... I like the status quo with Glenn as insurance, but we need to get Davis some time.
You hit the nail on the head Dan. We don't know how desperate Montreal or Toronto might be at this point. Toronto has instant budget if they flush the Drew Willy Experiment down the crapper. Montreal is a hot mess right now - so Nichols and his agent might like to insert a steadying influence like Matt and be a hero in a fresh city with $400 to $450k cash in tow.
Corky Jones finds Durant repugnant (I believe) so his low-ball offer to DD is just that - feeble attempt to show rabid Sask'n fans they're still trying to sign him. So, at 34 Durant is really a free agent. . . . . . . and there's two eastern teams salivating - but the bombers seem to be committed to trying to re-sign Nichols before making their big play on Durant.
Losing Nichols and then the opportunity to sign Durant would leave the bombers in tatters. Yes, Glenn is out there with his field mouse act (great for a few games before cooling off), Henry Burris is an option for 1 year but at 42 and now with a pop-up knee problem Hank could easily extend our Grey Cup curse - for another $400,000. Franklin would have to be the real best bet but like Willy before him - he's mostly a reputation pivot, no playoff proof or extended season play. But Franklin, Davis & Glenn wouldn't be the end of the world. Might even be the start of a new bomber world. :cowboy:
......I think Durant is done in Regina...a lot of their fans think so as well,particularly after the Corkscrew threw his no 1 quarterback under the bus...backed up and did the deed again...Corkster inferring that Durant is only good if surrounded by good players, wouldn't endear his hc to Durant's heart all that much...Plus the fact that the riders offer looks like a 'slap in the face' Dressler/Chick offer, I think DD at that point said to himself 'I'm moving on'...He definitely is an option for us and the longer Nichols remains unsigned,Durant becomes a bigger option...Durant's other possible landing places are Mont. and T.O.....hardly a place I'd like to spend my last few years...We are Cup bound...they are in big rebuild mode....Besides Mont. has spent a lot...giving up a 1st rounder to the leos for Adams...He'll be their starter guaranteed and Durant is not going to play second fiddle to basically a rookie...He could start but how do they sell the Adams deal to the fans???A first round pick for a back-up :lol: T.O. is in a similar situation and if their management stays the same (which appears now to be the case) Barker is not going to bail on Willy and make himself look like the schmuck of the century in argoland...Don't forget...Ray is still on board there as of now and their boat is full... In any event,no matter how every thing shakes down, we are not behind the eight ball presently...We have room to maneuver and Nichols and his agent are well aware of that fact...Stick to his ridiculous asking price and we secure option two and that would be Durant....I'm sure there's a lot of dickering going on as we speak...even a possible deal with Durant IF Nichols isn't re-signed...We shall see.
Consequences of Kavis Reid being hired as Montreal GM . . .
aside: Kavis was not a particularly good head coach, decent assistant like most failed head coaches. immo he's also a very loyal man who lives and dies by his sometimes over-blown emotions. But no one can question his loyalty and that I believe is the main reason the Wettenhall clan will take him on as GM.
They're hoping his hi-level of commitment plus his extensive CFL knowledge will provide them another Ed Hervey - only Kavis has far more coaching experience than Ed Hervey! Far more!
Now, once Kavis is in place - he'll get active. And he'll get active real fast. Whilst Chris Christie, Jr. (Wad Miller), O'Shea & Walters are smokin' cigars and sniffing Chablis Kavis will be dialing 1-800-M.Nichols.
No question Nichols will be the #1 priority signing (within a confined dollar amount, not close to $450k btw). Nichols can not only mentor their highly-touted rookie/sophomore QB but he can also take on an extensive package of games (like he did in Wpg.). Ricky Ray would be priority #2, possibly a bit cheaper than Nichols - but Ray is nearly infirm, his body is breaking down and he can't squeeze many more games out of his body - he'd be a more cerebral mentor to the new boy!
