Even though there is no comparison between the two, there have been rumblings the last few years how this NFL now called Europa experiment is bleeding the owners mega dollars to operate.
Even though I am against any possible arrangement, what if the NFL after the Europe thing is toast, approached the CFL and asked to use each team and let's say pay for 5 "developmental players" salary plus whatever management fees are involved.

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The NFL losing $US30 million a year to help promote the league in Europe is probably poor business. With their cancelled game in China, in shows few people outside the U.S. care about American football.

Would I like the NFL to give the CFL $150 million over the next five years instead of NFLE? Yes, but there would be strings attached.

There is no way the CFL could allow player transfers to the NFL while the CFL season is still playing. The spectre of that Calgary punt returner (Allen) who left the Stamps in their playoff run, to sit on the bench in St. Louis, then getting cut and has disappeared...should never happen.

Even if the NFL paid their full salaries and agreed not to call up any allocated players during the CFL season, "unless they were emergency injury callups", I still don't like the idea. Every team would have these NFL untouchables who could loaf and not pay attention and not be really part of the team...knowing they won't be cut and will be gone next year to the NFL. This would be bad for the CFL. They don't need the NFL or they're allocated players. Just cut 'em, and we'll sign them for peanuts! :stuck_out_tongue:

How about relocate NFL Europe teams to Halifax, Ottawa and Quebec. The talent may not be quite as good, but thrown in a CFL quarterback and build your team from there. A 10 team CFL league would be perfect.

A 10 team CFL league would be perfect?
That sounds like expansion thread material to me.

Sorry other than that i have no comment.

This seems like odd timing to me. The NFL is rumored to be staging a Chiefs 'home' game in Germany for the 2008 season. Such games may become more and more common (especially if they implement the 17-game schedule that is currently under consideration). The NFL will be able generate interest through those games and take the opportunity to market NFL Europa as well. Giving perks (like first dibs for tickets to NFL games in Germany or the Netherlands) to NFLE season ticket holders would also drive up demand.

Although NFL Europa is definitely failing in some cities, to say few people outside the U.S. care about the NFL is untrue. The NFL will hold a regular season game in London at Wembley stadium this year between the Giants and the Dolphins. They sold 40,000 tickets in 90 minutes and will easily sell out the 90,000 seat stadium.

What about even closer to the US. In Canada, we all love the CFL here, it is definately the more exciting of the 2, but its not like 80% of dont watch and enjoy watching the NFL.

There's usually a pretty big difference in how many people care about a sport after the honeymoon wears off. They get giant crowds for one-time NFL games because it's mostly a novelty. If they played 16 games a season there they might not get half that many.

On the other hand, huge cities like Mexico City and London and a few others have enough people that they might get big crowds for a game of tiddlywinks.


That said, there are ways the CFL could sign a deal with the NFL to.. increase their partnership.

Part of this deal would most definitly include be getting the NFL to help the CFL in a stadium building plan(so get part of the funds from the NFL stadium plan)(something like fund 25% of a new stadium)

If CFL teams got NFL players/draft picks(basicly on 1 year + options)
in their camps whose salary would be covered(still count against the SMS though)
Then that's fine.

Those players could have their rights dispersed by CFL teams possibly by aligning each CFL team with a NFL division(8 division - 8 CFL teams)

These NFL players would get either 70 or 90K CAD in salaries + would all be CFL rookies.

Move the CFL season earlier(which it should be anyways) so CFL TC's start up mid-early may, making the CFL season end around 1st-2nd week of november.

Now most guys who would be "assigned" would be young prospects, draft picks. There would be no requirement by the CFL to keep players, there would be no introduction of NFL rules or removal of the Ratio.

Yes this does Favor the CFL greatly, but the NFL has no leverage over the CFL.
The CFL however can provide room for 1-2 of each NFL teams better prospects, yes that isn't much but unless the NFL wants to make a NFL 2 in the US there is no other option really.(4-8 NFL prospects per CFL team IN TC)

I do know this is very unlikely, but it could end up being very beneficial to both leagues, it also has very little chance of creating losses for the NFL, this deal would cost 2.5M CAD a year on players(32 players) + 5-10M to help stadiums*

more room for NFL prospects can easily be made should the NFL help put 2-4 more teams in canada

They don't make the cut, they get cut.
NO NO NO CFL players going to the NFL during the CFL season.

NFL can't deal.. ohwell.

Hey Barnes, that's like this first post in a long time that you didn't talk about luxury boxes! Good on ya, man!

