Halifax: Build it and they will come...or not?

Personally I think Toronto is expendable especially since Hamilton is getting almost new digs. Two teams so close aren't needed in southern Ontario. The key is not Toronto, it's getting a team out east I think. How much does Toronto add even with corporate support as it is? The Argos in the Skydome are not needed for the league. The marketing of the CFL is going to be based on coast to coast and a team needs to get out east. I mean really, Toronto isn't a big draw anywhere outside of Hamilton. And Grey Cups need to work in a 30,000 seat model, that's another thing the CFL needs to realize.

I hear you about soccer jaybird, it's not my game, I find it very boring to watch, but it's cheap, much cheaper than football and still gives a reason for people to get outside and go to a game if that's what they are looking for. Who knows, since Canada is sort of cheap overall :wink: maybe the CFL will turn into the Canadian division of the MLS (god forbid :o :wink: ) But hey, it's all football as they say. :wink: (hmm, MLS franchises are $40 mill though!, better go with the next league or two down though.)

Check out the forum Other and the thread "Soccer as Entertainment". :wink:

I fully agree Geroy

Any city that has a 25,000 seat stadium and solid ownership is capable of getting a CFL franchise.

Halifax is going to try to get Federal money for their new stadium for the Womens World Cup Soccer Tournament.
This is for Amateur soccer which fits the criteria for Federal funding(Just like the Federal portion for the pan am games going to IWS2 for amateur soccer).

If both Halifax and Moncton have 25,000 seat stadiums with strong ownership I am sure the CFL would welcome them with open arms.

That would be awesome Grover, it's not like Halifax and Moncton are that close really, geographically.


" You need the corporate sector not just fans and there is no corporate sector in Halifax or Moncton."

mike: Does the name "Irving" ring a bell?
And whats wrong with a bunch of medium sized investors...corporate or otherwise?

And whats wrong with a bunch of medium sized investors...corporate or otherwise?

Exactly 62. The CFL should be about "small is good and works" on this model. To allow for smaller cities to join. That's what I love about the league, it shouldn't need large corporations to work. If the MLS can work in a 20,000 seater for it's championship game with $40 mill franchise fees, well, the CFL should be able to do something similar with far less franchise fees. If that makes sense I suppose, sort of a weird comparison I agree. But a Grey Cup in a 25,000-30,000 seater should make sense.

I wonder if the BANK OF NOVA SCOTIA (the third largest bank in our Nation) has roots in Nova Scotia.

Michelin Tires is a huge employer.

The Fishing industry



I think you are absolutely right when you write about the importance of the Grey Cup.
CFL, ORFU, Northern Football Conference.....whatever. The main thing is that the Grey Cup is the symbol of championship football in Canada, no matter how the game is represented. Right now the CFL is the name of the game and how it is sold but 50 years from now who the heck knows what will happen. But regardless, no matter what level football is played at then, (pro, semi pro, amateur) the Grey Cup will always be the ultimate prize.
In the meantime, the CFL is Canada's football league and I hope it stays that way.
But the league has to make a big effort in the next 10 years to make sure more regions of Canada are represented. New fans are needed to ensure future growth. 20 thousand should be the minimum stadium size to allow new teams to be formed.
It's up to the people who run the CFL's business to be good stewards of the game and do everything possible to represent all regions of the country.
Football is historically Canada's game as much as hockey. If Gary Bettman ( :thdn: ) can back hockey franchises in the desert states, surely we should be able to arrange a structure to get one CFL team somewhere in Eastern Canada in the near future.

Hamilton isn't exactly brimming with major corporate headquarters, and yet... we have corporate sponsors!

There's also McCain's. Sabian, one of the worlds largest cymbal makers, is based in New Brunswick (maybe they wouldn't make the best corporate sponsor, but who knows?). I imagine there are many smaller corporations in the area as well.

Perhaps community ownership is a good model for an East Coast team. It it seems to be working well for Saskatchewan, Winnipeg, and Edmonton.

If Gary Bettman ( ) can back hockey franchises in the desert states, surely we should be able to arrange a structure to get one CFL team somewhere in Eastern Canada in the near future.

Bingo. :thup: I think the future of the league depends on this much much more than having two teams in southern Ontario so close.

Metro Halifax has a population of 420,000

Metro Moncton has a population of 125,000

If Halifax can get their Fed. Funding they will get a new stadium and would probably jump ahead of Moncton for a franchise.

