Austin brought something that Barrett lacked..

the desire to always improve, to always be better than the previous week! To never give in. AND no one is safe.

Barrett got complacent! this team would never have become a team challenging for 1st place near the end if Danny had stuck around.

We'd be 3rd place again..

Austin has done so much more in just 1 season that took Barrett 7 years to get half of it!

sure we made the playoffs 5 years of their 7. But we did squat!

How many winning seasons were there? How many home playoff games? how many times did we finish ahead of Edmonton?

I wouldn't exactly call that much of an accomplishment!

We never got to the Grey Cup in any of those seasons with Barrett!

Austin is 10 times the coach that Barrett ever was.

Considering where we came from, Barrett and Shivers did wonders with the Riders. Best playoff run in decades and really only a couple of plays away from being in the Grey Cup a couple of times.

Yes, loyalty and some other issues seemed to cloud their views in the past couple of years, but they brought the organization to the verge of Grey Cup success.

The move to bring in Austin was, in hindsight, very astute on Tillman's part. However, it is impossible to say that we would be in 3rd place again.

Well Considering That with all that talent we had and we could only get to 9-9??

there are obvious differences!

the focus is there!

the crap that happened inside the dressing room is gone!

no more favoritism!

The players seem to be working a heck of a lot harder for Austin than they did for Barrett.

Well, if both our QB's had been hurting for a chunk of the year, we could easily have lost two or three more games already.

And realistically, I think our talent everywhere except DB exceeds last year's.

well.. I dunno.

we have a great Running back!

We didn't throw the ball like we should have.

the only thing that really was the same basically was the Defense.

we lost the Big Running back in Keith.

but we gained a few receivers!

Barrett, i'm pretty sure would have stuck to the game plan that we had last season... and run run run run run

very true. A strong focus on the run would have significantly slowed the maturity process of Fantuz. Austin definitely has us more primed to succeed due to being able to both pass and run with equal effectiveness.

Danny and Roy did a terrific job with the Riders.
Some of the criticisms being placed upon them are simply bogus.
If ET does half as good a job of bringing in talent as Roy did, we will be in good shape.
And if Kent does as good a job as DB did, we will win some championships.

It was indeed time to shake things up by replacing DB. And if Roy wasn't willing to do that, then he had to go as well.
But it wasn't because they weren't good football people.
Or that ET and Kent are better.
In fact if you look at the talent Roy has brought into the league in the last 25-30 years and compare that to what ET has done over pretty much the same stretch, Roy wins in a stroll.

But sometimes complacency sets in--not among the coaches, but the players.
Sometimes coaches run up against the wall. Not because they suddenly can't coach, but because it just sometimes takes a fresh approach.
And that is where DB and Roy were at.

The core of this team this year is still the team Roy and DB built.
I would argue that we may not be as good talent wise as we were last year, but are younger and hungrier.

I expected this team to be where we are, or even better, so Kent gets plenty of props for achieving what was expected from him.

But personally, I question the football acumen of people who feel the need to bash the previous regime to bolster the current one.
Give ET and Kent all the props you want to.
But Roy and DB deserve their props as well.

right Roy deserves nothing except to be kicked in the ass..

his Racist attitude towards white people was one thing. His ability to bring in Canadian Talent was another (wow) He was a cancer for the team.

He actually made the women in the organization do his laundry for him or else he'd fire them.

you want proof? I know someone who does work with the Roughriders and he told us about this.

he had the women in the organization scared of him!

When he got fired, he brought up the whole racist thing that he got it cause he's black. blah blah blah

I'm glad they got rid of him!

But Tillman can easily do better than Shivers...

I think that this whole favoritism thing didn't do him much good.

wow...some people are just never happy. RS and DB brought this team up to a respectable level. Richie Hall cost us the chance to go to the grey cup when he was unable to stop the Lions on the last drive. But to put blame on DB and RS alone is just pure garbage and this should not even be a topic to be honest. Why don't you try being happy where we are instead of bringing up the past...honestly.

There is good and bad with everyone. Shivers had an incredible eye for American talent but didn't care about Canadian talent. At this point in time, anyone willing to be honest would have to say Shivers was one of the best American talent evaluators in CFL history. Tillman has not proven over time that he has that ability. Lets hope he does.

point - Shivers

Shivers made it clear that the color of a person's skin mattered to him when he made decisions. Like it or not, that is a fact. No such racism has been noticed in Tillman.