I shouldn't post when i come home from the bar.

The Americans just do not get it.

They think because a sport is popular in their country, the rest of the world will also want to be part of it?

Like, until the rest of the world actually takes up the bloody game as a sport, and can produce their own players who can be competetive, like has happened in hockey for example, American football will never make it outside of their borders.

Americnas won't watch soccer because they consider it a foreign game. So why then would the rest of the world care about American football, which is a foreign game to them?

The answer? They won't. Because just like Americans only want to watch their own, so do other countries. Which is why the NFL will never be a world league. Because its not a world sport.

berezin99 -- No, it is you who just doesn't get it. The majority of American fans could care less if the NFL is successful outside the US.

It is the NFL that wants to market the game outside the US. They don't expect the rest of the world to 'want to be a part of it' -- they've been marketing themselves in certain markets for decades. The reception for regular season NFL football from Mexican fans and British fans shows it is paying off. Of course American football will not be a 'world sport' in the sense of soccer anytime soon (if ever), but it can still be successful on a smaller scale. It is in the NFL's own interest to market the game outside the US.

Players who don't get drafted should read this from this article before thinking about trying for the NFL as a walk-on:

Fewer and fewer undrafted players get starting jobs these days because teams are better at selecting. With all the information available to teams these days, it's hard for quality players to slip through the cracks.

I give Jesse Lumsden and others credit for going after their dreams of making the NFL and the big money and prestige but the chances are not as good as before if what this guy is saying has any merit.

Soccer is king in Europe. The NFL will always be a marginal sport over there. Glad to see the NFL is finally realizing that they need to cut their losses. And it means a bigger talent pool for the CFL!

As long as the CFL can retain it's identity as unique with the rules for the most part, then some of scenarios mentioned here and others for cooperation with the NFL should be welcomed by all, it's just in our own best interests to have the NFL on our side I believe. As I say, as long as we have say in our rules and other things, for the most part.

Dmont your hillarious. Barnes might not talk about luxery boxes but I will.
The NFL in Canada could work.
If Asper would bring a NFL team to Winnipeg that would rock!!!
Ya, he is letting the Community owned the Stadium, what Stadiums in the CFL aren't City/Province owned? the Rogers center, that's all folks. Even Molsons in Montreal is owned by the gov(Universities are a government service as 50% of their funding is through taxes)

McFaddens NHL dreams do matter, because he is LYING! that is the main thing showing he wants successful sports in manitoba and he says he's done all this progress to make it happen, but why has he not talked to Asper? If Asper said he had talked to McFadden then ok.

What's this BS? He's even letting the Community own the stadium? Well he better, if he funds 1/3 of the stadium and he owned it I'd like to understand the logic there.

But while it's Community owned, Part of the Deal is a LONG TERM + CHEAP Lease. How can that not be factord in?
The BB are worth atleast 18M(3M bank account + 15M team worth atleast)
The land is worth 30M(Barren)

Meaning that's 48M, JUST to buy the Bombers and current Bombers land. No where in there is it included the new Stadium plan, and retail development has nothing to do with it either.

How is he putting up all the risk?
If his plan was to move forward it's not like construction starts before Fed/Prov funding is started.

It's a Risk to build Retail/offices on the most desirable land in Winnipeg?
It's a Risk to own the Bombers in a new Stadium that is sure to increase profits, as Fans can fit in their Seats, there are Luxury Boxes. Right there is atleast a 1.5M yearly Revenue difference, add in the 500-750K boost in revenues from TSN, Asper is making money off the team + the retail/offices.
1-2 concerts in the stadium he can make pretty good returns on his investment no?
1 grey cup atleast every 8 year?(should be a 5-6M profit with no need of temp Mass seating)
He was on the BoG just a few years ago was he not? so he knows what to do there, there is no risk of him being lost at the helm.

Yes he is putting up 40M, but the feds need to put up 40 and the Prov needs to put of 40.

that means tax payers are putting up 80M$ to lease out a stadium long term, sell a team(worth 18M+) and handover a 30M peice of land that's leased to a city owned body for 45 more years(is it?)

Does it seem like the Community is getting a solid return on their investment?

Now if it's a 50/50 split on Stadium financing(Asper 60M, Prov + Feds 60M)
And Asper doesn't get full ownership, allowing enough community ownership just to:
1.Prevent the team from moving/folding.
2.Take over should something happen to Asper.

Then it's a great deal.

