Argos sign Rich Stubler from Stamps as DC

I'm guessing Creehan is left out in the cold..

CFL News ?@CFL_News
RT .@SUNMitchell
Dave Dickenson confirmed Rich Stubler will not be back. He's heading to the #Argos. #CFL

They had to do something. The D was horrible last year. Don't bend but break at the worst time.

Now if they can just get rid of Millanovich and Barker they might head in the right direction.

Wow!! Calgary lost one of its pillars today. I would have thought that Stubler would of left only to take the role of HC somewhere.
I thought he would have been the HC of the Eskimos if Chis Jones left for the Riders.

Scott Mitchell ?@SUNMitchell
Doesn't sound like anyone was overly happy with Rich Stubler's exit. Unexpected might be an understatement. #CFL

And what HC and GM candidates do you think would be an upgrade - - LaPolice? Brendan Taman? Joke Mack?

Nobody did more with less than Milanovich and Barker. Getting rid of Slumlord Braley and finally being able to spend some money on players/staff/facilities is what the Argos really need.

I'd keep Barker for sure, and while I think Milanovich is a good Head Coach, his offense is pathetic to watch, Brady's play calling has made it worse IMO. I've only seen a CFL built exclusively around checkdown screens and flats just one other time, when Jamie Elizondo was the offensive coordinator and Cleo lemon was the starting QB for the Argonauts.

I'd keep Barker for sure, and while I think Milanovich is a good Head Coach, his offense is pathetic to watch, Brady's play calling has made it worse IMO. I've only seen a CFL offense built exclusively around checkdown screens and flats just one other time, when Jamie Elizondo was the offensive coordinator and Cleo lemon was the starting QB for the Argonauts.

The Argos under Millanovich have a losing record at home and are the most undisciplined team in the league. He has no control over the player and his offense, defense and special teams have been in a steady decline since he lucked his way into a Grey Cup. What exactly has he done the last 2 seasons again?

Barker has done absolutely nothing since getting Ray and I think that had less to do with Barkers skills than being by the phone when Tillman wanted to unload him. What has Barker done? Khalif Mitchell, Shea Emery and brought back Rick Foley, three of the biggest cheap shot artists in the game. Also brought Adrianno Belli out of retirement so he could get ejected from the Grey Cup to cap his career.

Argos will never win another playoff game with these two.

Toronto just got a whole bunch better. :thup:

It's laughable how factually incorrect your comments are.

In four seasons with Milanovich as HC the Argos home record has been:
2012 - - 4-5
2013 - - 4-5
2014 - - 6-3
2015 - - 3-2
How do you arrive at the conclusion that this is a "losing record at home"?

As for your proclamation that Barker "has done absolutely nothing" for the past four seasons, just take a look at the trio of receivers he brought in this year. Pretty simple to just throw big dollars at free agents like the RedBags did - - the true measure of a GM in the CFL is how well he can identify talent and bring in rookie Imports on cheap minimum salary contracts.

It's laughable how you can twist facts; 2015 they were 5-4 for an overall of 19-17 (darn I was off by one).

As for Barker, the true measure of a GM is how well his team does so let's look at that. @012 he lucks into a Grey Cup with a less than stellar 9-9 record, 2013 lose the east final, 2014 misses playoffs, 2015 loses east semi. Since backing in to a home Grey Cup he has made the playoffs 2 out of 3 years and gone 0-2.

You're right, this is exactly the kind of performance the Argos need from thier coaching/managerial staff. :roll: :roll:

I'm not sure how anyone can say that the offense under Milanovich has been terrible. Harris was 3rd in passing yardage this year despite having a receiving group composed of mostly CFL rookies. In 2014 Ray leads the CFL in passing. 2014 Ray was 4th in the league in passing despite missing more than half a season due to injury and if you combine the stats for Ray and Collaros that season who started most of the other games, they lead the league in passing. Points for, this year they were 5th but in the last few seasons are top 4 in the league. What's let them down has been their points allowed which has been among the 3 or 4 worst the last few seasons. Milanovich's record has been middling but should improve with a better D.

