CFL franchises will profit more than '16 toronto blue jays

This year a fun fact that every single CFL franchise including the Argonauts will profit more than the Toronto Blue Jays.
They are only intending a profit of approx $2m - which is one of the lowest in the Major Leagues.

But valued over $900m due to ownership of stadium / tv-deal minus cdn dollar exchange / and assistance of MLB franchises that hold value over a purchase due to relocation and assets of the MLB.

Some people wax on about what a sad state the Argos are in but their average attendance was only 3,500 under Montreal. That's not too bad considering the Argos were a nomadic team over the past few years. Evicted, homeless, neglected and un-loved. Things are so bad they might almost turn a profit this year (Madani projected the Argos break-even at 18,000 tickets). Heck, with the Grey Cup profits there will actually be millions in profits despite all the gloom and doom from the press. The Argos will make millions this year! Not too bad for a team in such a state. :smiley:

The facts are there's nothing that wrong with the Argos. They could easily draw an average of 24,000 fans next year, with a more exciting team and the schedule re-normalized...and with a keen eye on the ticket prices. Then what will people complain about? There must be a crisis or this isn't Canadian football. :wink:

Another fact is the Jays lost money every season since Rogers bought the team in 2000 until 2015. Some years the Jays lost $50M to $60M. Ted Rogers stated he lost $300M in the first 8 years of Jays ownership (but it was worth it, he said, for the branding opportunity to the millions of fans who came to Skydome every season. He said that was worth $500M.)

The media go apoplectic if the Argos lose $1M to $2M but the Jays can lose $50M and nobody says peep. Forbes also projected TFC lost US$12M last year. Nobody talks about that, except that the MLS is more popular (with TFC supposedly averaging 39,000 viewers), because...well just because. :roll:

As has been pointed out dozens of times here - Rogers can shift money around because they are the only MLB owner who also own 100% of the sports network that covers their games.

As has been discussed in the TV ratings thread the Jays have among the highest TV ratings of their broadcasts of any MLB team - and teams whose local ratings are nowhere near the ratings Toronto get - receive in the $75 million and up range for TV rights - with the Dodgers up to $200 million now.

The last figure known for the Jays is Rogers assigned $36 million for TV rights revenue to the Jays a few years ago - but no figures have been released recently.

[url=] ... mlb-teams/[/url]

If the CFL is getting over $40 million from TSN for 81 regular season games + playoffs - with a regular season average of about 700,000 viewers - what do you think the value is for the Jays TV rights with twice as many games (162 games) - at an average of 1.0 million viewers this past season?

With their ratings these days - as others have pointed out - those rights are likely worth in excess of $100 million dollars. Add to that the over $50 million (USD) they get with the new national MLB deal and over 3 million through the gates - and the Rogers empire overall is making a boatload of money off the Jays these days. Heck - their 5 game playoff gate revenue alone was probably as much if not more than most CFL teams season long gate revenues. With Rogers getting $4 - $5 million per game in gate revenue. (Plus all the concessions since they own their own stadium too).

FYI - in an attempt to try to sell out the stadium for the East semi-final - the Ti-Cats have even been offering an $80.00 deal that gets you two tickets PLUS a $25 gift card for the Ti-Cats store. So basically $55 for a pair of playoff tickets.

How come you never provide any backup to your “facts”?

The Ticat game looks to be officially sold out (an official sellout is 22,500) my tickets cost me close to $90 each, so if you are insinuating they are coming close to giving tickets away , you would be in error .
I see nothing wrong if they are doing a little marketing to get rid of some of the tickets , the semi's are always a difficult sell, you make it sound like they shouldn't be proactive in doing this Pat , I don't get it , the $25 gift certificate goes right back into their pocket as well .
You seem to always want to find fault with your home town team and the CFL and everything in Toronto , not Argos, can do no wrong . It gets tiring after a while , especially on a CFL forum .
Maybe you should go over to the RP boys forum and start singing the accolades of how great the Labour day atmosphere is at THF or how much fun the parties are at G.C or how great the sold out atmosphere was a the final game at Mosaic etc etc and see how they like it , I suspect they would not be very nice . Hope to see you at the eastern semi final , that is, if there isn't a TFC game that day Cheers .

Plus Rogers Blows!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Again you are wrong about the tv ratings. We will never know the Toronto market ratings. Rogers doesn't get paid $75 due to the Toronto market. are you nuts?

You have no clue what you are talking about Tripper.