Doer will be good with it.
Why does Doer need to support one of the 4 proposals you showed?
How many fans supported one of those 4?
Most fans/voters will go with one if it's the best option, not necessairly because they like it.

They'll look at it and go... I really hate this major part but other then that it's ok.
that could be location or Ownership or Stadium Design.

Let's go through the list:
1.Refurbishment - 25M$ investment so canad Inns stadium can last 10 more years.

2.Ex Grounds - Moving the team very far away from Downtown(20-30 mins?) completely against downtown revitalization.

3.Canad Inns - Biggest issue is stadium funding, the complete understand of where all that Money for the 265M$ stadium(public part of it) would be coming from.
Alot of Fans Anti-St.B

4.Handing the team over to David Asper because he offers up 40M$ so he gets a 30M$ peice of land + 18M$(or more) team.

Now I love Aspers Stadium and alot of his plan, but the 40M for Long term Lease of the land + Stadium + ownership of the team... Doesn't add up.

There are other ways around it, if the Stadium is Leased to Asper for 1M+ per year and he cannot move the team or fold the team for 50 years(moving could be within the City limits) and Can Never move the team out of Manitoba(saying perhaps he moves it to Ex grounds or some place like that)

Hey that works, he then has to pay the City a nice Chunk of Change yearly though.

NO - NO and triple NO!!!!

What has been hurting the CFL for years in terms of perception and in turn support - is the idea that it is the minor leagues - bush league football - a place for guys who couldn't make it to the NFL.

Any kind of feeder system from our great league into the NFL would only strengthen this perception just when the corner was being turned (In terms of the league being more widely accepted as a 'different game'). The CFL bash league would have a field day.

Any partnership with the NFL that goes beyond the appearance of two pro leagues working together to expand the game of football - a marketing mistake.

You all know those NFL/CFL basher kind of dudes - how you going to defend our league from being called a feeder/monor league when that's exactly how its performing?

lol, soccer is king everywhere except for North America

I like the idea of the NFL pumping some of their excess millions into the Canada, fans who understand and love football, rather than into Europe or Asia. On the face of it, it makes sense.

I also liked the idea of an NFLE expansion team in Halifax, perhaps that would play in the CFL? The NFL could facilitate the stadium deal and stock the team with developmental NFL players. One from each NFL team (32), with 10 Canadians added to help explain the rules.

To counter that, how about an All-Canadian team in Ottawa? Finally a team of Canadians in the CFL, which has been long sought after by many. This select team could be operated by the CFL, with the fed. gov't as an anchor sponsor.

And the coup de gras, an All-Francophone team in Quebec City! Backed by the Caisse Populaire and the prov. gov't, the Quebec Flying Francophones would stock francophone players only and do battle against the existing 8-team CFL grid, the Ottawa National Selects, and the Halifax NFL Invaders!!

Crazy idea, but it would add some pizzaz to the CFL schedule! Imagine the rivalry throughout the league!! An All-Canadian team, an All-American team, and an All-Francophone team, Wowza!!! (I'd put my money on the Canucks! [no, on second thought I'd put my money on the Lions!!])

lol, soccer is king everywhere except for North America
p.s. In England, soccer is the number one televised sport. Quess what is No. 2? Darts. Number 3 is Billiards...getting the highest TV ratings! I guess if I didn't have the CFL, NFL, NHL, MLB, NBA, College Football, ect, and only had a choice between darts or billiards, I'd probably be a soccer fan too!

NFL Canada would be a good for Canada and the CFL. Luxury Boxes sold to magor corporations would finance a solid NFL team in any major Canadian City.

You may not need luxury boxes but it sure helps a team survive, 40 Luxury boxes = atleast 500K$ per year.
500K is a large chunk of ticket revenues.(not counting from food/drinks in the boxes)

Frank Clair is a bad stadium, for reported conditions(I would like to see pics better pics of it)

Concessions deal that handcuffs a team out of alot of money(not sure but I'd think 400-500K atleast yearly)
Not to mention Rent that is 150K more then the Argos pay.
Can't sell naming rights of the stadium(200-300K per year)

Look at all the $$ that is lost, no wonder how easily Gades died considering how much their missing money their missing/lossing.
Right there that's 1.5M atleast per Year, with no ability to get Revenue from non-football events as they don't own/have the lease of the stadium even just for during the Season.

Frank Clair is a good reason why the Renegades died off, fans didn't help by bailing for the 2005 Season(before the Gliebermans) but both had their part + the City of Ottawa(for making some bad deals(for the Gades), taxes)