Ejections from Above?

CFL Talk
#1

Just throwing this out there as an idea. I know there would be lots of issues to work out, but I thought it might be an interesting idea....

In the last three minutes of the game, the people in the booth upstairs can call for a review, to make sure that a call is not blown. It's extra protection for both the integrity of the game, and for the refs, who become reviled if they miss a big call.

Would it be possible to do the same for ejections? It's obvious to everyone who was watching TV that Rasouli should have been ejected; however, the officials missed it. Would it be possible to implement a rule where a flagrant penalty (i.e. one that would result in an ejection) could be called from the booth, or at least brought to the attention of the refs?

To defend the refs on that play, there was a lot happening. I was specifically watching the ref right there during the replays, and he happened to look up at another part of the pile at just the wrong moment, and didn't look down again until the helmet was off. This type of rule would do the same as a booth-review at the end of the game - save the refs some grief and make sure that something big isn't missed.

Thoughts?

#2

I would fully support that kind of move on the part of the league. It would have been good to have the Commissioner call the Officials at 1/2 Time and issue and immediate suspension. The league must send a message that this type of action will not be tolerated. Of course, they wimped out the last time they issued a suspension, so what should we really expect?

#3

Yah that was no good what happened. You can't really blame the refs, they can't see everything, especially when so much is happening all at once.

Since he got away with what should have been a game ejection, that player should definitely be suspended for one game.

#4

I agree that he should be suspended, but we'll see what happens. Especially considering the precedent set earlier this year.

Sidenote:
I'm curious, when the arbitrator looked at previous examples of throwing helmets, did any of those precedents involve tossing some one else's helmets, or was it always a player tossing his own. Big difference in my opinion.

#5

Throwing a helmet should be a suspendable offense, whether it's yours or someone elses shouldn't matter.

It's the fact that it's dangerous, it's like in hockey when someone gets hit from behind into the boards and isn't hurt, doesn't make the hit more tolerable.

#6

I agree what is this a hockey game? if its that bad wait for the guy after the game we will see how many tuff guys there really are they cant hide behind a ref and wait to pull a guy off ... hockey what a joke

#7

I think it's a pretty good idea. It would certain help. I mean, #18 getting the boot and not Rasouli was a complete joke.

As for the whole precedent thing... I think this incident is different. From what I remember, Gass just ripped the helmet off and tossed it. I don't think he was ever accused of throwing punches. Rasouli threw about 3 punches, got in a knee, and also ripped a helmet off someone's head. He should definitely be suspended for a game and fined.

#8

He should get at least 2 games - normally he would have been tossed from this game and then got 1 more. Since he was left to play it needs to be 2 or it will be a reward of sorts.

#9

The way I see it, and I know this will never happen, but it sure would be nice and the "fairest" solution..... is when something like this is missed and the guy who should have been booted was not, and continues to play, thus helping his team and hindering the victimized team, his suspension should be served if and when they play again. Why should another team benefit from the cheap shots given to the player of another team. I mean in this situation there is no guarantee that BC and the Riders will play again, but it would be nice if he got the boot in the playoffs. Although this would likely lead to all kinds of scraps when Hamilton plays any team for the last time of the season. Or an alternative to that is they serve the suspension against that team if they play again, but if not, just do as they normally do..... which is lift the suspension =) Just my early morning rant.

Go Riders!!

#10

Unfortunately, the precident the Gass play set is now that ripping another players helmet off is okay.
In the arbitration hearing Gass argued that "precident" said no suspension was warranted.
Now in Rasouli's case, he can argue, "well they didn't suspend Gass".
It could be a vicious circle.

#11

The trouble with video replay is that it is limited in what you can see. You only see what the top guys are doing, not what is happening underneath . The refs can see a lot under there that the video can not so to just base it only on video is a farce. What were they doing to JJ to get the BC players so riled up? To the know-it-alls here that is irrelevant , but in reality it is not. The video only shows you maybe 30% of what happened so who else do you have to rely on for the rest? The refs and each players word , you got nothing else.
This really is getting to be a load of bull being passed along here.

#12

The fact of the matter is that, right or wrong, all appearances are that the officials got the wrong guy, and missed way more than one of the right guys. When the CBC broadcasters are openly criticizing the officials, and are able to make a good case for their complaints, that's a problem for the league.

Replay might help, but this particular crew (Andre Proulx and company) have a record of refusing to overturn their own calls even when video replay shows them to be wrong. (I'm not talking about the controversial TD last night here...I'm talking in general over the season)

The sad, simple truth is that no matter how much we love this game, until they get competent and consistent officiating, it will be considered a second-string bush league (not my words, but words I have heard repeatedly here in BC to describe the CFL). There have been complaints from every team, and every fan base about this issue.

