Is a 3-4 defence a possibiliy?

I've been thinking that since we lack defensive linemen, and we have a great linebacking core (Johnson, Williams, Knowlton) and have (by my count) three Canadian Linebackers capable of making the team (Eiben, Mariuz and if he's able to show up, Plesius) we could have a 3-4 which would put our good linebackers to use instead of having them sitting on the bench while minimizing the damage done to us from our struggling d-line.

Or maybe I'm just crazy...

Any feedback?

I'm with you on that Beast, I think going to a 3/4 might not be a bad idea.

But it's corps not core :smiley:

Anyway, if they do go to a 3/4, I sure hope they don't think of moving either JJ or Knowlton inside; they should stay at Sam and Will, and have Mariuz/Eiben play in the middle with Williams. Correct me if I'm wrong (and lord knows it wouldn't be the first time), but haven't both Mariuz and Eiben played MLB in the past ?

Anyway, if they do go to a 3/4 and either Mariuz or Eiben is one of the MLBs, it provides some ratio flexibility elsewhere, so I do think your idea has merit.

So no, you're not crazy !

Or, if you are crazy, then that makes two of us.

Three crazy people, if you count me. Our LB to DL ratio sure points in that direction right now.

I always thought that the 3-4 in the CFL game opened you up against the run, but I remember some pretty stout 3-4 run defenses for the Argos in the early 2000s.

And Greg Peach played in the 3-4 in college, where he had some success.

Oh, and Casey Creehan's dad, Denny Creehan, ran a 3-4 defense when he was defensive coordinator in Calgary.

You still need to create pressure on the quarterback. The biggest question mark going into camp is on the ends, so you still either have to find two good new defensive ends, or you spend a lot of time having outside linebackers step up to play as de facto ends. I think our LBs are all too small to spend a lot of time battling the big dogs on the line. Unless you have three MONSTERS on the line, the LBs aren't truly free to the extent they would be when they blitz from a 4-3.

The high-profile linebackers on the team are listed at the following weights:
Williams: 238
Johnson: 222
Knowlton: 205
Eiben: 216
Mariuz: 228

I don't think you want any of these guys to spend a lot of time trying to battle O-linemen heads up, and I think you get forced to do that if you run a 3-4.

Nice idea but I doubt it happens.

Bang on. To run a 3-4, you need at least one and preferably two tweener LBs who can line up in pass rush, run-stop, or drop into shallow coverage as needed. I don't think Hamilton has the size at LB to make a 3-4 feasible.

I do Eiben as a 3-4 outside linebacker a couple years ago when the Argos ran a 3-4.

I like the idea but we don't have the depth to be honest.

After our starting 3, you have 2 guys (eiben and mariuz) who might have a year or two left and are more there for emergencies and special teams.

No matter what happens we need to build depth in the front 7.

I think you need a beast on the nose if you're running a 3-4 as your primary defence. A Doug Brown type of run stuffer would be nice. In passing situations last year, we often rushed 3 and dropped 9 but seldom did 3 pressure the quarterback. Maybe Obie has recruited the nose we need. Training camp will tell us. :smiley:

Pat Lynch(the old guy)

I agree with both PatLynch and safetyblitz. D-line is a bit of a question mark this season for the Cats; I don't think it's the right time to run a 3-4, when you'll need a stud nose-tackle to make that alignment viable and at least one 250 lbs. tweener LB to fill that Jack role off the edge. Moreover, it's debatable whether Eiben and Mariuz are even starters at this stage in their respective careers. This should be a season to let the best personnel dictate the formations and schemes while Creehan puts his stamp on the D. Hopefully the D-line solidifies and allows Creehan to try new things as the season progresses.

To run a 3-4 you need to have a very good defense. You need a physical freak at nose-tackle and your need athletic linebackers who can fill the gaps.

Baltimore Ravens run a 3-4 defense perfectly, but thats because they have the weapons to do so. You have Ngata jamming everything up in the middle so Ray Lewis and co can roam free and blow up any running plays. Then you need an elite pass rusher to get to the quarterback, which the Ravens have in Terell Suggs (who is technically a linebacker but plays end).

I dont know if we have the talent to pull of a 3-4 defense and I highly doubt we will even try.

Jeff Reinbold is apparently going to try a 3-4 in Montreal. Here are the sizes of their linebackers at the moment:

215
238
204
240
228
230
185 (Chip Cox is tiny!)
235
210
245

Some big guys, some small guys, but that spread of weights doesn't look too different from ours.

As for their big nose tackle, their biggest defender is J.P. Bekasiak, who is 300lbs .....We have Maurice Forbes at 300lbs. (though I'd be surprised if either of those guys is the starter).

As for our "tweener" linebacker, I feel that Renauld Williams could easily fill that role

It could be that we're not talented enough on the defensive line to run the 3-4, but I don't think that size is an issue. This isn't the NFL, remember. Speed and agility plays a bigger role here, and there is less emphasis on the running game, so you can't really use the size of players in an NFL 3-4 scheme as a good comparison to what we need here.

i Think we would need a true Nose Tackle to have 3 =4 defence ....

We currently do not have one ...

I f we had him we could play an extra Canadian at LB in Eiben IN THE Middle with Rey Williams and jamal and markith on the outside and Peach and Rose at the ENDS .

I hope in the next few days we will see some more DLINE and OLINE candidates and maybe a signing or tow to help out the lines like Anwar Stewart and OLINEMAN Tyler Robertson

Well, we have 4 guys there close to, at, or over 240 lbs. That's significant. You need someone in that weight range to be the rush tweener. The size of the SAM backer (Cox for us, Knowlton for you) isn't relevant, since that LB isn't going to pass-rush except on a blitz anyway. As well, one of our backers, Rod Davis, is exactly the kind of hybrid LB / rush end who could work well in a 3-4. He's coming from Edmonton, who ran a 3-4 under Stubler last season, so he's well-acquainted with how to be effective.

Hamilton, by my count (and I could be wrong), only has 1 guy in the tweener weight range (Williams). Mariuz is close, but do you really see him as a starter at this stage in his career? He's a backup now, nothing more. If Williams gets injured, who can credibly fill his role?

As for their big nose tackle, their biggest defender is J.P. Bekasiak, who is 300lbs .....We have Maurice Forbes at 300lbs. (though I'd be surprised if either of those guys is the starter).
Nose tackle isn't necessarily about NFL-type size, but rather raw athletic ability. Having said that, there is still no official confirmation that Reinebold plans to run a 3-4 in Montreal. Reporters and fans have speculated, and the coaches have admitted they're looking into it, but it's by no means certain.

Also, look for JP to be battling for a starting Canadian spot on the D-line this season. I wouldn't at all be surprised to see him win a spot.

This isn't the NFL, remember. Speed and agility plays a bigger role here, and there is less emphasis on the running game, so you can't really use the size of players in an NFL 3-4 scheme as a good comparison to what we need here.
This is a good point, but in the same vein, defenses in the CFL line up a yard off the ball, which might hamper the efficiency of a 3-4 defense based on speed and ball pursuit. I don't think it's accidental that the 3-4 is usually only a specialty alignment for most CFL defenses, rather than the base formation. Unless you have precisely the right personnel AND a defensive guru like Stubler running the show, it won't be terribly effective.

Well, I certainly just lost that debate. waves white flag

And if anyone questions why I would only listen to an Als fan, and none of my fellow ticats fans...............I plead the fifth.

(Which in Canada apparently means "I plead the right to replace ferry service between PEI and the mainland with a fixed bridge".)

:lol: Nice!