SJ Green Traded to Toronto

Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by LeStaf » Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:47 pm

Niagara Als wrote:This is the second time in this football fans career when a star receiver was traded. The trade of the great Hal Patterson to the Tiger Cats in the sixties shook the Als fandom. Patterson was an elite receiver,like SJ, both all stars. Patterson was an idol to the fans back then and was given the name of Mr Wonderful. SJ was a receiver deluxe and both were all stars. I had been thinking that SJ commanded a huge salary $200 000 and he and the GM might not agree on another salary base= the trade. I had been thinking that SJ's salary at $200 000 was huge and,the team management might want a salary reduction- this has already happened with others.I believe the Als management put sound thought into this matter and, all likely agreed not to continue with SJ at his existing salary. The trade was not really a trade, SJ was a gift to the Argos who gave back a sixth pick in the upcoming draft.
It should be noted that the Alouettes gave SJ a bonus of $50 000 this Spring, Unlike other teams who dropped player bonus's before they cut their player staff, the Alouettes waited until after SJ received his $50 000 bonus before trading him. I do believe this was a well thought out decision by the management. Factors were age, injury, time needed for SJ's healing ( he will not likely start with the Argos until later in season), their analysis of the team budget, the play of rookies at the mini-camp etc . To management credit, sound thought went into this decision.Unlike other players SJ did receive his huge bonus first then, the team and SJ went their separate ways. The Alouettes were fair with this great player. SJ was"happy" with the reality of all this and, is looking forward to be working again with Trestman. He was a great receiver and, I wish him well.


Beau parallèle. Mais je crois que les Alouettes se remettront plus facilement du départ de Green qu'ils ont subi celui de Prince Hal. Il y a Jackson qui est dans les rangs, Cunningham qui pourrait s'améliorer (les débuts de Cunningham me font penser à ceux d'Adarius Bowman, mais bon, il a pas mal de croûtes à manger pour devenir son égal, j'en conviens), Underwood qui peut tirer son épingle du jeu et quelques jeunes pour compléter la brigade. Ce que je retiens, c'est que les Alouettes ne se sont pas séparés de Green en sauvages. Une logique voulait qu'ils payent un receveur d'élite et non deux; ils ont choisi celui qui était en santé sur celui qui s'est sérieusement blessé.

Quand je regarde Popp rebâtir les Argonauts en les bourrant de vétérans, je ne peux que constater qu'il semble à court d'idées et de prospects. Nous verrons quels joueurs il pourra dénicher pour compléter son équipe, mais pour l'instant, les Argonauts jouent très gros en faisant reposer leurs succès sur Ray et Willy. Je vois très bien Ray performer dans le système de Trestman. Je vois moins l'indécis Willy y avoir du succès, lorsque Ray sera tombé au combat. Pour moi, Fajardo pourrait être plus à l'aise dans ce système. Reste à voir si les Argonauts pourront le faire progresser ou non. J'ai parfois l'impression que les progrès notables de Harris et Collaros étaient peut-être plus l'affaire de Milanovitch que de Brady.
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by LeStaf » Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:51 pm

Bigshot wrote:Si on regarde l'alignement de toronto avec les GREEN, ALAN-M. CASH, WHITAKER, VENABLE et PERRETT en plus de JIM POPP et TRESTMAN on peut les appelés les ALOUETTES de TORONTO maintenant. LOL :rockin:


et Tuck, et Brady...
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by HfxTC » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:00 pm

That's ok because Barker had done a very, very good job drafting good young Canadians. Popp is walking into a very nice situation.
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by GHT120 » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:26 pm

Niagara Als wrote:This is the second time in this football fans career when a star receiver was traded. The trade of the great Hal Patterson to the Tiger Cats in the sixties shook the Als fandom. Patterson was an elite receiver,like SJ, both all stars...

Patterson was coming of the 2nd best season of his career, not a massive knee injury.
SJ Green may tout his re-hab all he wants, every players says that when they are coming back from an injury. Jamaal Richardson blew out two ligaments when he was 32 and never was worth anything on the field again; SJ blew out 3 ligaments at 31. I hope the best for him, as he was a great player for the Als, but I think it is drinking the Kool Aid to assume he will return to past form.
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by HfxTC » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:29 pm

GHT120 wrote:
Niagara Als wrote:This is the second time in this football fans career when a star receiver was traded. The trade of the great Hal Patterson to the Tiger Cats in the sixties shook the Als fandom. Patterson was an elite receiver,like SJ, both all stars...

