KevinRiley2

Hopefully this will temper people's love of spending tax dollars on non essentials...

http://business.financialpost.com/news/economy/refile-wrapup-1-mixed-bag-of-canada-economic-data-leaves-room-for-more-rate-hikes

Every rate hike makes the country's debt (Fed, Prov, Municipal) more expensive.  While I disagree with the BOC on all these hikes, if it causes government to be smarter with our tax dollars, that is a positive.

Money for healthcare?  Yes!

Money for stadiums and Olympics?  No!
* Kevin Riley = The moral conscience AND movie reviewer for cfl.ca.  :)
* When in doubt, always ask (WWKD) What Would Kevin Do?
* Forgive me for always taking the High Road.  It's the ONLY Road I know.

The Last Word

Quebec I broke so let's hope they say no.
No Quebec is not broke.  They are outpacing the Canadian economy at this point.  And they had a $4.5 billion surplus for the fiscal year of 2016-17.

 http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/from-the-doghouse-to-a-powerhouse-quebecs-economy-has-rebounded

The province’s economic growth exceeded projections in the first quarter of 2017, with gross domestic product increasing 1.1 per cent over the first three months, outpacing Canada as a whole. That growth meant higher tax-revenues for the provincial government, and last month Leitao announced that Quebec had ended the 2016-17 fiscal year with a $4.5 billion surplus — nearly twice what had been forecast in his March 28 budget.

Considering that Quebec City received nearly $200 million from the province for their new arena, it should be quite easy for Montreal to receive $100 + million from the province for this hypothetical baseball stadium should the stars align.

KevinRiley2

Quebec I broke so let's hope they say no.
No Quebec is not broke.  They are outpacing the Canadian economy at this point.  And they had a $4.5 billion surplus for the fiscal year of 2016-17.

 http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/from-the-doghouse-to-a-powerhouse-quebecs-economy-has-rebounded

The province’s economic growth exceeded projections in the first quarter of 2017, with gross domestic product increasing 1.1 per cent over the first three months, outpacing Canada as a whole. That growth meant higher tax-revenues for the provincial government, and last month Leitao announced that Quebec had ended the 2016-17 fiscal year with a $4.5 billion surplus — nearly twice what had been forecast in his March 28 budget.

Considering that Quebec City received nearly $200 million from the province for their new arena, it should be quite easy for Montreal to receive $100 + million from the province for this hypothetical baseball stadium should the stars align.
Yes, they are broke.  You need to understand the difference between deficit and debt.

Anyway, like I said, hopefully the interest rate increases, which will make the debt even more painful, will keep governments in line.

********

Re : "Considering that Quebec City received nearly $200 million from the province for their new arena"

And how did THAT turn out?  Been to a Nordiques game lately?

The Last Word

Let's hope Montreal learns a lesson from the NHL/Quebec City and says "NO" to a new stadium.
Well public financing for a baseball stadium will obviously be contingent on an MLB team relocating to Montreal.  They will not build one on speculation.  While Quebec City probably did need a new arena they could have built a similar sized one as the Videotron Centre but with fewer features and less "polish" similar to Oklahoma's arena prior to the arrival of the Sonics or the MTS Centre prior to the arrival of the Jets.  They could have saved well over $100 million had they done so. 

KevinRiley2

Let's hope Montreal learns a lesson from the NHL/Quebec City and says "NO" to a new stadium.
Well public financing for a baseball stadium will obviously be contingent on an MLB team relocating to Montreal.  They will not build one on speculation.  While Quebec City probably did need a new arena they could have built a similar sized one as the Videotron Centre but with fewer features and less "polish" similar to Oklahoma's arena prior to the arrival of the Sonics or the MTS Centre prior to the arrival of the Jets.  They could have saved well over $100 million had they done so.
NO MORE TAX MONEY FOR PUBLIC STADIUMS!!!

If you want a stadium, pay for it privately - feel free to kick in your own money.

