Aerial

Quote
Using public money for a football stadium with only 10 home dates and a handful of other events that draw any people a year - THAT - I would have an issue with.
Hey Pat, ya, forget smaller cities like Hamilton, Edmonton, Ottawa, Calgary etc. that don't have any chance of an MLB team in an American controlled and dominated league or even an AAA team (Ottawa had one but couldn't keep it, London had an AA team and couldn't keep it etc)  and therefore forget anything for something like a domestic football/soccer stadium for a domestic leagues and for a league like the Canadian Football League and upcoming Canadian Professional Soccer League.

Not worth it I guess, only cities that count to you are cities like Toronto that can build $500 mill dollar stadiums for baseball.  I get your schtick, believe me.   ::) ::) ::)  

Some of us actually do believe in investing in facilities that have leagues operate out of them that are Canadian owned and operated leagues and leagues that the cities are able to have a team in.
"Canadian football does in fact have 4 downs, its just that as Canadians we are very polite and punt on the third down" -John Candy, SCTV

Hank01


 Depends on the crowds T Pat Montreal was getting 5,000 to 10,000 a night and playing in Poor Puerto Rico because they were not getting anyone to the park .
I doubt they were really doing anything for tourism .

 When the Jays are popular yes but when they are not which they might be someday they are no different in bringing people in to see them . Once the hype is gone you are left with die hards . 

 Toronto Maple Leafs just don't have any tickets for out of towners for a reasonable price you will get a few but the Jays are much more an affordable and easier to get to ticket . I think the Leafs because of price point and availability are very much a local area consumer even though they have swaths of fans across Canada . They simply can't afford the tickets anymore .

Concerts are a big Yes they will bring followers in from everywhere for the One Of 
type events .

  

KevinRiley2

For a baseball stadium - like an arena - I don't have a problem with SOME public money being involved.  The crowds they attract for multiple events (80+ for baseball and at least that many between sports, concerts and other events for arenas) has a fairly substantial positive spin-off impact on the cities particularly in the area they are in.  How many businesses in downtown Toronto (hotels, bars, restaurants etc) thrive in large part because of the presence of the ACC and Rogers Centre and the multiple millions who flock to events at those venues - many from out of town?  

Using public money for a football stadium with only 10 home dates and a handful of other events that draw any people a year - THAT - I would have an issue with.

Jays on summer weekends are responsible for hundreds of hotel rooms being filled in that city on multiple home weekends. And also when I used to be involved with Tourism Toronto - they figured the economic impact from a promotional point of view when the Jays was worth millions to the tourism industry because of the free promotion of the city any national telecast in the USA brought.
NO PUBLIC MONEY FOR STADIUMS!!!
* Kevin Riley = The moral conscience AND movie reviewer for cfl.ca.  :)
* When in doubt, always ask (WWKD) What Would Kevin Do?
* Forgive me for always taking the High Road.  It's the ONLY Road I know.

Mightygoose

For a baseball stadium - like an arena - I don't have a problem with SOME public money being involved.  The crowds they attract for multiple events (80+ for baseball and at least that many between sports, concerts and other events for arenas) has a fairly substantial positive spin-off impact on the cities particularly in the area they are in.  How many businesses in downtown Toronto (hotels, bars, restaurants etc) thrive in large part because of the presence of the ACC and Rogers Centre and the multiple millions who flock to events at those venues - many from out of town?  

Using public money for a football stadium with only 10 home dates and a handful of other events that draw any people a year - THAT - I would have an issue with.

Jays on summer weekends are responsible for hundreds of hotel rooms being filled in that city on multiple home weekends. And also when I used to be involved with Tourism Toronto - they figured the economic impact from a promotional point of view when the Jays was worth millions to the tourism industry because of the free promotion of the city any national telecast in the USA brought.
NO PUBLIC MONEY FOR STADIUMS!!!
Same stance for a potential stadium in Halifax that can host a CFL team? ;)

TravelPat1


 Depends on the crowds T Pat Montreal was getting 5,000 to 10,000 a night and playing in Poor Puerto Rico because they were not getting anyone to the park .
I doubt they were really doing anything for tourism .

 When the Jays are popular yes but when they are not which they might be someday they are no different in bringing people in to see them . Once the hype is gone you are left with die hards .

Even when the Jays were lousy and not that popular - when I lived in downtown Toronto - there would still be several weekends each year when thousands of fans from Detroit, Boston, New York and/or Chicago would flood downtown - booking hundreds of hotel rooms when their teams were in town.  Some weekend games against the BoSox and Yankees in those days there would be close to 10,000 visiting team fans in the park. 