Point - Tillman

Tillman connects far better with the community and the media that Shivers EVER did. Period.

Point - Tillman

Shivers inherited a crappy team and organization and turned it into a solid product. Tillman inherited a solid team and added the key pieces to bump it up a notch.

Point - even.

Both guys hired coaches that they knew personally.

Point - even.

Give it some time and things may change, but at this time, both men bring positives to the table and both men have shortcomings. It is safe to say, though, that Tillman is the right man for the job at this time and has done a great job. And if Shivers had left prior to last year, fans would have been saying he was one of the best GM's we had ever seen in Regina.

yea but So many people cannot stand Shivers because he isolated the team from the Community!

his biggest mistake was not trying to get Clermont!

because he didn't care.

Tillman had to work hard to gain the respect from the community back!

See, now you are just full of crap.
You can't justify earlier comments about the on field product so you turn to slander and inuendo.
I know people who work for the Riders as well, some of them women, and they like and respect Roy.
Not that us claiming we know this person, or that person on an internet forum means squat

Calling Roy a racist is just stupid.
If you don't like Roy because of his outspoken nature, that is one thing.
But the rest of what you are saying is nonsense.

Yeh, well, I guess ET's biggest mistake was not getting Bauman then.
You don't know of what you speak.
ET had two chances to draft Clermont when he was in Ottawa and passed on him twice.
Roy had 0 chances to draft Clermont bevcause BC picked before Sask. in the draft.
Fact is, Roy did try to make a deal to move up in the draft, but there were no takers.
One of the great lies that seem to live on about Roy.

I also disagree that Roy "isolated" anybody from anything.
True many fans did not like having a black GM and coach, but that is Roy's fault?
Attendance went from 19000 a game in 1999 to over 24000 a game with Roy at the helm.
The team went from near bankruptcy and millions in debt, to turning a profit each year and in the black--pardon the pun--under Roy.

It truly astounds me why some people are so hostile to Roy.
There is no logical reason for it......?

Shivers made it clear that the color of a person's skin mattered to him when he made decisions. Like it or not, that is a fact. No such racism has been noticed in Tillman.
as I said to the other guy, calling Roy a racist is stupid. Is ET a racist for hiring a white head coach? Then why is Roy a racist for hiring a black head coach?

I'll debate this further if you guys want to, but honestly, you have little (nothing?) to support your claims.


Roy himself stated that when he was hired as GM he insisted on hiring an African-American coach. How is that not some degree of racism?

If Tillman had said "I HAVE to hire a white head coach, what would the response be?

Exactly. cflisthebest you shouldnt have called this thread "Austin brought something that Barrett lacked", simply because it is only half of the story and to be honest your obvious dislike of the Shivers/Barrett regime is getting annoying... Quit with the threads. With out them, who knows where our team would be.

Im not sure it can be looked at as rascism because of the small number of black head coaches.

Eric Tillman is not a racist, but (unless I am mistaked at which point I will retract my statement) you have to wonder why he didnt really seem to give Richie Hall a chance at the job... He is going to be head coach very soon in this league.

alot of players on this rider team were players Tilman brought into the league in his ottawa days.

the current riders are a glimpse of what tilman was building in ottawa.

austin was a coach, flick was a receiver, joseph was the QB, yo murphy and armstead ( nolonger a rider ) just to name the more obvious ones.

Exactly, jman.
I don't think ET is a racist. He might be, but I have no reason to think he is.
But what we do know is, football is an old boys club.
GMs hire people they know, not necessarily the people that might be best for the job.
That we can call chronyism. And certainly ET is the king of that. just look at the players he brought into camp. The vast majority of them had previous ties to ET.

As for Roy, there is absolutely nothing wrong with Roy hiring DB, or in the rationale he gave in doing so.
The fact is, hiring a black coach was a topic the media was interested in, and Roy was not shy in talking to them about it.
Coaches are a dime a dozen.
White GMs hire white coaches.
Almost exclusively.
Roy stated that if he knew a black coach who could do the job, he would do so.
And he will discuss at length with anyone who asks about the reasons for this.
But at the end of the day, it is because giving a young black coach the opportunity to coach at the highest level was the right thing for Roy to do.
If he didn't do it, who was? ET?
Racism was a factor in Roy hiring DB.
But it wasn't Roy that was racist...

I can accept that analysis but a lot of people wouldn't.