The Last Word

Quebec I broke so let's hope they say no.
No Quebec is not broke.  They are outpacing the Canadian economy at this point.  And they had a $4.5 billion surplus for the fiscal year of 2016-17.

 http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/from-the-doghouse-to-a-powerhouse-quebecs-economy-has-rebounded

The province’s economic growth exceeded projections in the first quarter of 2017, with gross domestic product increasing 1.1 per cent over the first three months, outpacing Canada as a whole. That growth meant higher tax-revenues for the provincial government, and last month Leitao announced that Quebec had ended the 2016-17 fiscal year with a $4.5 billion surplus — nearly twice what had been forecast in his March 28 budget.

Considering that Quebec City received nearly $200 million from the province for their new arena, it should be quite easy for Montreal to receive $100 + million from the province for this hypothetical baseball stadium should the stars align.
Yes, they are broke.  You need to understand the difference between deficit and debt.

Anyway, like I said, hopefully the interest rate increases, which will make the debt even more painful, will keep governments in line.

********

Re : "Considering that Quebec City received nearly $200 million from the province for their new arena"

And how did THAT turn out?  Been to a Nordiques game lately?
Wow!  Kevin you are telling me that deficit and debt are different!?  Who knew? ::)

In 2015-16, Quebec did pay down a portion of their debt, not just the interest on it and that was with a smaller surplus.  With this much larger surplus in 2016-17, I suspect they will pay a much larger portion this year.

Since a city of 800,000 received nearly $200 million from the province for a new arena, I don't think a city that is 5 times its size will have difficulty in receiving a substantial public subsidy for a new baseball stadium.  Optics will play a role of course.  "Hey if Quebec City received a generous government handout for an arena why shouldn't we for a new baseball stadium?" says Montreal.  Of course, this will be contingent on a current team moving to Montreal, not a possibility of one.  They will not build a new facility on speculation.

Just be thankful that the feds paid for THF or the Ticats would be in dire straits right now if not outright folded.  Unlike teams out west, like the Bombers and the Riders, Hamilton had to rely on the federal taxpayer to bail them out lol.

KevinRiley2

Re : "Wow!  Kevin you are telling me that deficit and debt are different!?  Who knew?"

Obviously, based on your posts, you didn't know.

Re : "Since a city of 800,000 received nearly $200 million from the province for a new arena"

Again, how did THAT turn out?  Been to a Nordiques game lately?

Re : "Just be thankful that the feds paid for THF or the Ticats would be in dire straits right now if not outright folded.  Unlike teams out west, like the Bombers and the Riders, Hamilton had to rely on the federal taxpayer to bail them out lol."

I am thankful.  Now, from this day forward, NO more money for stadiums.

With the interest rate increases, Quebec will feel a real pinch, and I hope it kills the idea for a stadium.

The Last Word

Like I said, if funding for a new baseball stadium is contingent on a team moving to Montreal.  Not a 50% probability, not a 80% probability, but a 100% probability.  If the funding is secured for a new ballpark in Montreal but

1. Tampa secures funding for a new ballpark in their city
2. Oakland secures funding for a new ballpark in their city
3. there is no expansion on the horizon

then there will be no taxpayer-funded ballpark in Montreal.  It will not be Hamilton or Quebec City part deux.

KevinRiley2

Like I said, if funding for a new baseball stadium is contingent on a team moving to Montreal.  Not a 50% probability, not a 80% probability, but a 100% probability.  If the funding is secured for a new ballpark in Montreal but

1. Tampa secures funding for a new ballpark in their city
2. Oakland secures funding for a new ballpark in their city
3. there is no expansion on the horizon

then there will be no taxpayer-funded ballpark in Montreal.  It will not be Hamilton or Quebec City part deux.
NO MORE TAX MONEY FOR PUBLIC STADIUMS!!!

If you want a stadium, pay for it privately - feel free to kick in your own money.

The Last Word

Like I said, if funding for a new baseball stadium is contingent on a team moving to Montreal.  Not a 50% probability, not a 80% probability, but a 100% probability.  If the funding is secured for a new ballpark in Montreal but

1. Tampa secures funding for a new ballpark in their city
2. Oakland secures funding for a new ballpark in their city
3. there is no expansion on the horizon

then there will be no taxpayer-funded ballpark in Montreal.  It will not be Hamilton or Quebec City part deux.
NO MORE TAX MONEY FOR PUBLIC STADIUMS!!!

If you want a stadium, pay for it privately - feel free to kick in your own money.
I never said I was in favor of it.  I am just stating what I think will happen if stadium talks go nowhere in Tampa or expansion appears on the horizon.