As for Barker, he's done a decent job IMO. They've lost as many players as anyone to the NFL over the last few seasons and have had to make some tough choices and lost some players as they've had to budget closer to the cap floor under Braley. Finances and the overall situation with the team also hampered their activity in the CFL free agent market with the Shea Emery signing a couple of years ago their biggest splash. Same goes with coaches as Tim Burke and Casey Creehan probably came cheaper than others after their debacles here in Winnipeg, and Creehan's time in Hamilton. His results at the CFL draft have been middling though, solid early picks but not really able to unearth anything in later rounds. Not the best GM out there but certainly not one but capable. I'll wait and see what he does with Bell maybe loosening the purse strings a bit. Stubler seems like an immediate upgrade on the coaching staff. Poaching him from Calgary is a bit reminiscent of how he nabbed Chris Jones out of Calgary a few seasons ago.

Who cares how many passing yards a team has, they don't award trophies or points in the standings for passing yards. Wins, it's all about wins. They were in the mix for 1st in the east and blew with 3 straight losses to Calgary, Montreal (scoring an embarassing 2 points) and BC to finish 3rd then losing their playoff game. 2014? Shot at first but blew it 2 losses to Montreal and finished out of the playoffs.

That's not a middling record that's consistently choking at the crucial time. Not what I look for in a HC and Millanovich is far from HC material.

Creehan was horrid, this is more than a welcome return by Rich.

Anybody that knows anything about defence is an upgrade, Stubler can even hide a few of the inadequicies of Millanovich.

Never? Care to make a wager on that?

So they have a winning record at home then?

How exactly did they luck into a Grey Cup?

Come on, Neely, everyone knows they were incredibly fortunate to be leading 24-6 at halftime and 35-14 in the fourth quarter, and even luckier to hang on by the skin of their teeth to a 35-22 win.

Barker lucked into the win because he inherited Milanovich as head coach. Oh wait, he hired Milanovich. Lucky, tho.

You're the one that said that said their offense has been in a steady decline.

An offense that's consistently one of the most productive in the league doesn't meet my definition of steady decline. I will concede their offense let them down in the stretch drive this year though. It's a bad mix when you combine that in with a defense that is struggling to keep the opposition off the board. I understand your point about his overall won-loss record. I'm not sure what you can really read into a playoff record. John Hufnagel won the Grey Cup his first year in Calgary, then went 1-3 in the playoffs over the next 3 years. I get that Huf had an outstanding regular season record, but my point is I don't think that the early playoff record is what defines him so I'm not going to hold a couple of early playoff exits against Milanovich. I think Milanovich will definitely be on the hot seat this year now that the team will have some better stability on the field with a new home and off the field with new ownership. He'll have to have a better showing if he's to stick around.

You're pretty fixated on the players Barker has brought in that were already in the CFL but you don't have to recycle other teams players to be a good GM. He's brought in a lot of new talent - Patrick Watkins, Tristan Okapalugo, Zac Collaros, Trevor Harris, Marcus Ball, Sir Vincent Rogers, John Chiles, Dontrelle Inman just to name a few off the top of my head. All of these guys have gone on to either head to the NFL or were one of the most coveted free agents of their free agent class. I'm sure he would have liked to have the money to compete with signing some of these guys. This year you throw in guys like AJ Jefferson, Greg Jones, Hazelton, Kevin Elliott, Torrey Gurley. Maybe it depends on your perspective. When you consider our old GM in Joe Mack more often than not was bringing in players that nobody else would want, it's easier to be more appreciative or envious of someone else's successes.

What I'm envious of is a GM who doesn't consistently go after the worst kind of player; Mitchell, Emry, Belli, Foley. These guys just hurt teams with thier undisciplined play. Combine that with the culture it creates on a team it can flourish in because the HC is incapable of controlling his team and you end up with what the Argos have, the most undisciplined team year in year out. That falls on Braker and Millanovich.

The offense, well what has it done for them? 2 years in a row it has cost them in the standings with poor showings when it mattered most and failed them in the playoffs. I don't judge an offense by numbers alone. A good offense can score when it needs to which is why the lost the east semi to Hamilton.

I still say, with Barker and Millanovich they do not win a playoff game. Next year they'll be lucky to make the playoffs.