Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by Dust » Sat Apr 08, 2017 5:15 pm

Grover wrote:The timing of this makes it an ideal time for Chris Jones to go hard after Franklin with a trade before the draft.

SSK 1st and/or Josiah St John and Roosevelt for Franklin

Hervey would never deal with Chris Jones, but new ESK's Interim GM Paul Jones just might


If Edmonton is holding out for this everyone will just wait until he's a free agent in a years time.

As for Hervey, he burned too many bridges, and then he got burned. A very abrasive personality, but certainly an astute football mind. It sounds like the team has been searching for his replacement since early January, the timing of this is not ideal for the team but they must have felt they had no choice.

They've had good teams the past few years but that hasn't translated into seats in the stands. Last year was one of the worst years for attendance in a long time for the Eskimos.
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by Migs » Sat Apr 08, 2017 6:10 pm

depopulationINC wrote:yeah he would...and what you are saying as a trade wouldn't happen. More than one team has already offered more than that....it is not like no other member of the club is going to be aware of what has been on the table in the past....come in lower and you get hung up on.


Any evidence to suggest that's true?
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by depopulationINC » Sat Apr 08, 2017 6:27 pm

Migs wrote:
depopulationINC wrote:yeah he would...and what you are saying as a trade wouldn't happen. More than one team has already offered more than that....it is not like no other member of the club is going to be aware of what has been on the table in the past....come in lower and you get hung up on.


Any evidence to suggest that's true?


It has been discussed on here if you want to look into it, but it is absolutely known that at minimum the Riders and the Bombers inquired. Both teams shrugged off the asking price (and good on Hervey for asking for the moon...he absolutely should have...no reason to have moved him unless it was a massive return). I honestly thought a Bombers trade would happen because of owning two 1st round picks.
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by HfxTC » Sat Apr 08, 2017 6:40 pm

After the move Rhodes pulled this week. Edmonton better not miss a beat on the field or it will be his head on a plate. Franklin insulates the Eskimos in the event Reilly goes down again.

Should they wish to move him there is another player who isn't afraid to give up picks or talent on a trade that would be very interested (Popp/Toronto) and this has the added bonus of getting him out of the division.

Edmonton should keep him and see how things develop over the season. There will be a new GM, that could bring in a new HC as well by the end of the year.
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by depopulationINC » Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:06 pm

HfxTC wrote:After the move Rhodes pulled this week. Edmonton better not miss a beat on the field or it will be his head on a plate. Franklin insulates the Eskimos in the event Reilly goes down again.

Should they wish to move him there is another player who isn't afraid to give up picks or talent on a trade that would be very interested (Popp/Toronto) and this has the added bonus of getting him out of the division.

Edmonton should keep him and see how things develop over the season. There will be a new GM, that could bring in a new HC as well by the end of the year.


Rhodes was pretty adamant Maas is going nowhere...I tend to think whomever comes on board will need to be cool with him. The one thing that might change that is accessibility...Hervey and Maas seemed to be on similar pages in that aspect so it would seem he probably needs to grow in that regard. A new GM will have emphasis on this with him...we shall see how that goes.
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by GHT120 » Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:33 pm

Grover wrote:... here are key clauses of #cfl #cfl ant-tampering rule:
a) permission in writing has been first obtained from the non-player employee’s current Club (President or General Manager)
b) approval in writing by the Commissioner or his delegate copied to both Clubs and the non-player employee
(c) (key one right now for @EdmontonEsks) (c) the contact above shall only be permitted during the two-month time period of Dec 1 to Jan. 31;

Hoisted by their franchise's own petard so to speak
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by HfxTC » Sat Apr 08, 2017 10:05 pm

depopulationINC wrote:
HfxTC wrote:After the move Rhodes pulled this week. Edmonton better not miss a beat on the field or it will be his head on a plate. Franklin insulates the Eskimos in the event Reilly goes down again.

Should they wish to move him there is another player who isn't afraid to give up picks or talent on a trade that would be very interested (Popp/Toronto) and this has the added bonus of getting him out of the division.

