Yeah...just like the individual awards, there should be one nominee from the East and one from the West. I hope Bouno wins it. He may coach BC now but I remember seeing him play for the Als when I was a kid. Plus, the ceremonies are being held here.
I think three is a good number. Most of the time you could probably find three viable candidates. This year was just wacky though, what with coachs being fired left and right.
Why 3 candidates? In an 8 team league it doesn't make much sense. Why not just have 1 from the east and 1 from the west?
Secondly, why don't they do this at the end of the year, not 3 months after Grey Cup. The whole thing looks bush league.
Wow I think sporty he is comparing me to a recent release of Microsoft. RW2005 lite, RW2005 upgrade, RW2005 Business, RW2005 dislikes Bouno. Sounds like it does it not. But really Wally deserves this one. He patched up a very bad oline from the year before and really was a force all season long. As far as Berry is concerned you do not get awards for what if’s. And you do not get awards (Pinball) because of adversity. It is coaching and there is no doubt Wally B was the best coach last year. Now I need to drink a bottle of Wild Turkey to get that thought out of my mind.
For those that think improvement = award, what about a great coach whose team get two back to back 15 win seasons, and the second season was with a completely different set of players. oops, no improvement = no award I guess. You can’t just make it cut and dried on one issue. Ya gots to be able to look at the whole picture, including adversity. It should be possible for a team to get 1 or 2 less wins with the coach still having done the best job with what he had to work with.
I assume that he has pointed out things done in Calgary, now being done in BC…like finishing first year after year and winning championships? Gotta hate that if you are a fan…
Anyway, I don’t blame you for fearing the coach of the year curse, but Wally has won it twice and survived, so he should be okay.
Regarding some of the general comments, Pinball is obviously not a contender to win, but the Argos actually did okay this year given the injuries they sustained. And the rules say 3 guys will be nominated…maybe Lancaster?
Some think Wally should be a lock because of the great season and the Grey Cup win.
And that Berry and the Bombers were just average.
But keep in mind most people likely saw the Lions as favourites to win it all before the season started, while the Bombers were almost universally picked to finish 8th in an 8 team league.
Coaches don’t necessarily win these things because their team lived up to expectations, ie., the Leos. They win coach of the year when a team exceeds expectations, ie., the Bombers.
Using that formula, Berry should win.
And he would be my pick.
However it is close and I think Wally will win…
Arius it is one thing to be looked at as favorites to win a season and be Grey Cup favorites but to start the season with these expectations and to win it all is another. Yes Wally did great things in Calgary as well but it is not Wally the Coach I dislike but Wally the GM.
Berry coached in the weaker division IMO. Yes he won a few extra games but does this warrant coach of the year. One thing I guess is he has Taman to blame if he does not win. Taman is the guy resposnible in finding talent. Last year he added a few free agents thanks to the dispersal of players of the Gades. Other then that what has he found lately. So Berry has it tougher for sure.
What R&W2005 and I were refering to, was the "Bad" side of Wally. It is that sometimes he can be bull headed, and continue on with a bad decision. I've seen it in BC and R&W has seen it in Calgary. When I weigh the Pro's and Con's, I'll take Wally because the Pro's out weigh the Con's.
Its just annoying when he goes on these little "power trips" from time to time. Would I keep him? You bet I will.
In 2006, Las Vegas oddsmakers ranked BC as 5th favourite team to win the grey cup behind Toronto, Montreal, Calgary and Edmonton. So BC exceeded expectations. But after 2005, BC was underrated. Losing streaks can be misleading as with Montreal in 2006.
Just goes to show that Vegas knows squat about the CFL.
Rob Vanstone and Vegas were apparently the only ones who did not see BC as a contender.
Rare were the people who thought that an East team really had much chance last year, and many picked BC to finish first in the West. Anyone who saw Edmonton as more than an afterthought (see Rob Vanstone) wasn't paying attention.
I think the only question marks were the o-line and Dickenson's health--both were sore points for BC, but in the end, the o-line, while still mediocre, was better, and DD was just healthy enough.
Anyway. Everyone saw Winnipeg as doormats last year.
You might argue that BC exceeded expectations slightly, but Winnipeg blew them away.
But as I said, it is a close call between Wally and Berry. I would chose Berry, but I think Wally will win.
I think it will come down to how the "Wally is the best and deserves it" vs. "just another day in the life of Wally" camps vote.
Meanwhile, if Wally is bull-headed, he likely is not alone. If you don't like his personality, fine. But it is tough to find much fault with the football acumen of the soon to be winningest coach in CFL history.
I would of course be interested to hear a list of these "bad decisions" that apparently define Wally for 2005. I can't really think of one at the moment...a few as coach, but not as GM. Playing DD in Regina last year when he was obviously concussed was pretty "bull-headed". But that was a coaching issue.