Patterson was coming of the 2nd best season of his career, not a massive knee injury.
SJ Green may tout his re-hab all he wants, every players says that when they are coming back from an injury. Jamaal Richardson blew out two ligaments when he was 32 and never was worth anything on the field again; SJ blew out 3 ligaments at 31. I hope the best for him, as he was a great player for the Als, but I think it is drinking the Kool Aid to assume he will return to past form.



Considering the return, had he been willing to postpone his bonus he deserved to have the opportunity to show he was capable of a return. We got nothing for him and we helped the team we'll be competing with to make the playoffs. This won't be pretty in November if Toronto punts us out of a playoff spot...
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by Niagara Als » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:43 am

I really do not believe that any CFL player would" be willing to postpone"a $50 000 bonus" what ever his situation- they take it when they get it. Le Staff noted earlier the team was willing to pay for one elite receiver who was healthy over one who is not healthy. My hunch if that once a player moves in age over the thirties he will he will be able to continue for additional playing years, that is, if he remains healthy. But for these players an injury can be the starting point of the ending point. Jameel Richardson, for example did not resume his best playing potential after the suffering the same injury as SJ. This situation often does happen in contact sports. Eric LePointe excelled after being given the Als running back position but, was unable to resume this position after injury. Ditto Calvillo and ditto dozens of players in any contact sport. The older players years of play is determined by the status of their health. I can recall many posts last season predicting a season's end for SJ. I do hope SJ can retain his health and his elite status catching passes from Rick Ray, who is yet another veteran struggling with this situation.
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by Johnny Ticat slayer » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:46 am

There is something about this trade Johnny does not understand. This is most likely within Richard's expertise.

If a player is traded, the receiving team gives that player a physical and medical examination. If the player has an injury or a long term ailment, the receiving team judges the player to not have passed his physical. The trade is then nullified and the player remains with his old team.

If Green passed his physical with the Argos, does that not suggest he was ready to play, as he states? (But the Als say he was not ready and wanted to put him on the 6 game injured list to start the season).

If the Alouettes' management is correct, and Green is not ready to play; why did he not fail his physical examination with the Argos? (and nullify the trade).

Johnny is scratching his head and asking WTF?
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by Grover » Sat Apr 22, 2017 6:31 am

Johnny Ticat slayer wrote:There is something about this trade Johnny does not understand. This is most likely within Richard's expertise.

If a player is traded, the receiving team gives that player a physical and medical examination. If the player has an injury or a long term ailment, the receiving team judges the player to not have passed his physical. The trade is then nullified and the player remains with his old team.

If Green passed his physical with the Argos, does that not suggest he was ready to play, as he states? (But the Als say he was not ready and wanted to put him on the 6 game injured list to start the season).

If the Alouettes' management is correct, and Green is not ready to play; why did he not fail his physical examination with the Argos? (and nullify the trade).

Johnny is scratching his head and asking WTF?


Could the conditional pick be conditional to SJ passing his physical?
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by HfxTC » Sat Apr 22, 2017 6:48 am

A team can waive a Physical. There is nothing that forces a team to include that in a trade.
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by jamie » Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:09 am

I'm not sure where the anguish is coming from.
Green is coming off a devastating knee injury and history is not on his side as far a recovering. Reportedly he would not redo his $250,000. You just can't pay that. Als signed Eastern MOP Jackson earlier as his replacement which they had to do. So it seems logical that Green has to go, if he won't redo contract.
And releasing Graves? two catches in 3 years? Because he is a holder and a distant back-up emergency punter? Granted Bailey is largely unproven but at least he's averaged 10-12 catches a year with EE where he had a tough time cracking the line-up. Guess we will see but I'm predicting that he'll be on the field a lot this year and gives the team a lot of flexibility. A big, tall, Canadian receiver with great upside. I think he'll push for a starting role.

