2016 Offseason Discussion

I didn't say anything about Hall.I just said that everything in your previous statement was complete conjecture on your part.There is absolutely no basis for any of it.I respect your football knowledge but don't just make up random stories..Personaly I'd rather our D went after/pressured the QB more often but that's just me.

.....How about the 15 yd. cushion given to opposition receivers as well....AND Ritchie's penchant for the antiquated 'bend but don't break' schemes....that broke more than they bent..We need a DC who is more in tune with the times and innovative....We have a lot of talent on D that wasn't used properly and a stronger game against the run as well as your suggested,,'more pressure on the qb.' should be instituted.

I'm curious to know what the misuse of the talent was as you put it? Who should have been placed where?

Personally I believe Hall devised a defense that was in direct response to the talent he was given.

Not a great rush D, not great close coverage guys but talented with ball hawking and getting to the ball.

Any team that leads the league in takeaways by this wide a margin has got got a lot of things right.

Need a rush D upgrade and one shut-down corner in my opinion.
And save a little cap money for Bighill just in case ...

You actually have a point. Actually a few to be honest!
But they're counter-productive points. If Richie thought his d-line putrid, his linebacking crew under-sized and under-powered and his DBs great at ball-hawking but poor at tackling and/or coverage I would agree he built a defense to bend but not break - the great turnover numbers were over-shadowed by the high point giveup!

As an outsider looking in I'm with Wolverine on this one. Hall is a proven multiple Grey Cup winner. Area51 constant degrading of him is unwarranted and doesn't reflect the tools Hall had to work with IMO.

....Here's A MISUSE....if you have linebackers and ends not putting maximum pressure on the quarterback then they should have been dropping off in run coverage....What did we have....guys running around in nowhere land getting neither pressure nor helping to stop the run...Euclid Cummings (who had a helluva good year in argoland) looked lost and confused and Westerman (after having an all star year previous) did not perform up to his standard and I think it was the schemes...Just a couple of other things I noticed on our D as well ...You can't tell me that playing off receivers like we did and especially allowing a guy like LeFevour march down the field at will wasn't a little telling... Misused as in defensive 'schemes' period...There's not too many fans who were happy with the Ritchie Hall defence and most will point out that was our achilles heel in 17...We can do better

And you can dream on about Bighill....he has an agreement to return to the leo's as soon as he has scratched the nfl itch...But you're right...that's the type of linebacker we should be looking for....I believe Solo Elimimian is a free agent....we could show interest there.

Some good moves by Walters in the last couple of days. Re-upping Chad Rempel. Today they resigned last years picks Rupert Butcher, Zach Intzandt, and Frank Renaud. Renaud looks like a special teamer and probably one of those cheap salaries that bumps Sam Hurl off the roster. I'm really interested to see how Butcher and Intzandt look in camp though. Intzandt looks like he might be a PR guy right away who can become a decent depth OL down the road who can play a few spots. If he can adapt quickly, Butcher could be a really nice addition in the DL rotation, massive guy with a motor.

.....Eager to see what this guy can do...great potential.... IF the coaches can smooth out all of the wrinkles, he's a solid addition..... Once he finds a little finesse for his game, look out...Good signing along with the others.. :thup:

In last years draft and Walters gets Couture, Loeffler, Corney and Gauthier who all played last year which alone would mean he had a great draft. Now late round picks Intzandt and Butcher come back after becoming first team all stars, and another possible depth guy/special teamer in Renaud. Could be one of the best Bomber draft classes ever and all without a first round pick. Joe Mack didn't deliver that many players in all his drafts combined.

Joe wasn't even trying! Got paid big money just to stand around with a cup o java in hand and pretend he knew what he was doing. Joe is easily the one guy who set the organization back more than a couple years. If I had to rank the set back guys it would be as follows:

  1. Joe
  2. Joe Zaleski
  3. Jeff Reinbold
  4. Lord Lyle
  5. Brendan Taman
  6. Mike "Maggot" Kelly
  7. Timid Tim Burke
  8. Garthy Buchko/ Gary Etcheverry (tie)

PS. The rest of the league seems to agree with me. Of all the lords of chaos I listed, up until Joe Mack was brought out of his crypt by Kavis, only one guy found work in the league after his bomber tenure dried up - unbelievably it was Jeff Reinbold - who did nearly a decade in low profile college and European ball before being brought in as a spec. teams coach in Hammy. :cowboy:

....Yes Bombers sure picked some losers....

