A Fans Proposal to HostCo, and 2 Cats rally's this Sat.

A Back-up plan proposed to HostCo

All I have been asking, is that people discuss Ivor Wynne. To look at it as an option. To look beyond myths and padded numbers, beyond the east end, old, and residential neighborhood monikers.

What do we have to lose, by discussing this site? Perhaps it isn't the best option but everything I have learned in the past few months, leads me to believe that this could be the best location NOT on the table.

When I talk to people about Ivor Wynne, most have said 'ya, why hasn't it been an option?'

This entire proposal is not all my brain-child. The thoughts within this document are a mix of my own dreams for Balsam Avenue, and suggestions I have heard or read on forums like Raise the Hammer, the Tiger-Cats fan forum, and even discussions on various walls and fan pages on Facebook.

The people are talking about it. Why aren't the media and the politicians? What is it that they don't want you to know?

Below is a link to the proposal I sent to HostCo, which also includes the email messages I sent to HostCo, council, the Tiger-Cats, The Hamilton Spectator, The Toronto Sun, Raise the Hammer, CHCH News, and members of our federal and provincial government.

Will this encourage council to add this to the table on Tuesday, or will they now vote in favour of a 5,000-7,000 seat stadium, which HostCo now says is all they will support financially in the West Harbour.

Just tell me why not and provide me with some hard facts, and old and residential don't cut it. The Florida Marlins are building their new home in a residential neighbourhood. So would the West Harbour stadium be amongst a community of it's own.

Fenway Park in Boston and Wrigley Field in Chicago are old. There are ways to modernize and preserve history. There is also lot's of space for more parking, perhaps even a mulit-level parking garage, and other buildings around Ivor Wynne could compliment the history theme - aka Jimmy Thompson Memorial Pool which was also built in 1930 for the same British Empire Games.

Next argument.

Here is the link: http://www.saveivorwynnestadium.com/hostco%20proposal.pdf

Save Ivor Wynne Rally

Two hours of your time, for 80 years of serving our community.

When: Saturday September 4th, 2010
Time: 11am to 1pm*?
Place: Scott Park Field across from Ivor Wynne Stadium

  • The walk may go longer. Especially if we end up on Ottawa Street. :slight_smile:

Itinerary: Chat a little bit at Scott Park field, wander about the perimeter of the stadium and surrounding grounds afterwards, and then walk around the broader neighborhood for as long as everyone wants to walk.

Bring your walking shoes, reading glasses, and an open mind. I'll have some documents to pass around and read as we wonder the east end streets.

More about the rally from this link: http://saveivorwynnestadium.com/blog/?p=129

As well, just a reminder for those of you that don't know, there is also a 'Save The Tiger-Cats' Rally that same day from 12pm to 10pm at Pier 8.

Find more info at this link: http://www.facebook.com/#!/profile.php?id=1320708631

Excellent post.

I agree with you 100%

Might I add that IWS is not 80 years old...just the "Civic Stadium" name and the location are.
The north stands were constructed in 1970 and the south stands in 1958.
Yes, according to the engineers' reports it will last another 45 plus years with regular maintenence and replacing the concrete slabs on the south side for about $15 million with today's inflation.
McMahon Stadium in Calgary, the host of last years' Grey Cub and Percival Molson Stadium (with NO onsite parking) in Montreal are both older than IWS. The fans seem to like their stadiums and apparently we do to as we've averaged 23,500 fans a game this year with a .500 club. You're also right that the fans of the Tiger-Cats know where to park and get to the game in under 10-15 minutes. In all my years of going I have gotten home on the East Mtn after the game within 30 minutes, mostly much sooner...never a traffic jam. I will tell you that a vast number walk to the game and are not the type willing to drive/bus/shuttle/LRT to an East Mtn, Conderation Park, or Airport location. I can alread imagine the highway gridlock. The West Harbour site is laughable as far as accessability. At least that's what i've heard and experienced.
I like your other ideas and a lot of others do to! It's common sense in this frenzy of "gimme this and that."
We've always heard if the Cats average 21,000 fans we break even. But now with a 23,500 fan average we have Bob threatening to move our Tiger-Cats out of Hamilton if we don't recoup his $7 million a year loss through revenue generated from up to 7,000 parking spots and naming rights viewed from the Redhill Expressway. (Hardly a major thoroughfare) Guess who get's to pay for biggest chunk of the hundreds of millions for a brand new stadium for Bob. We do.
Just imagine what $100 million could do for Ivor Wynne Stadium, the TIger-Cats, and the East end with these common sense approach ideas. It's a like a breath of fresh air reading Larry's PDF's. Any ideas don't include hot water in the visitors locker room though. Take that Milt Stegall.

HA HA HA that was funny … you make a matter of fact statement then back it up with that’s what i heard ? you believe everything your told?

Cannon and Barton streets are hardly multi-lane speedways yet for 1 game a year the attendance can approach 30,000

I have also heard people compare the fireworks at pier 4 to the rheem site … 2 different locations with a different access to it so how can it be compared …

I have no problem with where people want a new stadium everyone has their opinion but some of the arguments are chuckle worthy

This 100 million, so I have it correct to you is ok spent at IWS, to me its ok spent at Longwood Rd to others its ok at EM or CP and yet to others its ok at WH?

I think the entire point has been missed. This really is loserville.

If $100 million is spent on Ivor Wynne Stadium,

ALL OF IT will come out of city taxpayers dollars.