Edmonton should keep him and see how things develop over the season. There will be a new GM, that could bring in a new HC as well by the end of the year.


Rhodes was pretty adamant Maas is going nowhere...I tend to think whomever comes on board will need to be cool with him. The one thing that might change that is accessibility...Hervey and Maas seemed to be on similar pages in that aspect so it would seem he probably needs to grow in that regard. A new GM will have emphasis on this with him...we shall see how that goes.



We shall see. Who knows if Rhodes will even be there at the end of the season. What he pulled on friday could mean a drop in interest by fans and he won't have a meat shield as an excuse.
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by -Hammer- » Sat Apr 08, 2017 10:44 pm

From what I can tell, this is a partly political and partly off field firing.

As far as firing Tillman, I can't say I hold a grudge. Someone had to be the fall guy for that bogus Rickey Ray trade, after one of the shoddiest, poorest trades in history. Seriously, that trade was so one sided the league should have stepped in on it, but I digress.

His fines for saying that the Esks and Saskatchewan are both tampering, his comments about Simeon Rottier, his refusal to have his coaches mic'ed up, a history of being unfriendly with the media and a drop in attendance after winning a Grey Cup. You can't refuse to even pay lip service to the media, and be the only team who refuses to work with the media, when the media in this case is TSN and they are paying your organization over four million a year.

I think the biggest tell is what Rhodes said, straight up why they canned him.

“Two major reasons drove this decision,” said Rhodes. “First, both parties could not agree to contact extension terms. Secondly, there are differences in philosophy over the way we do business. During the course of recent negotiations for a possible contract extension, it became clear that we would be unable to meet Ed’s expectations.”


To the first, if Hervey wasn't agreeing to a contract extention, that to me screams he wanted more money and Rhodes wasn't going to give it for a GM who while perhaps good on the Football end of things, has been less then steallar on the media and public relations end. To the second, this is Rhodes likely saying "We aren't going along with business as usual. We're getting flack from the league and our TV partner why we are the lone franchise that they have access issues with." and Hervey trying to say "Well, I get results so who cares what the TV partner thinks?" and I have little doubt Hervey was warned about this before.

Now that all said, this is not the time for this to happen. Any contract extension should have been worked out in December, and if you were going to can the guy, January was the time to do it. Now, the Esks scouting camps are in jeopardy and to do this, a month before the draft, could be disasterous perhaps not this year, but in future years if they don't have a replacement already lined up.
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by depopulationINC » Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:09 pm

HfxTC wrote:
depopulationINC wrote:
HfxTC wrote:After the move Rhodes pulled this week. Edmonton better not miss a beat on the field or it will be his head on a plate. Franklin insulates the Eskimos in the event Reilly goes down again.

Should they wish to move him there is another player who isn't afraid to give up picks or talent on a trade that would be very interested (Popp/Toronto) and this has the added bonus of getting him out of the division.

Edmonton should keep him and see how things develop over the season. There will be a new GM, that could bring in a new HC as well by the end of the year.


Rhodes was pretty adamant Maas is going nowhere...I tend to think whomever comes on board will need to be cool with him. The one thing that might change that is accessibility...Hervey and Maas seemed to be on similar pages in that aspect so it would seem he probably needs to grow in that regard. A new GM will have emphasis on this with him...we shall see how that goes.


We shall see. Who knows if Rhodes will even be there at the end of the season. What he pulled on friday could mean a drop in interest by fans and he won't have a meat shield as an excuse.



I can entirely see him being gone but this was fully backed by the board for a reason...if things go sideways he likely leaves...but let's be honest, he had a high probability of being gone even without any of this due to the battle he is facing in his personal life.
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by depopulationINC » Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:14 pm

-Hammer- wrote:From what I can tell, this is a partly political and partly off field firing.

As far as firing Tillman, I can't say I hold a grudge. Someone had to be the fall guy for that bogus Rickey Ray trade, after one of the shoddiest, poorest trades in history. Seriously, that trade was so one sided the league should have stepped in on it, but I digress.