  1. Joe...or snoozy some called him...Makes Walters draft calls look like pure genius
  2. Joe Zaleski...nice guy but only goes to prove that nice guys finish last and he did
  3. Jeff 'hog' Reinbold ..came to town on a Harley/ sped off with one of the worst records ever
  4. Lord Lyle....took his royal self to Cowtown leaving a bad smell behind
  5. Brendan 'napkin boy' Taman...Draft pics for vets. was his motto..took his failed show west
  6. Mike 'handled internally' Kelly...Remembered for 'spy gate' and his shot down 'jet pac'..
  7. Tim 'throw them under the bus' Burke...Great dc...horrible head coach and bus driver
  8. Garth Buchko....proved that media guys should stay as that...'media guys'
  9. Gary 'etch-a-sketch' Etcheverry...thought he deserved a line of his own because his defensive schemes are still being examined by the Smithsonian and are leaving them bewildered..

Expanded a bit on them Lyle....hope you don't mind

Not at all Papa. Memories + bad smells = funny!

The point of the matter is ex-bomber coaches and GMs aren't really held in high stead by rest of league. Until cotton-eyed Joe conned Kavis Reed to get back as an assistant GM responsible for American recruitment the only guy on the 9-list who managed to con his way back into the league was Rowdy Reinbold.

I guess we could add Hillbilly Jim Bell, Ross "Count Poop" Hodgkinson, John Payne in the a** & Daryl "Mouse" Rogers to the list. I suspect Bell, Hodgkinson, Payne & Rogers are persona non grata in our great league. "Napkin Boy" Taman may still be emitting hope as his polish money roll starts depleting - but only as a junior executive, nothing serious!

Should mention that this uncanny ability of our pro football team finding people who are bottom-barrel and can't find work elsewhere might be more a Winnipeg problem vs. a football team problem. Winnipeg Jets had the same problem - most GMs, head coaches, top assistants, etc. ended up on the last hobo-train to The Forks. Rudy Pilous was a shell of a GM when he came to Wpg. - never worked much after getting fired. John Ferguson was fired despite all the press-box bluster and anger management issues - and he actually re-surfaced - but only as a junior executive in San Jose. John Paddock, Tom Watt, Tommy McVie basically washed out of top jobs after their weak showings in Winnipeg. Claude Noel was good at telling stories about being a timid forward in the old AHL - but he was a human wreckage as Jets V.2 coach. Barry Shenkarow, the oodles of executives he paid big coin to - most of them covered by City of Winnipeg/Prov. of Manitoba un-audited subsidies ended up on the scrap heap or peddling Old Dutch chips door to door. I guess Rick Bowness (an assistant) finagled his way to a temp job as Ottawa Sens head coach over a decade ago - but blew his head off real quick.

Kevin Take-a-Day-Off appears competent but I don't see him getting another GM job once his days in Wpg. come to an end. Paul Maurice has crafted a nice career as a smooth-talking, silver-tongued devil but he's gradually morphing into Mr. .500 aka Claude Maurice!

Charlie Huddy has certainly proven he's unfit to head coach at the NHL level and so have the 2 or 3 stragglers Maurice has patched onto the bench.

The only real guy that made it out of Manitoba were Moose AHL coaches. Randy Carlyle was a very good coach in Anaheim, in fact got a Stanley Cup before getting his arse fired and ending up in the Leafs horror story scrapbook. Same with Alain Vignault - who's probably the best guy ever to coach at some level in Winnipeg and spring into a higher NHL status. :cowboy:

......Won't go into the Jets problems...cuz there's too many and it's looking like the ol' Jet's were being run similarly, when 'Benny Bigskins and the Jets' was involved in professional hockey in our town ...What a disappointment this kid Trouba turned out to be...Just one of the malcontents giving the team troubles....How can they just watch this kid skate up and down the ice for that kind of money..Anyway...back to football....I get a feeling that Walters is going over every scenario possible with the quarterback situation...He would be wise to because as of now IF Nichols sticks to his guns, we might be doing a Hank Snow and we'll be Movin On...Don't know what it would cost to get Franklin here (probably an arm and a leg) if we decide to go that way...Certainly would secure our quarterback position for quite awhile and might be worth what Hervey is going to bend someone over for...I'm sure there's a lot of thought given to the Durant situation as well but it looks like Mont. (Kavis) is putting on the big schmooze to obtain his services....Free agency in just 2 short months...Someone is going to pull the trigger on a deal for one of these guys....maybe even Nichols... :roll:

Jacob the non-provider is actually playing at a higher level than I thought he would. A fairly undisciplined and out of control d-man with little to no offensive capability - he lost his first Mexican stand-off to a guy who specializes in Mexican stand-offs (Chevy).