I don't know what the solution is, but I'm guessing it would involve more pay and more training. Give these guys enough that they can make it a job, rather than just a weekend gig. Get them training and watching film all week, just like the players do. And fine them or dock their pay when they make a game-changing mistake. Some weeds will have to be plucked, but generally, they have a good group of officials to work with.

Just once, I'd like to see a weekend with a full slate of games where not one final outcome is affected or tainted by bad calls.

#13

Yes, I believe the one from the guy in Ottawa, the big D-linemen was for tossing someone elses helmet. I am not sure about Otis Floyd’s. Then there was Dave Dickenson from the side of the field to bench that hit someone, it was his own helmet.

#14

Thanks, Mikejth. I only remembered Dickenson and I think someone mentioned (long time ago) a Toronto or Hamilton player throwing his own helmet into the stands, and those were the only ones I was sure about.

And Pennw, I agree with you that video replay can't pick up what's going on beneath the pile. I'm not suggesting that video replay be used by itself or take over the role of the refs, but as a supplement to pick up flagrant fouls that are missed. And by that, I mean only offenses that would result in ejections - anything more and it gets too unwieldy.

And just because we can't see some offences that may (or may not) be happening on the bottom of the pile, doesn't mean that we should ignore those offenses that we CAN see.

#15

Being one of the ones who dislikes instant replay to begin with my answer is.....NO! (Surprised?) :lol:

The league has a process in place where caoches can send film in. The league will fine & suspend as required.

First replay,

:roll: then replay for ejections, :roll: then will come replay for fouls. I see a six hour game comming. :roll:
#16

The officials did as good a job as can be expected under the circumstances. Two dozen guys jumping on top of each other, fists flying, kicking, helmets sailing through the air; they're going to miss things. I'd just be concerned with getting out alive.

I'm surprised they missed Rasouli, with him being on top of the pile when he was swinging, but they saw some stuff that we didn't.

I don't even know what #18 did that earned him a disqualification. Every replay of the incident I've seen, I've never been able to figure out where he is.

I hope the league suspends Rasouli for the helmet toss, even though it will be overturned on appeal (likely by some judge with Lions tickets :wink:) They have to keep suspending these guys to send a message that it will not be tolerated by the league, even if it is tolerated by the courts.

#17

Mark Cohon Pm'd me today. He appointed RoarLionsRoar,Lionbacker, and myself to sit on the appeal board this week. Not to worry Big Dave, we'll look at it objectively, just like the Edmonton judge did! :roll:

#18

I thought the league called a judge from BC in by the name of Rasouli. I wonder if he is a relative.

#19

Why does naming RLR in a position of authority of any kind send a chill down my spine? :?

#20

"Hey, did you see that brawl between the Riders and Lions on Saturday night?"

That question will be asked over and over again this week from CFL fans across the country. It's a tell-all of who fought who, who got the most shots in an what effect it had on the game.

Now did Saturday's second quarter melee add excitement to the game, or take something away in terms of image?

Most people who know me know what I think - that fighting in football is stupid and that while guys should be allowed to get loose and play, they should never be allowed to get out of control. A fight in football definitely takes something away from the game.

But I also liked it!

Perhaps the neanderthal in me has come to the forefront and my educated, intelligent side is suppressed, but it was a bit of a rush to watch this.

As far as the combatants were concerned, Sherko Haji-Rasouli should be fined a significant amount of money for punching a player who could not punch back as his appendages were being pinned. On top of that, the blows with the knee were something you would see from a 2am street fight between drunks. What Sherko did was an embarrassment to himself and the Lions.

Rob Murphy was, well, Rob Murphy. He pinned down John Chick and had a moment to deliver a blow, but he didn't. I couldn't tell what Cory Rodgers was doing, although it sounded like he was the one who started all the stuff outside the norm of 'football violence.'

At the other end of the field, were the Riders innocent through all of this? Heck no! Grabbing the arms and hands to dislodge the ball after the play ends is illegal.

So far, there have been 10 ejections this season for unsportsmanlike conduct. For hardened football fans, that's not a big deal. They know the emotion of the game and know that emotion can sometimes overtake common sense. But when it comes to sending the right message to younger fans, it does send the wrong image.

Football is not about being a thug - it's about being a smart and polished athlete in a tough sport. The last social element you want on your team are the ones who have trouble dealing with society. I know for a fact that Lions offensive line coach Dan Dorazio is a teacher of technique and effort, not violence.

From a bigger picture, let's not blow this incident up too big. The league should assess the sitaution with the game tape they have, draw a conclusion and move on.

This is certainly a moment for CFL Commissioner Mark Cohon to get involved, especially after the A.J. Gass incident where his absence did little to create confidence in his leadership.

Now I'll admit, the brawl generated a lot of energy in me - but I was also unimpressed. Anyone can fight, but there are a select few who can actually play football.

Will it happen again? Of course.

But just take it for what it's worth, and move on. The integrity of the game is the first priority, even it it's tested now and then.