Bob, what gives???

The building we rent from Effort Trust needs a roof, and they won't even consider replacement......the thing actually leaks. so the analogy presented doesn't apply.

I support the current proposal, and have voiced that to my representatives. The funding shortfall needs to be addressed by, in my opinion, the private sector.

Bob Young gets nothing out of any of this. He could easily dump the team, turn his back on this city, and get on with his life. God knows, I would. But he hasn't. He has taken money out of his childrens future, his grand children's future, and his great grand children's future, all to support a team for his home town. And... no one appreciates it!!! Everyone complains. Everyone acts like his is selfish. Everyone acts like he has tens of millions of dollars burning a hole in his pocket. No matter how wealthy he is, this is obsurd!!!

If Hamilton wants this team they should come up with the difference along with the Feds and the Province.

If they don't, let everyone including Bob Young, cut their losses and get on with their lives.

I don't believe BY owes anyone (especially, not the city of Hamilton) anything.

What you just said is 'Not an accurate analogy'.

The Ticats are a CHARITY for Bob Young not a commercial venture.

He is doing this to give the City of Hamilton a gift, an identity, something to hang their hats on - God knows you have NOTHING else. He has no opportunity to ever make money. He has given and given and given and now everyone acts like he owes the city. He owes the city of Hamilton nothing!

Ticats made it clear they had no interest in investing in IWS before all of this started. They also said their financial contribution would depend on the details of the final stadium plan. Guess what? Thats what has happened. 3 sites 3 different financial contributions based on the value to the TigerCats. IWS has been stated as having no value to the team so their lack of commitment to it is expected by me and the fact that they need additional sponsorship money to make it work it is also no surprise. Hasn't anyone been paying attention to whats been happening since before Harold Ballard?

Let's "rephrase" it again... suppose you were running a charity... there was nothing in it for you... no profit... nothing but grief but you wanted to give something back to the community... and suppose the recipiants of that charity started to bite the hand that fed them... would you, as a philanthropist, want to pour more of you family's future into the money pit?

I wouldn't and neither would any of you. Let's put it into perspective. If BY is worth 1 Billion Dollars and he gave another $50 million to build the stadium over and above the $30 million he has already lost on the Ticats. Add the $20 million he will probably lose on the team (in the future) before he ever has a chance to break even... In total, he would have given 10% of his families wealth to a charity that benifits others far more then it benefits him.

How many of you, who criticize BY, are willing to give 10% of your families wealth to a charity. Until you do, you should not throw stones.

Kevy D, you talk like everyone but YOU hates Bob Young

This is just not true

Most everyone on this site knows of the Caretakers generosity
We respect Bob and his Family
We are so lucky to have Bob.

Sorry. I did not mean to imply that. I am just bothered when I see posters talk about Bob Young like he is a bank. Like he has a bottomless wallet to spend on this team and this city.

I have seen too many people take the generousity of others for grantit in my life and it bothers me.

I apologize for being too aggressive.

If these major corporate sponsors step up with any contributions it won't be towards the building of the stadium itself.

The City would be the owner of the stadium and these contributions would be nothing more than philanthropic donations.

Businesses in such a situation would want it to be an investment on which they get some tangible return.
Can't have mixed private/public ownership of the infrastructure, especially not when it is being built by Infrastructure Ontario.

I suspect, and expect, they will come forward with something like "The Tim Horton's Wall of Fame", or "The Molson's Parking Lot" (by purchasing some of the land surrounding IWS, particularly to the north) as the most they would contribute.

I think if Bob were to make the offers he did at the time of the consideration of the East Mountain site that would go a long ways towards restoring his image/reputation, especially in the eyes of the council, media and the local nay-saying citizenry who are dumping more and more on Bob - just check out some of the increasing, and increasingly nasty, blogs/reports on some of the anti-Bob, anti-stadium, anti-Ticats websites. There are still very negative comments about the Ticats pre-condition of the $18 million office space at new IWS when the Ticats had deleted that hours before the City Council meeting Monday with an addendum to the Memorandum of Understanding.

Well, if Bob is "sticking" it to guys like Collins and McHattie and Patusta with these sorts of conditions, i say bloody good on him! I'd be sticking it even further up there if it was me and people could call me all the names in the world. I think Bob is pretty darn tough, he has absolutely nothing to prove to anyone IMHO.

I agree with this post.

The debate about analogies to commercial leases is interesting, but at the end of the day it doesn't take us anywhere. Every business deal is different and has different dynamics. This one is certainly unique, and each proposed stadium location discussed has had its own characteristics and twists and turns.

I agree with those who note that operating a CFL franchise is a very marginal business proposition. It will remain so in Hamilton, where large fan support is not reliable, and the new/ renovated stadium will still be among the smallest in the league. How much Bob Young wants to "invest" in this sort of venture is entirely up to him. It's been a money sinkhole for him so far.

If he doesn't want to play the rest of his cards yet, that's his call, I don't blame him at all.