Now, he has to wait until Chevy finds a dance partner to trade the guy off. Big Buff is even worse - every day is "Classic Country Club" day at MTS center with this big oaf. Undisciplined, 6'5", 275 lb. rover is playing more like a 5'6", 175 lb. rover (and we already got one of them)

As for Bombers - yep, Franklin would be Plan B if Nichols is intent on saving his old bum buddy Willy in Toronto AGAIN - but Franklin is obviously a risk - obviously an offensive no-mind like O'Shea would have little to do with him - but PLOP WOULD - and if Lapolice doesn't bond with this guy like he did with Nichols - DISASTER AWAITS!

A front-line of Kevin Glenn and Dom Davis doesn't exactly spell SIZZLE at the box office. Neither does Nichols for that matter!

Armed with fresh 3 or 4 year guaranteed contracts Kyle Walters and O'Shea can now do some serious "John Wayne Strutting" in the streets of Winnipeg. . . . . . at least publically until their first 5 game losing streak - where even the lemmings won't look them in the eye!

.......Have to agree on Buff especially after catching the game last night in Van. on the tube...He looked bloody gawd awful...He can't seem to hit the net with that big shot and looks like we overpaid on his new contract...He's letting the team down...AND as far as Trouba goes...message to Chevy....MOVE HIM....Luv that Laine kid tough

....Franklin, though an unproven, is being held in high esteem by a couple of clubs...Namely us and the riders...Corky knows him well and if he could get his clutches on him he'd be put up at the Hilton in Regina ...never mind the riders illegal players accommodation...Not only does the kid have talent...he's a genuine guy with the smarts... We need two things to happen and that would be for Mike 'status quo' O, to get rid of the tunnel vision as well as the Bermuda shorts, and start thinking long term...After all he just signed on for another 3 :wink:
What's a franchise quarterback worth???? I think we'll find out early in the new year as I think we'll make a play for him or someone else will :roll:

....A little aside to the Franklin thoughts....Esks. have just signed Brett Smith ,the qb. who was with the riders not too long ago....Could this be seen as a preparation by the schmoes, for life in the near future without Mr. Franklin... :roll: :roll:

Couldn't help but snicker and think somewhere in a Northern Saskatchewan Subway - Brendan Taman just finished his fantasy CFL neg list by including the name Dontari "Edgar A" Poe . . . . . . as a QB....

anything to get a rise outta people, ay Brendan? :cowboy:

Diamond Dougie Brown layed down some thoughts about what chores Wadzilla, Kyle Walters, etc. have in front of them. Its NOT A SHORT LIST:

Blue Bombers must pony up to preserve continuity

doug-brown By: Doug Brown
Posted: 12/26/2016 2:28

It may not sound logical, but off-seasons for football teams that have had successful regular-season campaigns — such as the 2016 Winnipeg Blue Bombers — can often be more difficult to navigate than for teams coming off a losing year.

The last time the Bombers had a winning record in the regular season and followed it up with a better record the following year was when they went 11-7 in 1992 and improved to 14-4 in 1993. If this team can improve from its 11-win campaign in 2016, and pick up a 12th victory — or more — in 2017, it would be the first time in 24 years it has been able to build off successes and not falter because of them.

The Bombers have 20 potential free agents to sign, including first two quarterbacks on the depth chart and at least five other starters from 2016.

DARRYL DYCK / THE CANADIAN PRESS

The Bombers have 20 potential free agents to sign, including first two quarterbacks on the depth chart and at least five other starters from 2016.

What makes it harder to achieve incremental success, season after season? Essentially, it comes down to trying to do more with less.

“More” in the sense you need to find another gear and level of performance out of your roster and “less” in the sense you have to do it with fewer resources in regard to both players and money — neither of which has been Winnipeg’s strong suit.

