....I know we improved last year BUT did we improve 450,000K enough for a qb., being here a year and a half, and just making the playoffs???.....Don't see it...IF Nichols would have at least been part of a playoff win...I could maybe see it..But how do we know he doesn't tank like Willy and we end up with another anchor and a huge contract...I don't know what you guys think but I'm not in favour of a deal that would pay him that kind of dough this early...Cripes we may as well go after Durant..at least we know he quarterbacked a Cup winner in the past????Don't like where this is going...Thinking further I'd like to see us go after Franklin rather than pay Nichols that kind of cash...They both have quarterbacked a club to the same number of Cup wins... :roll: :roll:
I have to be totally objective here. Nichols was a real revelation after suffering thru a series of post Khari Jones mopes like Boxcar Willy, Dinwiddy, Alice Brink, Joey Elliott, Max Hall, Field Mouse Glenn, Stef Lefors, the brain-damaged guy, etc. Keep in mind Edmonton had two superior guys to just about anyone in the league not named Bo-Levi in Mitchell and Tate, thus the asking price for Nichols was extremely low and the bombers complied.
At $450k ask it puts a ton o' pressure on Wadzilla in the executive suite. I'm sure he wasn't even paying Fraud Willy that much. So the ask is reasonable - and remember its just an ask - if you really want $375k plus some term (3 yr contract w/ prepaid signing bonuses in lieu of guarantees) you have to ask much higher. So be it.
The fact Mike O'Shea moped/cowarded out on letting Nichols run that 3rd and 4 and put the toilet seat on Medlock speaks volumes about O'Shea's confidence in a guy who's primary skill is a solid game manager who manages to keep turnovers low. But O'Shea was the one who filched out on confidence - not the fans, not Ky Walters!
Big problem - if the bombers feel they can tie up Durant for a couple years at $350k that's Plan B. Plan C would be Henry Burris on a 1-year ticket in the $400k range w/ Kevin Glenn and DD Davis as the backups.
I think the Bombers were resigned to Nichols at $325 to $350k for two years - but not $450k for any number of years - particularly if you have to lay down $100,000+ for his cash signing bonus.
I was afraid of that, might as well see what Durant wants.
Anything over $300K with bonus incentives or $350K without would be a mistake. You don't pay a guy who has been a full time starter for all of 2/3 of a season and has yet to win a playoff game $450K and risk crippling the rest of your roster to accommodate that. And he really has no leverage. Basically Toronto and the Riders are the only two teams with potential openings at starting QB heading into the offseason. I doubt Chris Jones pays Nichols that much when he won't pay Durant, and the Argos can't, unless Ray retires or leaves perhaps, and likely won't pay that much even in that scenario.
Not that I necessarily want Durant but I think you can get him signed for $350K and he has a better and longer track record. Mind you I don't think you can count on Durant for 18 games. If you bring him in and you keep Dressler and Smith on the roster, that familiarity could lead to a lot of success. The biggest difference between paying a QB like Durant $350K and someone like Nichols $450K is you can get similar production and the difference can let you add another very good player to your roster or can be split up to help you retain 3-4 more of your free agents.
Yeah, may as well fly Durant in. Show him the bombers enhanced locker room, Obby Khan's food truck, Doug Brown's statue and all the empty seats in 2016.
Frankly if we rate the candidates:
Burris - even at 42 this guy can produce wins; keep in mind he was a bit jerky during the regular season; the nik-naks took first in east cuz nobody else wanted it but he played well in the EF and Grey Cup - 460+ yds passing speaks volumes. I'm sure everyone will want to know whats going on with his knee but in terms of passing velocity and accuracy Hank is superior to both Durant & Nichols.
Durant - 2nd oldest guy at nearly 35 but under played last 2 or 3 years. Not wanted in Regina, to be sure! At $350k to $400k for 1 season he's very viable and could fit into the O'Shea/Walters structure. Don't know if he can put as many points on the board as 42 yr old Hank.....
Nichols - probably a better game manager than the above guys; but doesn't possess escape hatch abilities like DD or Hank; some real problems in the red zone; if all the guys were asking $350k I'd actually pick Matt cuz he might be good for 2, 3 or 4 more years.