On paper, virtually every move Reed has made has improved the Als. Popp is up to his old lazy ways of signing a non playoff teams cast offs.
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by HfxTC » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:10 pm

jamie wrote:I'm not sure where the anguish is coming from.
Green is coming off a devastating knee injury and history is not on his side as far a recovering. Reportedly he would not redo his $250,000. You just can't pay that. Als signed Eastern MOP Jackson earlier as his replacement which they had to do. So it seems logical that Green has to go, if he won't redo contract.
And releasing Graves? two catches in 3 years? Because he is a holder and a distant back-up emergency punter? Granted Bailey is largely unproven but at least he's averaged 10-12 catches a year with EE where he had a tough time cracking the line-up. Guess we will see but I'm predicting that he'll be on the field a lot this year and gives the team a lot of flexibility. A big, tall, Canadian receiver with great upside. I think he'll push for a starting role.

On paper, virtually every move Reed has made has improved the Als. Popp is up to his old lazy ways of signing a non playoff teams cast offs.


For me it isn't anguish. Just that he got nothing in return. Considering that. I'd have rather he traded him out west or release him outright.

As far as doing a good job, we have to wait and see the final 46 +10 roster. How much more talent is he going to dump to pay for his shopping spree is unknown at this time.

Besides this deal the Simmons deal was also terrible. Basically Kavis has helped fill every hole the Ticats and Argos have... We will see how all of this works out over the season.
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by jamie » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:18 pm

I think Reed chose the respectful high road for a veteran like Green. He traded him to the team of his choice. I don't think he would have garnered much elsewhere. Buono has always done this in BC ...actually releasing respected veterans to make their own preferred choices. Dickensen, Clermont, many others.... Green with all he's done in Montreal deserves some say I think.
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by tony » Sat Apr 22, 2017 3:14 pm

HfxTC wrote:
jamie wrote:I'm not sure where the anguish is coming from.
Green is coming off a devastating knee injury and history is not on his side as far a recovering. Reportedly he would not redo his $250,000. You just can't pay that. Als signed Eastern MOP Jackson earlier as his replacement which they had to do. So it seems logical that Green has to go, if he won't redo contract.
And releasing Graves? two catches in 3 years? Because he is a holder and a distant back-up emergency punter? Granted Bailey is largely unproven but at least he's averaged 10-12 catches a year with EE where he had a tough time cracking the line-up. Guess we will see but I'm predicting that he'll be on the field a lot this year and gives the team a lot of flexibility. A big, tall, Canadian receiver with great upside. I think he'll push for a starting role.

On paper, virtually every move Reed has made has improved the Als. Popp is up to his old lazy ways of signing a non playoff teams cast offs.


For me it isn't anguish. Just that he got nothing in return. Considering that. I'd have rather he traded him out west or release him outright.

As far as doing a good job, we have to wait and see the final 46 +10 roster. How much more talent is he going to dump to pay for his shopping spree is unknown at this time.

Besides this deal the Simmons deal was also terrible. Basically Kavis has helped fill every hole the Ticats and Argos have... We will see how all of this works out over the season.


Well said HfxTC. The proof whether Kavis's moves have improved the Als will be the on field product as well as the record.
To say it has improved the team before they even played a down, putting the cart before the horse I would say.
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by HfxTC » Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:05 pm

That's my take. Anyone can sign free agents and make trades, especially with nothing or older players coming the other way. Right now the only place I see an improvement is at the QB and LT position (assuming Jovan was brought in to play LT)

Simmons isn't an improvement over Perret
Jackson and Bailey are not improvements over Green and Carter.

So we've softened up the Dline to improve the Offense and right now I'm not convinced there is enough there to make a marked difference.
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Re: SJ Green Traded to Toronto

by GHT120 » Sat Apr 22, 2017 7:19 pm

Johnny Ticat slayer wrote:... If Green passed his physical with the Argos, does that not suggest he was ready to play, as he states?

Passing a physical means the injury has healed, or healed sufficiently to satisfy the new team; it is no guarantee of whether the player will be able to perform on the field. Just as healthy players lose a step or have reactions slowed as they get older, there is no guarantee that the healed flesh will be able to perform as it did pre-injury.

Johnny Ticat slayer wrote:(But the Als say he was not ready and wanted to put him on the 6 game injured list to start the season).

Has there been confirmation of this? It was widely speculated but has a reliable source said they know that the Als actually planned to do this?
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