It is fair to say having the eye and gumption to recognize which players you can live without or who are on the back nine of their careers is a sightline that has often been obscured when this team has unearthed success. Once a player pins an 11-win season to his resumé and comes within a green mile field goal of a West Division title game, their stock (and worth) goes up.

No longer are they a part of a losing campaign, they are a valuable asset of a winning team — and a team can only stand to lose so many of those pieces if it wishes to continue to improve.

Even after the recent re-signing of long-snapper extraordinaire Chad Rempel, the Bombers still have some 20 potential free agents; some of them have their fingerprints all over the 2016 resurgence. The first two quarterbacks on the depth chart require new deals, as does left offensive tackle Stanley Bryant and at least five other starters from 2016.

Coming off an unsatisfactory season — such as 2014 and 2015, when the club won seven and five games, respectively — the franchise has most of the negotiating power.

As a player, you were a contributing factor in a losing season, so regardless of your talent, you could not have covered yourself in glory to the degree you hold all the cards at the bargaining table. You may have had a banner year statistically, but the team elements necessary for success were absent, and it is always unclear how that responsibility should be divided.

A general manager has a much easier time rationalizing cleaning house after the losses stack up, than overhauling a roster that authored the club’s best record since 2003 — and selling that decision to the public and players.

You don’t have to go much further than the team website to read testimonials from player after player about how a harmonious locker room and a tight-knit group of guys were catalysts for success in 2016.

Retaining that chemistry, while paying fair market value for so many free agents, is a balancing act exponentially harder than retaining players after seasons in which they are happy to still be employed.

Upper management has credited continuity for the Bombers’ turnaround — and it would be hard to sell anything less to a roster and a public that finally look to be turning the corner themselves.

Doug Brown, once a hard-hitting defensive lineman and frequently a hard-hitting columnist, appears weekly in the Free Press.

Twitter: @DougBrown97

.....Looking at the number of free agents for other clubs in the league, including the Cup finalists, I see we have one of the least amount of fa's to re-sign....20, although a large number is nothing out of the ordinary in the standard one year contract scenario of today...It looks to be the norm now and we seem to be alright in that area...Of course, being without a NO 1 qb. signed for 17' stands out, but the way it looks at present, there are other options heading to free agency at the position... We are hardly behind the eight ball...Medlock is more of a must sign , the rest would be nice at the right price BUT looking at other teams fa's, there's a few options there as well...Certainly every team looks for continuity, but in this market, I see everyone as being in the same boat, some clubs a little worse off, but we are not amongst them.. As well I'm sure Walters has a lot of plan B's in his desk.. :wink:

I'll give bomber mgmt. the rest of December and first 10 days of January to take their annual snooze - but if there isn't a flurry of activity between January 15th and Feb. 7th - we be in trouble! :cowboy:

Not a real deadline - but you have to impose some signing discipline based as much on timelines as salaries!

Obviously there's a few amongst the 20 who could be deemed 2016 duds - ex. Stan Bryant (first 8 games, he was OK thereafter), Sam Hurl, Pee Neufeld, the dud Canadian starting WR, Regina Richards, etc. All but Bryant should be ignored - or re-upped at dramatically reduced coin!

...Richards (what a gawd awful pic) and Hurl can hit the road...Bryant is better than he showed last year...but he better start showin' it if he wants more dough....Neufeld can get in the same ambulance as Richards and head back to Regina...He's done...I wouldn't miss any of them...Signings are pretty much silent all over the league....expect a 'passle' of them as soon as the new year hits or maybe even one or two announcements before 16' raps up...(which would have to be in the next few days)....There's a rumour going round (on the rider site) that we have made a play for Franklin and have been thwarted...????I don't know where their info. could have come from and it's probably bogus...We do have interest in the kid but I doubt it's much more than that right now... Apparently Nichols is sticking to his guns, you know the guns he's trying to shoot himself in the foot with...How the hell can he justify asking for that kind of coin with what was a 'good year' not a great one behind him..There's no way we pay him 400,000 big ones when he isn't worth 350,000 as far as I'm concerned...I think he better look around and try to find who else is willing to pay 400 K... answer..NOBODY.......I hope his agent (who also represents Durant) is informing him of that fact....Interesting days ahead