Burris has had his age hang over him for last few years - but he's produced. Check his knees out and hope like heck he can get a good bomber offense (add a solid Canuck WR, too) and he might represent the best hopes to get the bombers more playoff games. Burris might also get the bombers the maximum points amongst the 3 amigos - and we'll need every darn one of them if Rich Hall's Comedy Corner defense returns - as O'Shea has threatened
.....Bombers expressing interest in Franklin according to Lawless...I would say that is accurate...You would be a fool not to express interest...Now whether anything comes of it is another story...Franklin knocked Nichols out of the no 2 spot in Edm. making Matt dispensable and why we ended up with him...Could the same thing happen here????hmmm
We definitely have the goods to barter with (Hervey expressing interest in draft pics) Just exactly what he would want is another story...Talk is the Esks. are going to lose Derrell Walker.. Would Darvin Adams and a second and third rounder do it for the most important position on the club???I'd make that deal IF we could sign Franklin for at least 3 years, considering what Nichols asking price is...Durant would also be an option if Nichols doesn't pull in his horns and get into reality....Paying him Bo Levi money just ain't gonna happen.
I've got a gut feeling that BB maybe looking at a new HC as well.
O'Shea, if you can believe Grey Cup buzz,, has gone incommunicado with Walters as far as re-signing.
Perhaps waiting for shoe to drop in TO?
Stoic Mike O'Shea is no different than any other coach or GM when it comes to loyalty. Their main loyalty is to the dollar bill. Can't blame O'Shea for trying to better his lot in life - he kinda knows what Walters & Miller can offer him - now he can explore a few weeks of free agency. The chances of him taking over in any other city than Toronto are few and far between. Don't know what Toronto ownership (regardless of whether they still have McHale's Nave (Barker) in charge) sees in the guy. He's a certified offensive no-mind, a defensive guy who defers to even less talented men (Hall) and a decent special teams coach (nothing special).
The real key is whether Paul "PLOP" LaPolice is ready for his 2nd go-around as a CFL head coach. Personally, I think he is. Plop's problem is he's one of the worst player disciplinarians in the history of the league - absolutely terrified of confronting players and fellow coaches. Great coach but that's his primary weakness. O'Shea isn't afraid of anyone - he's just a well below average head coach - and his career .401 winning percentage confirms it.
…Wouldn’t be all that up set if Mike O pulls the plug and heads back east…It really is all about the money…loyalty and player luv be-damned…I also believe that Lapolice will be a better head coach second time around…Much more seasoned and wise…He just has to get a better DC and we would be good to go… IF Mikey wants a big extended deal…Walters may not be prepared to go down that road considering his head coaching record …Who knows how this will all play out :roll: :roll: :roll:
I'm a big fan of Paul Plop but the big question is - if the team decides to let O'Shea float stoically in the wind.
Plop, me and Kyle are gonna offer you the head coaching job. Nice bump in guaranteed salary - from $170k/yr. to $340k w/ two year guarantee. Only question - is we're kinda in a money crunch before having to go begging to the Premier's office - so are you prepared to keep Rich Hall as your DC?
If Plop answers YES - he hasn't learned a thing. He's immediately laying down an anchor and hurting the organization. Rich Hall has no business being a coordinator anywhere other than junior or CIS, that's it. Even normally lemming-like bomber fans are nearly united in removing him from his job. He's awful. Plain and simple.
But if Plop is forced to keep him just to get a far bigger paycheque then Lapolice hasn't really learned much over his 20+ year coaching career.
......I believe, like others, that the domino's will start to drop when Argo's decide in which direction they're headed...IF a head coaching job is open in TO, then O'Shea will definitely get a look....He's an Ontario lad and being really close to home could be attractive...On top of that he has cut his teeth in the head coaching ranks now, and the Arenogoods would luv to have their prodigal son return....We have a back-up plan in place in Lapo BUT the defensive co-ordinator job has to be wide open...Who's out there???Stubler would most likely retire IF he doesn't stay on to help Mikey...Is there any other qualified, quality candidates ready to step up???All a lot of conjecture right now but I do know one thing, if this club decides to stay with the status quo, we'll be lucky to see post season next year.
If Plop takes the HC cap in Winnipeg then who becomes OC. Buck Pierce is a nice guy but he was too dumb to ignore concussion signals and played concussed. Ain't no smarts there! Also question whether Buck has the coaching smarts to defeat top shelf d-coordinators. He's not ready now - perhaps he'll never be ready!
My money would have to be on Plop retaining the OC job for himself and working with an upstairs agent in the box - to spot weaknesses and pass along intel. As far as defensive coordinator is concerned - Stubler is way too old, almost infirm now. Benevides might be OK but his antics are pretty tiring. Reinbold is a rather limited coach - even with vast experience his best spot is special teams, even at 62 yrs of age.
Noel Thorpe? Steinhauer? Sgt. Slaughter, Greg Marshall?
I don't think Thorpe wants anything to do with a franchise with the poor image the bombers have. Likewise Steinhauer. Better find someone better than Hall, I tell you - cuz that guy's purely a boat anchor.