Moncton would need the drive up crowd from Fredricton, Saint John, Sackville and PEI to be successful.

Moncton Stadium would need a serious upgrade to accomodate a franchise.

"The Moncton Stadium is a track and field stadium on the campus of the Université de Moncton in Moncton, New Brunswick, Canada, built to host the IAAF 2010 World Junior Championships in Athletics.[2] The $17 million venue opened in 2010. Although seating capacity had fluctuated early in construction (original plans called for as many as 28,000 seats), the stadium has 10,000 permanent seats, and is expandable to 20,725 via temporary seating.[1]

The facility has also been proposed as a potential venue for a future Canadian Football League (CFL) expansion team, but a significant expansion to 25,000 seats would be recommended."

This is perfect information, it really appears that both Halifax(with a new Stadium) and Moncton (with a stadium upgrade) are tremendous candidates for CFL expansion.

Thought I said exactly this in words on page 1 but if a table helps.... okay. The issue is drive distance. In Sask. the whole pop. supports the riders. In the Maritimes, the Halifax and Moncton zones start to overlap at the 2 hr. drive distance.

So, will Maritimers drive 2+ hrs. Will the zones overlap too much to support 2 teams.
I DO think one is quite possible. I would LOVE two.

I would rather have a small city like Moncton, Regina or Saskatoon than the wannabe Toronto and Vancouver any day of the week.
There is much more up side with a "smaller" market with no other pro sport and the chances of making money like we see in Saskatchewan is like no other.
After Moncton becomes the next franchise, I do not see why Saskatoon cannot come in and make a boat load of money.
Quebec City would also be one of those jewels except they have the crazy notion of an overated NHL franchise. How sad.

The NFL isn't coming to Toronto so for those crapping on the CFL because it's not the "big show" guess what...it's the only one in town.

That's a super post ArgoT :thup: and expresses my thoughts exactly, even growing up as an Argo fan in London, Ont. The CFL is doing the right thing though having the 100th GC in Toronto where it started but in the future if the Argos relocate out east, Toronto could become a place for an ex or regular season game for nostalgia, and out of respect for the city and the history of Canadian football there. But a team out east, Toronto isn't needed and especially as I say with Hamilton get new digs. Braley should start making waves in Toronto about a new stadium and if Toronto can't do it, move the team. And if they can do, all the power to Toronto but I don't see it happening personally. Can you imagine, the CFL doing very well and not having a team in Toronto. Not wishing for this by any stretch but if it should come to this and work out well, I won't be crying at all and will have a tad of a smile on my face, with no disrespect to the great Argo fans that is.

And this is what I like about no Argo-Ticat Labour Day game this year, it will show that Hamilton can stand on it's own without Toronto here. I really hope it sells out, well, hope all our games sell out but that might be stretching it I admit.

NFL looks at the Buffalo - Toronto area as one area IMHO and right now, Buffalo has the far superior football stadium so I don't see the NFL in Toronto at all any time soon as long as the Bills exist in Buffalo. And is Toronto going to build an NFL stadium with no guarranteed team? No, that will not happen.

how many people are going to drive 2+ hours to Moncton, when the team is having a bad season or 2...or more???

thats asking fans to drive about 4 hours each game for a 3 hour game to witness a poor team.
many would just watch on tv.

bad seasons ( all teams have them ) will possibly break the team if they are relying soley on the population of moncton.

halifax has a large enough population that local residents will still come to games if the team isn't doing well, because they wont have to ask themselves, 'is it worth the long drive?'.

people who compare monctons potential to sask. are forgetting 2005 when the riders were only drawing 21,000 a game.

True enough dg, I always thought of Moncton as the same pop more or less than Halifax, and that is just not the case. Both are isolated "out there" and not close to any really big city like a Montreal. The east is weird, huge area but not a lot of people live there. Halifax is bigger but is it "better" for pro sports? I don't know.

The only thing tha works in Halifax are Celtic bars and wing nights. No shitting ya.

Lots of rich music though from out east HfxTC, Joel Plaskett who is extremely talented and had the opportunity of seeing him in a small intimate venue in The Studio here, with The Emergency, so I can't say I agree with what you're saying, with all due respect to the fact you know the city and area much better than myself.

That's what the CFL should be, smaller intimate venues, Argos are better out east in a 23,000 seater than the soulless Skydome.

Wife and me love Snow Patrol but wouldn't go see them at the ACC or Copps if they came, would be stupid.