Deciding how good a GM is is always about weighing pros and cons. Every GM has some of both. If he has more pros than cons, then he will be successful.
Or let me put it another way.
2005, I would love to have Wally as the Rider's GM. Anyday of the week!!
I would send ET packing tomorrow....
There were numerous times players publicly came out and stated Wally the GM is unfair. You see Arius Wally the coach comes out on the field and says your the greatest player I have seen in that position only for Wally the GM to tell him in his office he ain’tworth squat. Yes that is the role of a GM no doubt you try to get the player as cheaply as possible. But it is very hard to hold both roles and have the respect of your players. Ask Carl Kidd he will tell you. Ask Allen Pitts who probably would have played another year or two if it was not for the split personality Wally has. OOh and how many coaching mistakes did he have over the 90’s that cost the Stamps many important games. Yup I am sorry but Wally is not the rosey picture you paint him. Does he deserve to win the COY this year you bet but just do not ask the players. Oh another would Casey Printers oh the games Wally can play. Sooner or later players will get fed up with his nice guy bad guy act. Thats MO!
Many on this forum had picked BC to finish in last place for '06 prior to the season due to their '05 finish & losing Printers. Go read some pre-season predictions if you don't believe it Arius . I know because I found those predictions very frustrating on account of them being baseless .
I don't need to go back and look at predictions on these forums (before my time anyway)as they are largely irrelevant. No doubt some people picked the Lions for last. I know Rob Vanstone did, but I also know he knows nothing about football....
As you state yourself, such predictions were baseless.
Therefore, who cares?
If you pick a team for last, be prepared to give a rational explanation as to why, or go away.
For example, picking the Lions to finish last because they lost Casey Printers? How does that make sense?
He wasn't going to play if Dickenson was healthy. He was also a cancer on the team and the Lions were better off without him.
Therefore, on two different levels, it is illogical to state a team will do poorly because they lost the back-up QB who was also a problem in the lockerroom.
Now, if you actually look at the coaching staff and the talent on the field, clearly they were contenders based on those facts.
I am not saying you needed to pick the Lions to finish first, or win it all. But if you picked them for last....pass the reefer....as you say, baseless!
I don't believe I am painting a rosy picture of Wally. At least I am not trying to.
All GMs and coaches make mistakes.
And you yourself concede the difficulty in doing both roles.
You think it was easy for Roy Shivers to tell quality guys like David Benefield or Travis Moore to take a 50% pay cut? And then to, in another year or two, tell them it was the end?
And when your GM or your coach tells you that, some players accept the fact, some do not. Some become bitter, some do not.
Travis Moore said a few unpleasant things about Roy, but took the pay cut and played anyway. Are they still friends? I don't know. Doesn't matter. Travis was done. He apparently didn't know it, so somebody needed to tell him so.
We released a better, younger linebacker in Jackie Mitchel this year than Karl Kidd. I think Kidd is likely done. Is he unhappy? Does he like being told that? I doubt it.
And maybe he can play another year or two. Doesn't mean the Lions don't have a better LB in camp.
And when the guy backing you up is better, and younger, and cheaper, who would you play?
I don't really know anything about the Pitts story, but I can tell you that A) I felt he was near the end, and B) if he could still play, why did nobody pick him up? I love Don Narcisse. But Roy cut him loose. Don said he could still play, tried to find a home, but could not. Lots of players go through that moment in time.
Doesn't mean Wally is a bad GM. And even if a player goes on and plays well elsewhere, is not a reason to slam the GM/coach. Unless that is all that he ever does.
If Pitts and Kidd are the best/only thing you got, then I think you are proving that Wally is in fact doing an excellent job.
As for winning as a coach, I thought you just hated him as a GM? Maybe that is someone else.
But I think his record speaks for itself. I hate Don Matthews, but I'll never disparage his ability to coach. Calgary, under the Wally regime, was THE dominant team in the CFL for over a decade, with 3 Grey Cups (I suppose you preferred the 80s?). And now in BC, 3 first place finishes in a row, 2 Cup appearances, one victory. I think he has earned the right to cut Carl Kidd if he so desires.
Arius it does not matter what I think of Wally Bouno really. The fact is the Lions from the start of the season were the team to beat and they followed through right to winning the GC. I would have to say that coaching and the GM would have lots to do with that. That is why I have stated Wally should win this hands down. Again I do like the guy. Yes coaches make mistakes no doubt about it. I found with Wally he makes mistakes in big games. The fans in BC should love the guy but they will see disappointments in some of the mistakes he will make.
I guess we agree he will likely win the award. And while I personally think Berry deserves it more, I have no problem with Wally winning.
As for your assessment of Wally making all these mistakes, I still can't see it.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess this is mostly about Alan Pitts. And you bring up Carl Kidd as "proof" of that type of thing.
Well I suppose Wally might actually handle such situations differently. I don't really know what you think he did wrong, so I can't tell you what.