You would always run into tons of them all weekend in places like the Eaton Centre or down at Harbourfront - and of course the packed bars and restaurants anywhere near the Rogers Centre pre-or-post game. Similar to how Toronto fans flood into Seattle, Detroit and/or Cleveland a few weekends each year. Last year when the Jays had a weekend series vs. the Cubs at Wrigley some estimates of close to 10,000 Jays fans flooded into that city. The Chicago Tribune even had an article on the 'Canadian Invasion' 

Tourism related businesses LOVE that sort of thing  - because that means a nice $$$ bump when those fans are in your city - but also all those people go home and become a tourism sales force for you when they tell all their friends how much fun they had.  There is a good reason that the Jays are almost always featured in Tourism Toronto publications that go out promoting the city across North America. 

Here's an interesting piece on the potential economic impact the Expos being reborn might have for Montreal and Quebec. 
http://exposnation.com/en/expos-economic-impact-revisited-in-2013/

Aerial

Of course Pat you're conveniently leaving out the Hamilton's, Calgary's, Edmonton's, Ottawa's etc. in your analysis of what "matters".  Same old, same old.  

I'm afraid my man that MLB will be ONE team in Canada for a while and maybe two teams at some point.  Less than 1 percent at some point 3 teams, after that there is no point talking percentages for any length of time.

That's it and the sctick I'm afraid, and them's the facts.  Not fake news but REAL news.  Like it or lump it.  ;)

Hank01


 Depends on the crowds T Pat Montreal was getting 5,000 to 10,000 a night and playing in Poor Puerto Rico because they were not getting anyone to the park .
I doubt they were really doing anything for tourism .

 When the Jays are popular yes but when they are not which they might be someday they are no different in bringing people in to see them . Once the hype is gone you are left with die hards .

Even when the Jays were lousy and not that popular - when I lived in downtown Toronto - there would still be several weekends each year when thousands of fans from Detroit, Boston, New York and/or Chicago would flood downtown - booking hundreds of hotel rooms when their teams were in town.  Some weekend games against the BoSox and Yankees in those days there would be close to 10,000 visiting team fans in the park.

You would always run into tons of them all weekend in places like the Eaton Centre or down at Harbourfront - and of course the packed bars and restaurants anywhere near the Rogers Centre pre-or-post game. Similar to how Toronto fans flood into Seattle, Detroit and/or Cleveland a few weekends each year. Last year when the Jays had a weekend series vs. the Cubs at Wrigley some estimates of close to 10,000 Jays fans flooded into that city. The Chicago Tribune even had an article on the 'Canadian Invasion'

Tourism related businesses LOVE that sort of thing  - because that means a nice $$$ bump when those fans are in your city - but also all those people go home and become a tourism sales force for you when they tell all their friends how much fun they had.  There is a good reason that the Jays are almost always featured in Tourism Toronto publications that go out promoting the city across North America.

Here's an interesting piece on the potential economic impact the Expos being reborn might have for Montreal and Quebec.
http://exposnation.com/en/expos-economic-impact-revisited-in-2013/
I agree with you when the teams are hot but if the Jays struggle there does seem to be a large drop off .

When it comes to the Yankees and Bosox I have to say I am one of those people you would see with Yankee gear on . I am actually surprised how many of us just have different affiliations than Jays in Canada .

Tourism in the Summer for Toronto is great I think the Jays just add another reason to check it out ( the location of the stadium makes a difference for tourists ) and some will be there and add to the list or the opposite they come for the Jays but end up at HHOF ,Wonderland , The EX , The Carbana Week ,Tiff etc ...  . Definitely think there is a entertainment impact and now that the Expos are long gone the easiest way to watch MLB live .

I wouldn't say they have no impact I just think if they put up bad numbers they have no Chicago Cubs , Maple Leafs loyalty going for them to carry them the same way as you see ; when they are hot .

Hank01



  Just wanted to add I am one not sure who else feels that way but I won't travel to see anything from the 500 level ever again at Skydome . Done it several times and always mad at myself afterwards . Will need to sit lower . Definitely will not travel to sit miles away from the field .  The upper deck at BMO is so much better and comfortable .

letsgoticats



  Just wanted to add I am one not sure who else feels that way but I won't travel to see anything from the 500 level ever again at Skydome . Done it several times and always mad at myself afterwards . Will need to sit lower . Definitely will not travel to sit miles away from the field .  The upper deck at BMO is so much better and comfortable .
I find some of the best seats in the Rogers Centre are 500 level, right behind home plate.  Particularly the first ~5 rows.  Great value, as I find the view from up there beats the more expensive seats way down the 1st/3rd base lines and in the outfield.  I agree that 500 level outfield seats are garbage though.  If I was travelling a significant distance to go to a game, I'd definitely splurge for good seats.  

KevinRiley2

For a baseball stadium - like an arena - I don't have a problem with SOME public money being involved.  The crowds they attract for multiple events (80+ for baseball and at least that many between sports, concerts and other events for arenas) has a fairly substantial positive spin-off impact on the cities particularly in the area they are in.  How many businesses in downtown Toronto (hotels, bars, restaurants etc) thrive in large part because of the presence of the ACC and Rogers Centre and the multiple millions who flock to events at those venues - many from out of town?  

Using public money for a football stadium with only 10 home dates and a handful of other events that draw any people a year - THAT - I would have an issue with.

Jays on summer weekends are responsible for hundreds of hotel rooms being filled in that city on multiple home weekends. And also when I used to be involved with Tourism Toronto - they figured the economic impact from a promotional point of view when the Jays was worth millions to the tourism industry because of the free promotion of the city any national telecast in the USA brought.
NO PUBLIC MONEY FOR STADIUMS!!!
Same stance for a potential stadium in Halifax that can host a CFL team? ;)
Well...   There is ALWAYS exceptions to every rule.  ;)

TravelPat1

Of course Pat you're conveniently leaving out the Hamilton's, Calgary's, Edmonton's, Ottawa's etc. in your analysis of what "matters".  Same old, same old.  

Well Earl when the thread is about an MLB team potentially moving back to Montreal I thought a discussion of the potential impact it might have hosting 80+ ball games a year using the one city in the country that already has as MLB team as an example  - talking about the impact thousands visitors to that city for several weekends a year has - seemed appropriate.

Were there MLB teams hosting 80+ games that attracted thousands of visitors several weekends a year to that city in each of Hamilton, Calgary, Edmonton and Ottawa - then maybe I would have sited examples for them too.  But last time I checked Tim Hortons Field is only being used for events that draw crowds about 15 times a year. 

I know you have a big hate on for Toronto - but sometimes it really is the best city to use as an example when discussing certain topics - like this one. 

Aerial

Pat, I don't have a hate-on for Toronto at all, sure it's not a city I ever wish to live in but the Blue Jays are my second fav MLB team, the Argos have been, much of my life, my favourite CFL team and probably now share that honour with the Cats.  Ok, I've never loved the Leafs, as someone raised as a Habs fan that's tough, but now that Rogers is in on ownership with the Argos, well, no way can I hate any of the MLSE teams at all.  (I've never had a fav NBA or MLS team and probably never will but I can root for the Raps since they are Canada's only team and TFC since they were the first MLS team I guess).  Plus if they make MLSE money then that is good for the team I really care about that MLSE owns, the Argos, what's good for the goose is good for the gander as they say.

I've been to many a fine concert and pubs in Toronto and immensely have loved the Danforth, Taste of the Danforth, and walking on the waterfront area just west of the Ex grounds etc.  Scarborough Bluffs area very nice as well.  ROM, Science Centre great also.

Certain topics like MLB Canadian teams though can really only best be discussed by those cities that have teams, Toronto, or have had a team, Montreal.  I guess we both agree on that.  But to try and compare cities to Toronto that don't have MLB teams and comparing the MLB experience in Toronto to those cities, isn't really accurate, if that is what you are doing, not sure.

And I've met some very nice Torontonians who have been born and raised there, like some of my cousins for example.  ;)


Quote
But last time I checked Tim Hortons Field is only being used for events that draw crowds about 15 times a year.
True, it's not a baseball stadium and wasn't built for a baseball team since Hamilton doesn't have one, except in the Intercounty League where there is a stadium, Bernie Arbor.  Hamilton has a football team in a pro league and an possible new pro soccer team, hence why a football/soccer stadium was built.  What, were they supposed to build a MLB stadium or even semi-pro stadium without a baseball team???

Mightygoose

Mayor Plante to meet with investors this week and perhaps she's more in board now

https://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/montreal-mayor-meet-investors-hoping-bring-back-baseball/


Quote
Plante’s stance may have softened after Bronfman said last week they were not seeking money from city hall but need its support in other areas.

"Already it’s a better deal," Plante said after an executive committee meeting this week.
Or more likely her hardball stance was just an anti-Coderre part of her platform during the election last year...it seemed to have paid off....

EastVanMark


Expos investors polling Montrealers on stadium experience

The group of investors who want to bring Major League Baseball back to Montreal want to know more on the customer experience that fans want to have in an eventual new stadium.
The group led by Stephen Bronfman has hired CSL to put together focus groups in Montreal on May 22 and 23.
To be selected for these groups, organized with Léger Marketing, baseball fans must fill out a survey that can be found on the Facebook page ExposNation. The group is specifically targeting baseball fans who could eventually become season ticket holders and go to games.


http://montrealgazette.com/sports/baseball/expos-investors-polling-montrealers-on-stadium-experience

KevinRiley2


Expos investors polling Montrealers on stadium experience

The group of investors who want to bring Major League Baseball back to Montreal want to know more on the customer experience that fans want to have in an eventual new stadium.
The group led by Stephen Bronfman has hired CSL to put together focus groups in Montreal on May 22 and 23.
To be selected for these groups, organized with Léger Marketing, baseball fans must fill out a survey that can be found on the Facebook page ExposNation. The group is specifically targeting baseball fans who could eventually become season ticket holders and go to games.


http://montrealgazette.com/sports/baseball/expos-investors-polling-montrealers-on-stadium-experience
Hope it goes no where.
 


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