Kiss the $57 million from the senior governments good-bye,

and the Hamilton Future Fund should not be used to
rehabilitate a crumbling building of no heritage value.

Thanks Wheezer.

Thanks Synthcat.

I think what everyone has to realize here, is that Synth didn't say to spend $100M on Ivor Wynne and the surround area, he said 'imagine if that money was spent there'. As they stated, it could go a lot further than that same money would go to just building a stadium. And we all know the what $150M is estimated to build this thing, will double if Winnipeg is any testiment.

They can talk new locations until the cows come home, but the fact is we can't afford it even with Provincial and Federal funding. That money goes a lot further with a restore versus build new.

So what is loserville? This site or Hamilton? Way to add to the conversation. As stated above, Synth wasn't say spend $100M. Just 'imagine what could be done with that money if we don't build brand new'.

What's been missed, is how others interperited Synth's post. Building a new stadium will cost taxpayers a lot of dollars even with public/senior governmnets funds.

And crumbling building with no heritage value? All the stairs have been replaced as per the 2007 plan, along with other items for that report. If the engineers say a building could last 45+ years with proper maintenance, I would think that indicates it's not crumbling.

And no heritage value? Because it doessn't have a 'heritage site' plaquard on it? I think it has plenty of 'heritage value' in the hearts of thousands. Ivor Wynne is the type of stadium that people can fall in love with and have, and I believe that is in large part to the community it has called home for so long. A slab off a highway will probably never create the same emotional attachments that Ivor Wynne has.

I don't think there is anything wrong with renovating IWS .. would take quite a few funds but can be done .. people have mentioned a multi-level parking lot on the scott park property but imagine everyone trying to exit from that all at once then you'll see a traffic nightmare ..

the problem with an IWS reno is not with doing the work there is no room for expanding and no hope of it either the residents around it won't allow it

No way is your site loserville and your passions should be respected and admired in fact. The entire whole of this confussing debate is what casts the image as loserville.

All your efforts have fallen upon as many deft ears as all my efforts and many others efforts with apposing views. I will gladly add to "your" conversation if you will listen to the reason of others.

Your idea is very valid, and does deserve consideration however the business view that Bob Young has tried so hard to get across has been forgotten. I happen to agree with Bob Young. My take is that civic success begins with civic planing imagination and in some cases change. In this situation change is what Hamilton so badly needs.

For some reason folks in Hamilton think it is cheaper to renovate, remediate, rheemediate...Re... something or other. In fact it is not. You can factor the cost by 1.5 when you RE... and unlike a new design with strict contract clauses you open the public up to huge cost overruns because in a renovation project the contract is filled with disclamers to protect contractors.

But Bob Young has lost over $30 Million at IWS and will never make money at IWS. As soon as there is an alternative stadium that meets all his needs so he can make some money the team is out of there. IWS is not an option.

IWS, WH, yup, Bob and anyone with a brain is gonzo asap, no question about that.

Not a great idea. You do not renovate a stadium that is unable to host concerts. The last concert was 1979 - I was there - me and Pink Floyd. You don't place a stadium in the exact same circumstance as IWS at WH. You think out side of the box and listen to a business man and forget those idiots like Sam Murulla - This is why Hamilton has remained unchanged in 25 years.
The city council are just trying to save their sorry asses before the municipal election. I can not believe how they have f&^%$ this up from the onset. Longwood Rd will work just fine. Are the city council able to understand this? Who knows at this point.

From the Mayor:

[i]Mr. Bob Young
Owner, Hamilton Tiger-Cats Football Club
1 Jarvis Street
Hamilton, ON L8R 3J2

Dear Mr. Young:

I would like to thank you for your letter dated today re-iterating your commitment to partner with us in creating a sustainable legacy in the form of a new stadium to be built in the City of Hamilton.

I also wish to thank you for expressing, once again, your commitment to work with us in a constructive and urgent manner to reach an agreement on the Pan Am stadium site.

Bob, while the site of the future Pan Am stadium has been in doubt, our mutual commitment to Hamilton and this fantastic project has never been in doubt.

Re-iterating at this critical juncture your commitment to the Pan Am stadium and the important legacy it presents to our city is most welcome and timely. It is a statesman-like gesture that is most appreciated.

Thank you once again for this timely message. I look forward to working with you toward the conclusion of an agreement that is beneficial to the Hamilton Tiger-Cats and the people of Hamilton.

Yours truly,

Fred Eisen[/i]berger

Just one historical point: the last concert at IWS was Rush on August 24, 1979. Pink Floyd played there on June 28, 1975. :wink:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivor_Wynne_Stadium [url=http://www.pf-db.com/index.php?bootleg_id=2892&concert_id=13]http://www.pf-db.com/index.php?bootleg_ ... cert_id=13[/url] http://www.test4echo.net/rush_tour_dates.htm

Perhaps David, Roger, Richard, and Nick liked Rush then? :stuck_out_tongue:

Oski Wee Wee,


So, what happened after 1979? New laws or new people to the area saying no thanks to concerts any longer? :?

I suppose it was more the latter, Earl-- the residential nature of the IWS neighbourhood is not conducive to having major live shows. The Floyd concert in 1975 did cause a lot of window-shattering fun etc. from the pyrotechnics from accounts I've read. The Rush show also led to some problems. Hopefully a new stadium will have less challenges re having to cater to its surroundings and can host big music events.

Oski Wee Wee,