Mightygoose

Question for those in the not one cent of taxpayer's money crowd, would your stance be the same if this was for a stadium that can accommodate a CFL team, new or existing?

On this project, I agree with those that say this won't be built ajd money spent unless a MLB team is a sure thing.

Quebec wanted to replace their arena anyways so why not spend the extra and be ready should an NHL team he available in short notice.

sambo42

Question for those in the not one cent of taxpayer's money crowd, would your stance be the same if this was for a stadium that can accommodate a CFL team, new or existing?

On this project, I agree with those that say this won't be built ajd money spent unless a MLB team is a sure thing.

Quebec wanted to replace their arena anyways so why not spend the extra and be ready should an NHL team he available in short notice.
 There is one already built to house a CFL team... the New Mosaic... it was built largely with taxpayer dollars, and that could potentially double by the time they put a roof on it, especially if its a retractable one. I don't have grudge about the new Mosaic being built, the only thing I have a problem with is who paid for it, the taxpayers. The former mayor of Regina, Fiasco(Fiacco), put out the red herring of the RRI( Regina Rehabilitation Initiative), in which he said there was a private investor of 3/4 of a billion dollars... some speculated it the Seminoles Nation, but never came to pass. So the taxpayers ended up footing the bill for the stadium... I'm sure someone will correct me or add to what I have posted... but that is what I have heard. I believe the RRI is a project, just not what the former mayor had envisioned.

ArgoT

Quebec I broke so let's hope they say no.
Quebec has actually posted budget surpluses the last two years although it does still have a high debt.  

I think a couple of hundred million may be a wise investment for the province based on the return they would see from economic impact of a team over the long term assuming they could come up with the rest of the financing of a stadium from other sources.  The economic impact each year from just a few weekend series against the Jays, Yankees and Red Sox (about a 5 hours drive from Boston - about the same distance as Toronto) each year - could be quite significant.  

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-05-05/quebec-s-leitao-open-to-personal-tax-cuts-after-budget-surplus



Don't agree.
People have disposable income, if it is spent on sporting events it means it will not be spent at another event/purchase.
There is only so much a dollar will go around.
There is no correlation that I have seen that shows a sporting event and or franchise being a boom to the economy.
Ok, yes maybe  a one off such as the grey Cup with people coming in from across the country.
The hotels and restaurants, being private enterprise may see a spike but not to the citizens as a whole.

ArgoT

Re : "Wow!  Kevin you are telling me that deficit and debt are different!?  Who knew?"

Obviously, based on your posts, you didn't know.

Re : "Since a city of 800,000 received nearly $200 million from the province for a new arena"

Again, how did THAT turn out?  Been to a Nordiques game lately?

Re : "Just be thankful that the feds paid for THF or the Ticats would be in dire straits right now if not outright folded.  Unlike teams out west, like the Bombers and the Riders, Hamilton had to rely on the federal taxpayer to bail them out lol."

I am thankful.  Now, from this day forward, NO more money for stadiums.

With the interest rate increases, Quebec will feel a real pinch, and I hope it kills the idea for a stadium.
Exactly, QC is no closer to an NHL team now, same thing happened in Hamilton when they built their arena thinking they were either going after the new expansion team or the Cayotes.
What a waste.

KevinRiley2

Like I said, if funding for a new baseball stadium is contingent on a team moving to Montreal.  Not a 50% probability, not a 80% probability, but a 100% probability.  If the funding is secured for a new ballpark in Montreal but

1. Tampa secures funding for a new ballpark in their city
2. Oakland secures funding for a new ballpark in their city
3. there is no expansion on the horizon

then there will be no taxpayer-funded ballpark in Montreal.  It will not be Hamilton or Quebec City part deux.
NO MORE TAX MONEY FOR PUBLIC STADIUMS!!!

If you want a stadium, pay for it privately - feel free to kick in your own money.
I never said I was in favor of it.  I am just stating what I think will happen if stadium talks go nowhere in Tampa or expansion appears on the horizon.
NO MORE TAX MONEY FOR PUBLIC STADIUMS!!!

If you want a stadium, pay for it privately - feel free to kick in your own money.
 


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