I will tell you a little secret that you do not obviously know. The Blue Jays tv contract is bogus. Because they are not receiving $$$ for advertising like people think. The Toronto Blue Jays have one of the lowest ad revenues in all of pro sports due to Rogers. Why?

Because most of the advertising #'s that are being spent during Blue Jays games are free. That is right . Free. What am I talking about? I know over 35% of Blue Jays ad options came from Hockey Night in Canada and a combination of Raptors basketball and Olympics.

The Blue Jays tv deal got skunked the last 2 yrs due to the terrible managing of Rogers. Hockey Night in Canada had to serve over 50% of their ad revenue due to not meeting their quota in part of their HNIC deal during last season and playoffs. So they had no choice but to repay them during the baseball season.

I believe though i'm not 100% sure that last season for the Blue Jays was one of the worst revenue years in history of the Blue Jays regarding their tv deal.

And do not compare the Blue Jays market in Toronto like the Raptors in Toronto with any major USA city cause it aint even close. Toronto can not keep up with the bigger cities and is why if it wasn't for MLSE merger between Bell/Rogers and the exposure the raps get on TSN. The Raptors would have been done 5 yrs ago.

You have no idea how close they were to moving to Oklahoma City or New Orleans.

175,000 for red sox on nesn lol

I see you did take a trip to the washroom. You have not provided one link to support all the fictional stuff you post here. I've posted stories with links from Boston media quoting NESN press releases about what their rating are for Red Sox games - but you'd rather go with the numbers pulled from your ass. :roll:

Where did I say what the Cats were doing was a bad thing? I simply stated a fact of what they are doing to ensure a sellout. Why so defensive?

Come on, Pat. You are above that kind of post.

Your insinuation was enough , you did not have to say it, when you wrote that post the game was already officially sold out (22,500) you implied that in an attempt to sell it out they were offering great discounts (as if to say they were struggling with ticket sales ) . Like I said it gets tiring to defend our little league with no big big American TV money , we know it is not the NHL, NBA ,NFL ,MLB but it still manages to survive against all odds and in the face of those who would like to see it die.

Sorry Kevin - when he trashes mine and other people's posts that are sourced with real numbers, real links to real press releases from media sources, Nielsen or Numeris ratings - with total fiction over and over and over again then it is time to call out his posts for what they are - total BS that he is pulling from his derriere.

He has yet to post ONE - not one link to support any of the garbage he has posted. And the reason - because they don't exist - or at least he hasn't figured out a way to link to the only place they do exist - on the toilet paper he's used.

The MLB TV contract alone makes this notion a complete joke. If there is no link , the thread should be locked. This site is becoming a complete joke. SMH :roll: :roll:

No worries. I know A.M. is coming out with some outrageous claims but, like I said, YOU are above the vulgarity.

Anyway, I KNOW I have posted some things when I should have taken the high road so... Who am I to judge? :slight_smile:

:thup: :thup: :thup: :thup: :thup:

He has yet to post ONE - not one link to support any of the garbage he has posted. And the reason - because they don't exist - or at least he hasn't figured out a way to link to the only place they do exist - on the toilet paper he's used.

Although this piece is very old, 2004, it does illustrate why it is difficult to know how Rogers deals with Blue Jays financials:

Rogers' accounting sidesteps Blue Jays' losses

If this accounting treatment was questionable when Rogers owned 80 per cent of the ball club, it's even more so now that it owns 100 per cent
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Why are you defending a poster who obfuscates and outright lies. Access_media has posted several outrageous threads which no facts to back up his/her dubious claims. Pat provides sources and is a valuable contributor to this forum unlike the other poster.

Anyone with common sense knows most CFL teams are barely break-even propositions at best in a non-Grey Cup hosting year. Check out the financial reports for the following publicly owned teams in 2014 (non-Grey Cup hosting years for all)

Winnipeg Blue Bombers

[url=] ... t-in-2014/[/url] [url=] ... 040521.pdf[/url]

The club posted an operating profit of $3.9 million but what they had to make a payment of $4.5 million for their annual debt repayment on the stadium loan. Thus, they had to dip into their reserve fund to compensate for the .6 million shortfall.

Total operating revenue was 26.7 million incidentally

Edmonton Eskimos

[url=] ... 35-million[/url]


Edmonton posted a $3.5 million profit on operating revenue of $24.3 million

Keep in mind they are planning on spending $3 million of that on improvements as indicated in the Sun article.