But from where I sit, Carl Kid is likely washed up.
And Alan Pitts was better off quitting when he did than trying to hang on and getting cut in training camp, or mid season.
I prefer a coach/GM to tell his players the reality, than to watch star players try and play past their time.
It is hard. Likely the hardest thing a coach or GM ever does. To have a class act, and superb talent like Alan Pitts play his whole career under Wally, and then have Wally put in a position to tell that player his time is over...it doesn't get harder than that.
But was that a mistake? Probably not.
As for making actual coaching errors, sure, Wally makes a few. Who doesn't?
But if you are trying to tell me that Calgary should have won 5 or 6 Cups but did not because of mistakes Wally made as a coach, I'm gonna have to call you on that.
That's just crazy talk.
The guy wins about 11 games a year, goes to the Cup every 2-3 years, and wins a Cup about every 4 years. Crappy coaching like that would make most fans pretty darned happy. Making mistakes in the big game? Well you have to get to the big game to make 'em. Danny Barret never ever made a mistake in a big game. I guess that's why everyone loves him!
I'll give an example of a "mistake" Wally supposedly made in the "big game".
Playing Dickenson instead of Printers in the Cup.
But you know what? I doubt that was a mistake. Want to know why?
Because Dave Dickenson is a better QB than Casey Printers. Was then, is now.
So the "mistake" would have been to play Printers....
Here's another "mistake" for you. Doug Flutie stunk out the joint at Taylor Field in 1995. Maybe Wally should have given him the hook.....?
Anyway, I still await your comprehensive list of these game losing mistakes you are certain Wally has made.
I'm bored arguing about just whether Wally is good or bad. Concrete examples are what we need.
Well Arius we could go on and on about this and frankly the fact we agree with the topic is the only thing that matters. I could possibly come up with more but again you would refuted them anyway right. Your mind is made up that Wally is a great coach and GM. I for one am not. For every person that dislikes him there are probably ten that likes him. It is my opinion that he is not as great or good as people make him out to be. Many fail to realize that Wally usually surrounds himself with very good assistants that make up the difference. In the case of the 90's he had great assistants. Again there is not point continuing this debate. We would never get to the point of agreement on this issue.
It is funny the Pitts would not make a return to Calgary until he was out of here. For a player to be that ticked at him there must be more to this story right. However, over time Wally and Pitts must have made up because when he was inducted this year Pitts being a classy guy that he is stated he had a great time in Calgary. Yes you are right the role of GM is to tell a player he must move on. There is a right way and wrong way I believe Wally chooses the wrong way. But who am I to judge him right. I think Ned Flanders is a better coach to tell you the truth but again my opinion. Oh yes Ned makes mistakes as well.
OK then, its settled
It should not be pinball!
...if it's not pinball....and it ain't Berry....then we have a winner....Wally Ball kicks a$$ AGAIN....When one considers the success the Lions had last year ..Buono should take the honours...i picked the leos to finish lower in the standings in 06... shows ya,you can never underestimate Wally...he's been around this league for a long time....and it shows.... i mean in a good way
Just to be clear, I am here the last couple of days because I am bored.
No football? Even NFL? For a whole week? Nuthin' better to do but argue with 2005.
Anyway, I think we are nearly done, unless someone else interjects.
And I do get that you don't like Wally, irrational or not....like I said...I hate Don Matthews, you hate Wally, lots of people hate Roy Shivers, some like Tillman, I think he is a little slimy, and on it goes.
I'm just going to sum up by stating that consistantly surrounding yourself with good people is not a flaw, but rather proof that you are good. So if Wally found quality people to work with him, that is evidence of Wally's ability and integrity, not proof of any character flaws or lack of ability?
Surely you can see that? Coaches/GMs hire people they know, trust and respect. And they only work for people they know, trust and respect.
If Wally had/has good people surrounding him, it goes against your theories, not supports them.
Wally can sound a little arrogant in his attitudes and treatment of people/players. But defining that as making "mistakes" is a big stretch.
As I said, the bottom line is winning. And for me, loyalty. And Wally does show players loyalty, and the team, and the community. If it were not for the 3-ring circus Calgary called an ownership group, Wally would still be in Calgary. I respect that.
Anyway, just to drag this out, two former 'Smo coaches were run out of town on a rail for losing "the big game". Ron Lancaster called the Danny Mac naked bootleg, and was in Hamilton the next year.
Great call by the way, by a great coach.
Tom Higgins called the fake punt; clearly cost them the game and he is now coaching in Calgary.
The best coach in the league over the last several years.
Now, my challenge to you, if you care to continue is...name that big coaching decision Wally made that cost you a game.
It likely won't change my mind. But if you can't even come up with one, just one example of these big game deciding mistakes Wally made, that you continually say he does, then I really am baffled.
Come on. You must have one...just one lousy call to back your claim.