His fines for saying that the Esks and Saskatchewan are both tampering, his comments about Simeon Rottier, his refusal to have his coaches mic'ed up, a history of being unfriendly with the media and a drop in attendance after winning a Grey Cup. You can't refuse to even pay lip service to the media, and be the only team who refuses to work with the media, when the media in this case is TSN and they are paying your organization over four million a year.

I think the biggest tell is what Rhodes said, straight up why they canned him.

“Two major reasons drove this decision,” said Rhodes. “First, both parties could not agree to contact extension terms. Secondly, there are differences in philosophy over the way we do business. During the course of recent negotiations for a possible contract extension, it became clear that we would be unable to meet Ed’s expectations.”


To the first, if Hervey wasn't agreeing to a contract extention, that to me screams he wanted more money and Rhodes wasn't going to give it for a GM who while perhaps good on the Football end of things, has been less then steallar on the media and public relations end. To the second, this is Rhodes likely saying "We aren't going along with business as usual. We're getting flack from the league and our TV partner why we are the lone franchise that they have access issues with." and Hervey trying to say "Well, I get results so who cares what the TV partner thinks?" and I have little doubt Hervey was warned about this before.

Now that all said, this is not the time for this to happen. Any contract extension should have been worked out in December, and if you were going to can the guy, January was the time to do it. Now, the Esks scouting camps are in jeopardy and to do this, a month before the draft, could be disasterous perhaps not this year, but in future years if they don't have a replacement already lined up.



“Two major reasons drove this decision,” said Rhodes. “First, both parties could not agree to contact extension terms. Secondly, there are differences in philosophy over the way we do business. During the course of recent negotiations for a possible contract extension, it became clear that we would be unable to meet Ed’s expectations.”


take special note that this says terms...that does not mean money in this situation as some media is twisting it.
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by -Hammer- » Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:26 pm

depopulationINC wrote:take special note that this says terms...that does not mean money in this situation as some media is twisting it.


That's fair, but what other terms do you negotiate as part of a contract extension? I doubt an arguement over benefits or a pension was part of it.

Given that Rhodes's next reason pretty much was a PC way of saying we wanted Ed to have less autonomy and wanted to follow our business philosphy more and he didn't/wouldn't find that acceptable, what else is there in a contract extension?

It doesn't exactly make sense to say "He didn't find our contract extension autonomy terms acceptable, and we felt that he he didn't find out autonomy terms acceptable."
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by depopulationINC » Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:32 pm

-Hammer- wrote:
depopulationINC wrote:take special note that this says terms...that does not mean money in this situation as some media is twisting it.


That's fair, but what other terms do you negotiate as part of a contract extension? I doubt an arguement over benefits or a pension was part of it.

Given that Rhodes's next reason pretty much was a PC way of saying we wanted Ed to have less autonomy and wanted to follow our business philosphy more and he didn't/wouldn't find that acceptable, what else is there in a contract extension?

It doesn't exactly make sense to say "He didn't find our contract extension autonomy terms acceptable, and we felt that he he didn't find out autonomy terms acceptable."


duties aka power. So yeah, it does make sense when looking at it from that angle. "I want x power/tittle" "no" impasse reached...potentially manageable if there are not other issues causing tension.
Last edited by depopulationINC on Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by HfxTC » Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:32 pm

Title, position, responsabilities, duration...
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by -Hammer- » Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:50 pm

HfxTC wrote:Title, position, responsabilities, duration...


Fair enough, although bigger title and posistion go back to autonomy, as do less defined responsibilities. If I'm the manager+president, and I have more nebulous expectations I have a lot less oversight, because I can dictate policy as the president.

Duration is a valid consideration, long term deals can always be an issue in sports.

I'm probably just looking to deeply into Rhode's PC talk.
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Re: Esks GM Ed Hervey relieved of duties

by HfxTC » Sun Apr 09, 2017 7:26 am

Rhodes wanted him gone... His need to vent and satisfaction at the press conference is undeniable.
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