Saskatchewan Roughriders

[url=] ... n-in-2014/[/url]

The Riders posted an operating profit of $2.2 million with revenues of $42 million. The common refrain here seems to be that the Riders working some sort of accounting magic to hide their real profits. However, the team was paying a significant amount of money which I believe was around 4.5 - 5 million per year over a 3 year period for the stadium improvements they made prior to the 2013 Grey Cup. That included the 2 new giant screens and the additional 3000 or so seats plus suites added to increase stadium capacity.

The club also derives a large percentage of their revenues - nearly 25% - from the merchandise as indicated in the article I posted. Pro sports teams don't derive very much profit from their merchandise sales. Riders own three of their stores so that helps a little but for any other store that sells merchandise, the wholesaler and retailer have to take their cut leaving the Riders with little in the way of profit. All that merchandise with their logo does help with brand awareness though so that is a positive.

We should keep in mind that these operating profits for these 3 clubs occurred after the new TV deal was signed so there has not been any additional significant revenue sources from the league since that point. These 3 clubs would also be the most profitable in the league based on their stadiums and fan support. Calgary would probably be 4th with a respectable corporate base but is stifled by a outdated facility. It's unlikely any of the other teams could match the revenues or profits of the big-3 given a combination of poor fan support (Toronto, BC), outdated facility with fewer suites and club seating (Montreal), small facility with fewer seats, fewer suites and club seating (Ottawa, Hamilton, Montreal).

It's laughable to suggest that CFL teams are more profitable than the Toronto Blue Jays base on the evidence I have provided above. I would also like to point out that the Jays had the 3rd highest average attendance in MLB last year at

Even with the poor exchange, the club still had ticket prices slightly above the MLB average of $31.00 in 2015

[url=] ... b-by-team/[/url]

Keep in mind the club had increased their average ticket price by 10% for the 2016 season so that average ticket price would rise as well and place the team further from the MLB mean.

As I have pointed out the BLue Jays regional tv contract is worth an incredible amount of money but because Rogers, the cable provider and broadcaster owns the team it is likely the team receives a fraction of their fair market value.

[url=] ... mlb-teams/[/url]

The Toronto Blue Jays present an interesting case. They weren’t included in the graphs above. Several years ago, the Blue Jays received $36 million from their RSN, but it’s difficult to accurately discern how much they’ve received over the past few years. The Blue Jays are owned by Rogers, which entity also owns Sportsnet, the channel on which the Blue Jays appear throughout Canada. The Blue Jays are likely only receiving a portion of the television money while the rest stays with the parent company.

[url=] ... 9357e26f41[/url] [url=] ... d8b084c04e[/url]

Take a look at the household ratings from the above articles for the 29 US teams and then look at the values of those teams annual tv contracts. Compare those with the Blue Jays. The highest ratings were the Mets at 215,000. The Blue Jays blow all these teams away with their ratings. When you consider the contracts these various teams receive - 80 million, 100 million, 150 million, 200+ million what do you think the Blue Jays tv contract is really worth? I can tell you it's quite a bit more than the $36 million quoted above considering their ratings were 1 million last year and have been above 500,000 for the past 4 years. It's ridiculous that the OP suggests Blue Jays advertising is given away for free with that many eyeballs on the screen :roll:

Also worth noting is the MLB contract that pays each team $52 million US per year.

So considering all of these huge revenue teams for the Jays plus the playoff games I didn't even mention, it's virtually a certainty that the Jays not only profit more than each CFL team but they have probably profited more than the all 9 CFL teams combined these past 2 seasons. That my friends is....

The Last Word

I wasn't. I was saying Pat doesn't need to make a crass/crude posts to make his point. He's above that.

No, troll boy entirely deserves it. He's the Donald Trump of the CFL forums: he lies so often that at this point he's incapable of telling truth and fiction apart.

cant defend someone who is wrong right?

anyways..... here is the issue. you keep diagreeing but you never have any facts. you keep rambling like a clueless person.
you are disagreeing that CFL teams are making profit? you suggest and respond that teams are barely making cash. WTF? are you serious. Ottawa made approx $15m the last 2 seasons.

You keep telling me that the Toronto Blue Jays have huge tv #'s. no they do not. Buddy The Blue Jays are under 100,000 for local tv. sometimes 1 million nationally. what dont you understand?

The Mets get over 500,000 on a Tuesday night game. and you are telling us 100,000? what is your deal?

100,000? buddy. They have over 500,000 subscribers to SNY just for mets games. Think about it. you have no clue what you are talking about?