The FG decision was a bad one, but I just don't get why so many people in the city want to see O'Shea let go. We're coming off an 11 win season, our first post season appearance in too long, went 5-5 in the tougher of the two divisions where only Calgary had a winning record, turning into a player in the loaded West. Free agents that sign here, like Justin Medlock, say they wanted to play for Mike O'Shea. Overall winning percentage as a HC is still below .500 but he's managed to keep the team competitive more often than not. The team and roster are moving in the right direction and by all accounts we had a solid locker room environment. Keeping him gives the franchise some stability that we've been needing forever.
Lapo's win percentage as a HC with the Bombers was just over .350. I get he had a subpar roster thanks to one of the worst GMs in CFL history, but I think he gets too much of a pass for that. He could never figure out how to handle the team and simultaneously handling the OC duties and he's not likely to give those up. Remember he had Jamie Baressi as an OC but was in effect the acting OC so even if he's forced to hire an OC he's still likely to remain heavily involved. The offense was almost always terrible with him in that dual role. He also had his fair share of questionable coaching decisions that cost us a few wins and there was disharmony in the locker room. Maybe he did learn something from his first go around, but what if he didn't? How long a leash do you give a guy with a .350 win percentage? If he goes 5-6 wins in his first year as a HC and his track record, does he get another?
IMO you work hard to keep O'Shea and keep some continuity. Any consideration of Lapo as a Bombers head coach should be nothing more than a fall back option if O'Shea leaves on his own, abd only because he coached here last year and offers some continuation.
Many people feel that O'Shea, with the limited coaching experience he had, didn't deserve the HC job with the Bombers.
Can't blame the team for trying. O'Shea was the only candidate not tainted by prior head coaching experience, yet he'd been in the league in one shape or another for nearly 20 years.
I don't think Miller & Walters had any idea the guy would morph into Sgt. Slaughter, Jr. with his stoic demeanour and freezing up under pressure.
I'm not actually advocating for O'Shea's dismissal - BUT if he's playing games, waiting for the Argos to pull the trigger on Milanovich then Bombers have to have a back up plan. Other than his fear of players and the locker room is there any facet that Plop is worse than O'Shea? Didn't think so!
The main problem is if the team switches to Plop - you lose the only guy who has decent special teams abilities (O'Shea) and you inherit a coaching staff consisting mostly of mopes, especially Hall of Horrors. Where does Walters, Miller & Lapolice find better ones is the question of the year. NO?
Lyle B Style, why do you think your stupid nicknames are funny?
…Read around the funny handles…Lyle makes some good points
.......If we don't hear something soon on O'Shea's future..I'd say there's definitely something in the wind....I would like him to stay on BUT if he does decide to move on, we better be prepared for that eventuality
That’s a fair question before and after he was hired, it’s a fair question after how the 2015 season went. I’m not sure you can make that same case after 11 wins, especially considering all the coaching that was needed to overcome all the injuries to our secondary and receivers almost the entire season and to both Wild and Bass late in the year. There’s a case to be made for moving on from O’Shea for a number of reasons, he’s not perfect by any stretch, but wouldn’t it or shouldn’t it be for someone with a more proven track record? The case for Lapo seems to be he’s more experienced and maybe he’s learned something from his last go round. For me, Lapo’s got a great track record as an OC and a lousy one as a HC, so maybe being a good OC is just his ceiling.
It’s still early. Lapo is a bit of a security blanket if things go south I guess. It may feed the rumors he wants to return to Toronto. I guess getting him to come back would be seen as a coup for the Argos, Ontario guy, former Argo and hall of famer. They haven’t fired Milanovich as of yet though. Still, O’Shea had remarked several times that he and his family have become Winnipeger’s now, so I’m hopeful he wants to return. If he does bolt for Toronto, that could spell bad news for retaining a couple of our FA’s who may join him out east.
I think a lot of stuff said at the end of season - primarily about Miller & Walters having their #1 priority in re-upping O'Shea and Matt Nichols was politically correct bunk!
Same with O'Shea laying claim to Winterpeg as his city of choice and becoming a real citizen.
So its no surprise that Miller/Walters haven't followed up with either of their to-do list priorities. Even after giving the Lions a real run for their money in the WSF.
Now its really up in the air, although the answer could simply be the entire bomber organization (other than the retail shop) has gone into temporary hibernation.
Unlike Tennessee Tenacious (aka Corky Jones) who has all hands on deck - signing a couple bomber mopes + scouting the NCAA & NFL double-hard. Of course, last year Old Corky decided to hibernate during much of the regular season - rider fans - the ones who can still think straight are somewhat infuriated!