#3 - probably Franklin. Franklin is high on everyone's chart it seems. Now, he's on Kavis Reids. Interesting January in store in the good 'ol CFL.... :cowboy:
......You could be right Lyle on Franklin and Mont., but wrong on Nichols...Mr. Consequences is familiar with his former teams roster and he knows quite well that Franklin made Nichols very expendable in schmoeville and knocked him out of the No. 2 slot....I think he tries to get a deal with Hervey for Franklin first...He'd certainly come cheaper than 450K and has more upside...The only fly in the oint. would be what Mont. would have to give the Esks. to acquire him....They're getting thin on draft picks and they're getting thin with canucks on their roster period...Als. could offer a lesser round pick and a rostered player...that might get it done as next year Franklin walks and they could end up with sweet tweet for him...We shall see if Hervey wants to do his former coach and now a gm compatriot a helping hand.. :roll:
So long as Reilly continues upright - Edmonton doesn't have a QB problem. So why not Ed Whatsayu a favour??? Perhaps a 4th & 7th rd pick this year, conditional 1st or 2nd rounder next year? Plus a roster player - if I were Hervey I'd want Bear Woods to fortify a shaky Edmonton defense!
Hervey can pick from a long list of hobos for his 2nd or 3rd string QB. Glenn? Willy (after getting cut in TO)? Lafaveour? even that big kid who served as a second stringer in the east for a time? How 'bout Ray comin' back to do a final tour in Edmonton as a low paid back-up/QB coach trainee? :cowboy:
The Als were rumored to be over the cap last year, even after letting Duron Carter go. Anything can happen I suppose, especially when you bring in new management that doesn't have the same attachments to long serving vets. Just look at what Jones did to the Riders. Still, $450K for Matt Nichols seems like a lot to fit into their cap, especially since they have Vernon Adams and gave up a first round pick to get him. Nichols potentially has his best years still ahead of him and would block Adams' path. Considering it's also said the Als paid Adams a large salary for a rookie CFL QB, if they sign Nichols they may have to move him. Who has the higher ceiling? Personally I'd pick Adams over Nichols.
Now that we have some stability in the front office and at coaching, we need some stability at QB. I just don't know if we can pay over $400K for what Nichols has shown he can deliver so far when we still have some key guys to re-sign and a couple of spots to upgrade if possible. If I'm Kyle Walters, I tell his agent I'll consider that after Nichols puts together another winning season or two and takes the Bombers to at least a West Division final if not the Grey Cup. Until then I have $350K for him.
As 2017 CFL Panic sets in on the frozen tundra of Winnipeg my number on Nichols has started to rise.
At first, I thought a $350,000 x 2 or 3 year package was where it would settle.
Now, not so sure!
Kavis Reed, now large and in charge in Montreal would gladly ramp it up to $380k, and find out where Nichols loyalties lay - to O'Shea & Walters or to his former coach and now Montreal GM, Mr. Kavis.
I do agree with Papazoola that Kavis might make a play on prying Franklin out of Ed Hervey's cold, dead hands. But if Hervey's price is too high and keeping in mind Montreal doesn't have much in the way of draft picks (they traded away a top one to get Vernon Adams) then Kavis might turn his gaze towards the bombers #1 pivot.
So right now - based on whats transpired in the last few days in Montreal - I think the bombers have to up their offer to Nichols - perhaps $380,000, with $100k guaranteed and the ability to earn as much as $120,000 thru performance bonuses (mostly playoff wins, MOP, Grey Cup ring). Continuity is important.
By the same token re: continuity. Unless the bombers seriously upgrade their defensive coaching, front D7 on D, there's a very good chance this team could be nothing more than a 9-9 (or worse) hobo squad in '17, and either miss the crossover or playoffs entirely! :cowboy:
.....Exactly wolverine, and that is smart negotiating...otherwise the cap hit to give Nichols what he wants now, will result in us cutting someone...We don't want to go down that road when we are trying to put together a winner...2 steps forward ...one step back sort of scenario and I hope Nichols realizes that fact..I think 350,000 is fair ,taking all into consideration BUT if he thinks he can get more some where else....good luck...see ya. That's the brutal side of football operations I suppose.