I'm not sure exactly what that quote means by way of what type of contributions will be made by sponsors, but I listened to that press conference and the mayor and Bob Young said that they both endorsed this option and although it wasn't what either "side" really wanted it was a workable compromise. I heard talk of sponsors making large contributions to the project. I wouldn't have expected a contribution from these groups if it hadn't been mentioned in the first place. I just want people to stop screwing around and get the job done. As far as moving the head office to the stadium, I believe that if Mr. Young wants the extra office space at the stadium site that is something he should be willing to pay for. I don't think anyone should be trying to "stick it to" anyone because it's the city and the fans who suffer.


Instead of "STICKING IT" to anyone he should be doing what he needs to do to get the job done .. within reason of course .. instead of throwing stipulations and threats and whatnot ...

You know why Aldershot was dismissed so fast ... anyone? anyone? ..

There was nobody around to pay for it .. Building a stadium is a unique venture and unless any of you have done it ( or me) then none of us can really say anything of the finer details ..

If anyone has noticed none of the other plans for anysite have ever included TICAT OR BOB YOUNG money going to the cost of the stadium the payee was always going to be the same .. all the taxpayers and all the ticket purchasers

so seems there is no money for a new stadium and there is no money for a IWS 2.0 where does that leave it?

YA KNOW .. I Hear the pontiac silverdome is available ... you could put curtains over upper level seats ...

The E/M site Bob Young committed $15Mil. to "precinct and stadium " along with alot of other very generous contributions.

On July 6th, 2010, Bob Young issued a letter to the Mayor and Council outlining the Club’s financial commitment in support of the
East Mountain stadium location. As a means of complete clarity and transparency, the terms of the Club’s financial commitment
for both the stadium development and Pan Am Park development is clarified below:
• The Club will contribute $15 million to the cost of the stadium and precinct.
• The Club will operate the stadium and cover the estimated annual operating cost of $3 million per year. Simply put, the City will
not be responsible for stadium operating losses going forward. Over the 10 year initial management contract this will total $30
• The Club has since done exhaustive research and can confirm the average annual operating cost of a soccer specific
MLS stadium, seating capacity between 20,000-25,000, is higher than the $3 million estimate.
• Thus not only is the Club eliminating any risk associated with the operations of the facility for the City and the tax payer,
the sum to operate is understood to be higher than projected by the Club initially or by Deliotte in the City’s own business
case assessment on the West Harbour.
• The club will assume the transition costs between today and the opening of the new stadium of an estimated $10 million.
• The Tiger-Cats commit $14 million to bring two Grey Cup Games to Hamilton as soon as possible. The quantifiable economic
benefit to the community will exceed $200 million.
• This is a direct cash expenditure for the Club ($7 million per Grey Cup) and includes the rights to secure the game as well
as the cost of temporary seating.
• The Club will have to sell 45,000 tickets at an AVERAGE of $150/ticket to break even on the initial cash outlay.
• Thus the Club is taking tremendous financial risk to secure the rights to host Grey Cup and the local economy will benefit
• Associated with this, working with the City, we will ensure the location of the Grey Cup Festivals in the area of the West
Harbour/North End community. This will be an opportunity to showcase our Waterfront to in excess of 20 million viewers
throughout North America over the course of Grey Cup weekend.
• The Tiger-Cats Commitment to Pan Am Park, which would serve as a tremendous host venue for Grey Cup Festivals,
illustrates the Club’s commitment to this concept.
• Purchasing and establishing a new professional soccer team in Hamilton will require an investment of greater than $5 million
over its first few years of operations.
• This commitment encompasses the franchise fee as well as Club operations.

These are NOT "stipulations,threats and whatnot"
This was a tremendous,generous offer.

People have to realize that with the cost of construction today, the ONLY ones who can afford to build stadiums are governments. They are the only ones who have the resources.

Now people will say "Well, the Dallas Cowboys did it. The NE Patriots did it." Yes, well, the Hamilton Tiger Cats are NOT those teams and Hamilton is not Dallas or Boston.

I have come to the conclusion that it is the "Union" Mentality of Hamilton that is cursing this project and every other project that comes Steeltown's way...

  1. Everyone feels that they should have a say and their opinion should matter. That they know best. That if they can't have their way, then no one gets their way.

  2. Everyone has so much animosity towards Big Business and the Private Sector that they don't appreciate what is given (BY has lost $30M so far) and they resent it when the well dries up.

Your city has to decide whether they want this team or not. If they don't, like I said before, let BY (and everyone else) get on with their lives.

If they do, shut up and build the stadium and accept the fact that it will be paid for by the average man.


For every dollar that Hamilton puts in, they are going to receive 2 - 3 dollars in both Federal and Provincial money. So, don't look a gift horse in the mouth. That is not a bad return on your money!!! Start building, create jobs and pay your share of the costs of giving the stadium a facelift.

Ditto from me too on "Earl's thoughts 8)

And in reading a lot of "KeyD"'s posts lately, I concur with the majority of them.

Both of you are saving me a lot of keystrokes.... :lol:

Thank buddy! But you might change your mind/support if I told you my perspective on hunting (wink). :wink:

Depends... is Bob Young paying for the room or the City of Hamilton?


out of those 2 choices ? well the reservation will be delayed 4 or 5 times and then the room rates will be overpriced and then the argument what side of the building to reserve the room .. and in the end You'll have to pay for it yourself

lol :lol:

By the way, the only hunting I do is with a camera. I couldn't shoot any animal unless it was suffering badly. But I don't own any firearms anyways.