CFL Doomed!!!!!

Just shut the CFL down already… TravelPat linked me this site… He thinks that Bon Jovi, and Slash are going to put a team in Toronto. He insists that he sees more XFL parapanlia on the streets of Toronto then Argos.

[url=] ... other-try/[/url]

More fiction there Bungle - unless there is another TravelPat out there - cause I've never seen that link before. I haven't even watched the WWE for years. lol

And I am in Toronto tomorrow - so I'll try to keep track of how many sports hats/jackets etc. I see for each team and will report back tomorrow night.

And besides the CFL is doomed if the Riders keep cheating to win the Grey Cup. Can we start a third thread about that?
(I'm kidding Riders fans)

The argos haven't played a game in 5 months and don't play again for 3 more.
But it's typical of how you gauge things in Toronto.

Why are you posting such an old story? Besides, I do not believe that it was even legitimate then. Right now, the WWE is only concerned about 2 things. One is getting more subscribers to its network. Second is getting a new tv deal. Even a mere mention of trying to resurrect that often-mocked league would send their stock price down.

Also, I do not even think Toronto would be the 1st choice if a NFL team moves. I would think any owner could get almost anything they wanted from Los Angeles.

Drummer Drummer Drummer. You act almost as if it is a personal insult to you that even the CEO of the Argos agrees that my assessment is the realistic one.

FYI - In Hamilton I see people in Ti-Cats stuff on a pretty much daily basis - myself included. In fact just walked over to the neighbourhood Target this afternoon and saw some people buying some Ti-Cats stuff there. Didn't surprise me because it is quite common - even now - to see people in Ti-Cats hats etc around here.

We must not have got the memo we weren't supposed to wear them in the off-season - lol.

For the record - I'm going to a Jays game and expect to see thousands of people with Jays and Red Sox stuff. I will be passing in the area of Maple Leafs Square - a few hours before Game 4 of the NBA play-offs where thousands of Raptors fans will be watching the game on the Big Screen - so I expect to see a ton of Raptors stuff. But those aren't the things I'll be counting. Like any trip to a sporting event or walking around the streets of Toronto - I will likely see hats/jackets etc of literally dozens of other sports teams in various leagues - many of whom will have not played a game in weeks or months. Will even ONE of those be somebody wearing something Argos?

Oh and the 3 guys I'm going with to the Jays game are all season ticket holders for the Argos. So big time Argos fans. I'll ask them where they think the Argos rank on the interest scale in Toronto - and I'll let you know what they say too. Although because I know they are realistic guys very much in tune with the Toronto sports scene - I'm certain you aren't going to like what I report back.

You guys are pretty dense... The article is complete BS... Look at the accompaning articles... Look at the web address (if you know basic wrestling terninogy, then it's a give away)
What part of wearing CFL gear in Toronto not being cool do you not understand Pat. Lots of the people who you will see tommorrow will be wearing NCAA or NFL gear and not even know what state they play in. Meanwhile they are actually Argo fans, but will be ridiculed if they wear Argos gear

I suggested years ago, Re; Ticats, that they should reach out to ethnic groups, new immigrants, have a Punjab day. etc,. perhaps this work in Toronto! ( accents included)

Immigrants are trying to fit into Canadian society... Not further exclude themselves from the general population by cheering for a team the local people are embarased to be associated with. The league could make things much better in Toronto by doing two things.
Stop being so cheap and raise the salary cap to 6 million(with a 60000 minimum salary) and then publicly disclose wages. Release the wages to the media so that they are printed in the paper and brodcast on the radio and internet. Once people realize that players don't make 20K/year (a common belief in Canada) then the league will gain instant credibility.
Secondly, to beat a dead horse to death again. Put out a fuckin video game.

ok now I am more than convinced this is mikem

Same. It is mikem.

Who else judges the popularity of a team by the amount of hats they see when the team hasn't played in 5 months and is 3 months from their next game?
Mikem, that's who.

oh. and i'm aware Rudge made such comments, travelpat.
that's one reason some of us don't like him. you don't gain fans by talking down your product, even if it is true.
'come see our c-list team'. not a great way to sell tickets.

I ALWAYS wear Argonauts' gear, and on the contrary, I get cheered. People are always curious to know who's jersey I wear. Andre Durie. It puts a smile on their face. Several times at a Rock game a few weeks ago

I'm in the GTA right now and have spotted 2 raptors car flags but no car flags for the leafs or blue jays. I guess this means that the raptors are the most popular team in Toronto and have surpassed both the leafs and jays in the hearts of toronto residents. Surely, it has nothing to do with the raptors being the only toronto team currently playing a playoff series...nope.

Bungle I admit you and I don't see eye to eye on many issues on the forum, especially the attendance threads but every once in a while you do some fun stuff. Kudos on two great threads in a row. I had a great chuckle with the article and even the thread heading. Keep up the fun

As an immigrant, I can say that I looked to the CFL Specifically because it is authentically Canadian. It is Canada's only true and popular professional sports league. I have never looked at the salary cap, or 'local opinion' to determine the merits of this league, in fact it is almost entirely on its value as a cultural and historical institution as well as the on field product. Really, one of the best things the Argonauts did last season was the citizenship ceremony last year, THAT is how you welcome and include newly arrived persons into Canadian culture and society, and that is where the Football team of a cosmopolitan city should focus a lot of its energy

Your argument is invalid.

You guys make me laugh. You say people don't want to be seen wearing Argos stuff - because it isn't cool. Your words not mine. If that is true - isn't that a problem? Or is admitting a CFL team has a problem something a true CFL fan is not allowed to do for some bizarre reason?

And FYI - in spite off doing my best to find just one person with an Argos anything - no luck. Hundreds in Leafs stuff, and Habs, Quite a few Ti-Cats stuff, saw some other CFL teams, lots of generic Canada stuff, lots of NHL, MLB, NCAA stuff which most are undoubtedly fashion statements - but not ONE Argos thing. And you guys think that is not a problem???

Remember in my last post I said I was going to the Jays game with three Argos season ticket holders. That turned out not to be true. One of them could not make it. But the two who were there completely agreed Argos were # 3 or 4 in the city - no where near as popular as the top two. Which is exactly what I've been saying - yet for some reason you guys give me grief for stating what they both said was obvious.

And because the one ticket holder could not make it one of the other guys brought is 16 year old nephew to the Jays game. So I asked him - Do you and your friends watch or talk about the Argos much. He said a little bit but not as much as his friends watch the Leafs, Jays and Raptors but more than TFC. The two guys about his age sitting in front of us hearing the conversation turned around and said they agreed. I asked why not more attention to the Argos and the three o them looked at each other before one of them finally shrugged his shoulders and said - 'I don't know - you just don't hear much about them'. And the other two guys agreed.

I would have love to come back from the game and say that I was wrong and the Argos season ticket holders and kids around us had the Argos up there near or above the Jays. But if I wrote that now - you guys might like me - but it would be because I was writing fiction.

That's what years of negative media, and NFL promotion will get. What banners where all over the Sky Dome, Buffalo , Buffalo!! Buffalo.
The tv ratings speak for themselves, they are just up against a hostile media and there is other competition for sure, just not the same promotion and corporate support!

I agree to a degree Mass - and that is why I have always said ideally it is MLSE to buy them. That guarantees them exposure and coverage on both TSN and Sportsnet plus on Fan 590 and TSN Radio. Plus synergies with all their other sports properties to take advantage of. No other potential owner brings ALL of that to the table with them.

I’m not sure any CFL fan here thinks the Argos don’t have problems. Similarly, I think all CFL fans here can admit the Argos have some strengths.

They do garner strong TV numbers, they are about to get a large increase in TSN revenue, and with those strong TV ratings have also come increased revenues from sponsorship and advertising (on-uniform, on-field, sideline, etc.)

The team does, as everyone I think recognizes, have an image/visibility problem in the GTA. Despite the strong viewership numbers, people are not prone to talk publicly about the team let alone show their support with Argo merchandise. Hence, the proverbial comparison to pornography: everyone watches; nobody talks about it. If I were running the Argos, I’d look into running a cheeky ad campaign with this analogy in mind . . . maybe a ‘come out of the closet’ series of ads. Another tact could be to mock those who make knee-jerk aspersions against the Argos and/or CFL as unathletic hipster-sheep who don’t really know anything about football. In a more conservative vein, they could promote the family experience at an Argos game, the success the team brings to the city, the history and/or Canadiana associated with the team, or make a return to the rivalries series of ads (though perhaps done more tastefully), etc.
One subtle, subversive idea they could try is what helped raise awareness of the Stamps in Calgary: give car-window stickers to seasons ticket holders. I’d suggest that instead of having the full Argo logo on the sticker, make it more minimalist with just the A. That way it wouldn’t be as easily recognized (which causes fear of being mocked). Over time, though, more and more A stickers would be appearing on cars throughout the area, slowly and subtly raising the team’s profile.

The team also has, as I think everyone admits, an attendance numbers problem. Even if their TV and ad revenue are up and even if that revenue gives them a small profit, increasing attendance will make them even more profitable and help them to catch up with the rest of the league. Changing the Argos’ image in the GTA would help. Also, hopefully, moving out of Skydome will put some more butts in the seats. I also think that a stadium that provides better dates will help. Also one that allows the place to feel like it’s really the Argos home will help too. And if Skydome would already do this and it’s just Rudge and Braley dropping the ball, then that should be addressed as well.

I think that Pat is getting civic pride mixed up with team support... I just got back from spending 4 and a half months in Asia and met three people from Toronto who were wearing Blue Jays baseball caps. None of the three knew much about baseball, but they wore Blue Jays caps over Maple Leafs caps because MLB is more internationally know the the NHL. Likewise, the Rider flag is used as a symbol of Saskatchewan. Many people don Rider gear in BC and Alberta but are not necesarily avid Rider fans. They are just proud to be from Saskatchewan and this is how they represent. Obviously the TigerCats have gotten a boost in popularity by actually reaching the Grey Cup, but I can tell you that if Hamilton had an NHL team that those people wearing Tigercat stuff that you seen today, they would be wearing Hamilton NHL stuff. Most of these people are just represnting Hamilton and are casual Tigercat fans at best. That is why you see so much Leaf gear in TO. Matt Sundin was not wrong when he presented Mohamad Ali with a leafs jersey and told him that it was the uniform of Toronto. Yes there are plenty of Leafs fans, but most people were Leafs gear are just trying to represent Tee dot Oh dot y'all. In other words...they are douchebags.
Furthermore you say people are not real fans unless they wear CFL gear and represent... I can honestly tell you that wearin Lions gear here in Vancouver is not at all cool. Case in point ... You see burnt out 40 year old bums wearing Lions gear because they got it from the Salvation Army... Kids and exspecially women never wear Lions gear.... Yet the Lions have the second best English language ratings in the CFL.