.....Nichols appears to be balking at what the Bombers are offering as a deal should've/could've been done by now.... :roll: Could we be going in a different direction????I can't see Walters coming close to what Matt thinks he's worth....For that kind of cash...as has been mentioned many times before...Durant would be a better option...Someone brought up Darian's injury woes the other day...All I had to say to that was Nichols doesn't possess an unblemished record in that regard as well...He suffered two very bad injuries in Edm. and could easily succumb to another as well as Durant or any other qb. as far as that goes...Durant is a superior quarterback as far as I'm concerned and would do nicely in a Cup run....There's also the possibility of a deal for Franklin as has been mentioned by Lawless...The duo of Glenn and Franklin wouldn't be that bad either as an option...Jennings proved you can perform at a high level quite quickly, given the starter position when you have the talent...All in all we can start counting the days now till free agency and something is going to give...Could get very interesting.
If Mutt Nichols is balking, so be it. Don't think Walters (w/ Miller in his ear) will bend to those demands. Demands will recede if no other teams are interested at that level.
The idea of Jimmy Franklin and Kev Glenn as our 1-2 punch is intriguing. Edmonton Ed might savage us for a net out trade to acquire Franklin - and who knows how Franklin gels with 'ol Mr. Plop?
Glenn is 38 yrs old and we saw a couple parts flying off the field mouse last year - I suspect this could be his final year as a #1, #2 or #3 QB in this league.
Davis gives us an in-between guy for reasonable coin - athletic, big arm, a couple years of camp experience in our country club. Should be an asset if Glenn or Franklin falter.
Dilly-dallying on Nichols is disturbing on a number of levels. Especially a group of tall foreheads who were in a rush to re-up the staggeringly ineffective Richie Hall as defensive coordinator. :cowboy:
......It's looking like it will be a contest between Mont. and the Riders for Durant services as Corky has upped his offer (smirking all the while trying to schmooze the locals lol)...He knows after his irking comments about Durant ( good qb. if surrounded by good talent) and the fact that most likely the Als. will pay big to get Darian on the dotted line, will produce the out Jonesie really wanted ...His new offer is most likely falling on deaf ears ...Durant 'could' be in Als. colours next year...Which brings us to our situation...IF DD is off the table who would/could we set our sights on if Nichols walks???...I would definitely pursue Franklin and keep that scenario very much in the picture...With Durant possibly gone in Regina I'm sure the Riders will be willing to give Hervey the farm for Franklin, but in a competition with us, I don't think he has the goods...I would imagine that Hervey has no luv at all for Corky in any event and would much rather deal with us...Of course if Franklin goes to either club he would present a threat in the division...Lot's can happen between now and free agency ( one month give or take) but I believe things will really get hot in the two weeks previous to fa....Crunch time approaching for the gm's.
...This just in....It looks like the pitch for Franklin is off the radar in Regina....too rich for them so it looks like they're backing out...Does that open a door for Walters who is reportedly interested....hmmmmm :roll: :roll:
If Franky Franklin is off the table in Regina its only because Edmonton demanded too much from Corky's depleted coffers - with respect to Durant - he's available because of his FA status - no trades are required.
I do know this - Winnipeg can't afford Durant, Nichols & Glenn - even if Nichols downgrades his demands to around $400k. Durant ain't gonna go to work for chicken feed - I suspect his number is around $310 to $330k w/ some bonuses for starts, TD passes and playoffs. Then Field Mouse Glenn would require they live up to his current contract (which is still the montreal package) prolly in the $175 to $215k range.
Can't fly the Avro Aero Bar with a QB tab of nearly 1 million.
Besides didn't they just re-up Domenic Davis on a 2-year?
If Nichols bolts, if the bombers can't pry Franklin from Hervey and Durant signs in Montreal the Blue Express pantry will be kinda empty - Davis, Glenn and the next hobo qb. :cowboy: