Tipper

And then there were no trading partners left that want Johnny! .........
I think you're right.
I'm heading to the basement in search of my old Timm Rosenbach jersey (seems appropriate, eh?).  If I can find that old, hardly worn gem, from '94, I'm takin' 'er in for a new name plate. ???
8) Yikes,  about the only good thing I remember about Timm Rosenbach, was his wife at the time !!

     She was a real sweetie for sure. :P     Met her at the press conference for his big signing !!   ;)

ottawacat

It'll be interesting seeing how Freeman does up here.  He hasn't played, at all, in the past 2 seasons and only a total of 5 games since 2012.  MTL just barely got him in his 20's.  He turns 30 tomorrow.  Maybe this signing will help distract the media, for the rest of the month, while we, hopefully, celebrate the re-signing of a few of our remaining 14 - 16 potential free agents.

blackandgld

This is the QB who I thought would make it big for Hamilton...WRONG!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_McPherson

Ticatsfan25

I might be missing something, but has everyone in this entire thread ignored the whole "non-guaranteed contract" thing?  Do most people not know you can literally cut anyone on your team and pay them nothing if theyre not performing?  Give the guy $500k (we already gave Collaros $500k for 2 seasons and that worked out well, no?) and if he's a bad arm then cut him.  For a guy who depends on what happens here and wants to resurrect his football career, you dont think the WORST POSSIBLE THING for him is to sign a contract to be the highest paid player in the CFL and then get cut?  Think he's going to let that happen?  

Why didnt Bennett write an article about "5 Reasons Why the Als Shouldnt Trade For Manziel"?  Other than "we have no QB other than Freeman" arent those 4 reasons the same?

ExPat

I might be missing something, but has everyone in this entire thread ignored the whole "non-guaranteed contract" thing?  Do most people not know you can literally cut anyone on your team and pay them nothing if theyre not performing?  Give the guy $500k (we already gave Collaros $500k for 2 seasons and that worked out well, no?) and if he's a bad arm then cut him.  For a guy who depends on what happens here and wants to resurrect his football career, you dont think the WORST POSSIBLE THING for him is to sign a contract to be the highest paid player in the CFL and then get cut?  Think he's going to let that happen?  
Well,  not everyone is ignoring it.  On page 4 of this thread, after you raised it the first time, I tried to explain the significant disadvantages of completely ignoring the salary cap and making things up on the fly.  You either end up sacrificing talent level at multiple other positions to accommodate the unproven newbie, or being forced to cut several valuable veterans if the newbie sticks.

But please do share some examples of successful CFL teams who have taken your suggested approach in the salary cap era.  (Hint: you won't find them.)

Lennywasout

I might be missing something, but has everyone in this entire thread ignored the whole "non-guaranteed contract" thing?  Do most people not know you can literally cut anyone on your team and pay them nothing if theyre not performing?  Give the guy $500k (we already gave Collaros $500k for 2 seasons and that worked out well, no?) and if he's a bad arm then cut him.  For a guy who depends on what happens here and wants to resurrect his football career, you dont think the WORST POSSIBLE THING for him is to sign a contract to be the highest paid player in the CFL and then get cut?  Think he's going to let that happen?  
Well, not everyone is ignoring it.  On page 4 of this thread, after you raised it the first time, I tried to explain the significant disadvantages of completely ignoring the salary cap and making things up on the fly.  You either end up sacrificing talent level at multiple other positions to accommodate the unproven newbie, or being forced to cut several valuable veterans if the newbie sticks.

But please do share some examples of successful CFL teams who have taken your suggested approach in the salary cap era.  (Hint: you won't find them.)
Expat.....some people just don’t get that there’s repercussions to making stupid financial decisions with CFL cap constraints.  What part of there’s only so much money to go around?

Crash

I might be missing something, but has everyone in this entire thread ignored the whole "non-guaranteed contract" thing?  Do most people not know you can literally cut anyone on your team and pay them nothing if theyre not performing?  Give the guy $500k (we already gave Collaros $500k for 2 seasons and that worked out well, no?) and if he's a bad arm then cut him.  For a guy who depends on what happens here and wants to resurrect his football career, you dont think the WORST POSSIBLE THING for him is to sign a contract to be the highest paid player in the CFL and then get cut?  Think he's going to let that happen?  

Why didnt Bennett write an article about "5 Reasons Why the Als Shouldnt Trade For Manziel"?  Other than "we have no QB other than Freeman" arent those 4 reasons the same?
Hard to ignore it when you continue to remind us of the fact.... 

Yes the majority of us are aware of the CFL rules surrounding contracts... And we're also aware you want the team to give Manziel 500k.

Ticatsfan25

Sorry, didnt mean to come off as rude there.  My apologies.  Let my inner passionate fan come out a bit too aggressive ;).

Totally understand that there's only so much money to go around, and yes "ignoring salary cap" is probably a bad thing to do haha, but, for discussion purposes, let's look at it this way:  Do we agree Cats essentially need to bring in one more QB?  Don't see them starting season with just Masoli/Golson/Evans.  Probably need a proven vet, can't see them putting all eggs in the Masoli basket unless they really like Golson.  How much is that QB going to make?  $150k tops?  Less?  So, if we get Manziel to "settle" at an incentivized $400k, then the difference to bring him in and him hitting his bonuses means $250k.  Ticats pay $1 for every dollar spent over the cap up to $100k.  So lets say Cats say screw it, we're going over $100k this year and they pay $100k fine end of season and assume they make that back (and more) in incremental revenues re jerseys/tickets/etc.  Now we've got $150k to shave off some players to come out "even".  They won't keep 4 QBs on the roster if Manziel is signed so Evans gets cut, now we have to shave $100k.  Is that not doable across a 56-man roster?  Not at all suggesting people take pay cuts or rework deals (that wont happen), but more so that gets spread across the free agent pool.  Obviously hoping we dont then lose an important FA as a result of this, and if we do then we hope Manziel is the real deal.

I am certainly no cap-ologist haha, and I have no idea what their payroll looks like or what it's going to cost to bring certain FAs in, and maybe I am way off base with this thought process.  But when you look at it this way, is this scenario really that outlandish?  Maybe its just wishful thinking on my part and maybe I am clouded by my interest in him landing on our team.  I dont imagine they keep the guy on the roster if he's mediocre, they would only keep him if he's going to light it up.  Otherwise yeah not worth the salary.  If he lights it up then he's worth the money and we will all be happy!  :)



Glovesave

From a salary perspective I agree the Cats should not give him 500k type money.

From a Football perspective we have Masoli who looks average and not much reasonable prospect of him ever delivering much more than average results.  

At the very least purely from a Football perspective Manzeil at least has a higher ceiling of potential especially as per Jones.

Potential beats proven average unless you can find a better option...and Glenn isn’t it either.

So if the Cats can get Manzeil here without financially hurting the team I’m all for it.

The prospect of watching my team compete with The current QB’s we have available is not all that exciting a prospect 

Grover

Sorry, didnt mean to come off as rude there.  My apologies.  Let my inner passionate fan come out a bit too aggressive ;).

Totally understand that there's only so much money to go around, and yes "ignoring salary cap" is probably a bad thing to do haha, but, for discussion purposes, let's look at it this way:  Do we agree Cats essentially need to bring in one more QB?  Don't see them starting season with just Masoli/Golson/Evans.  Probably need a proven vet, can't see them putting all eggs in the Masoli basket unless they really like Golson.  How much is that QB going to make?  $150k tops?  Less?  So, if we get Manziel to "settle" at an incentivized $400k, then the difference to bring him in and him hitting his bonuses means $250k.  Ticats pay $1 for every dollar spent over the cap up to $100k.  So lets say Cats say screw it, we're going over $100k this year and they pay $100k fine end of season and assume they make that back (and more) in incremental revenues re jerseys/tickets/etc.  Now we've got $150k to shave off some players to come out "even".  They won't keep 4 QBs on the roster if Manziel is signed so Evans gets cut, now we have to shave $100k.  Is that not doable across a 56-man roster?  Not at all suggesting people take pay cuts or rework deals (that wont happen), but more so that gets spread across the free agent pool.  Obviously hoping we dont then lose an important FA as a result of this, and if we do then we hope Manziel is the real deal.

I am certainly no cap-ologist haha, and I have no idea what their payroll looks like or what it's going to cost to bring certain FAs in, and maybe I am way off base with this thought process.  But when you look at it this way, is this scenario really that outlandish?  Maybe its just wishful thinking on my part and maybe I am clouded by my interest in him landing on our team.  I dont imagine they keep the guy on the roster if he's mediocre, they would only keep him if he's going to light it up.  Otherwise yeah not worth the salary.  If he lights it up then he's worth the money and we will all be happy!  :)
"The system’s review process includes detailed field audits of all nine clubs twice per year, once during the CFL season and once following its completion. Teams are also required to provide regular updates on compensation levels at the 6-game, 12-game and 18-game points of the season."
https://www.stampeders.com/2016/04/25/no-team-exceeds-the-2015-cap/



Teams are watched closely on this, In your case they would be busted almost immediately!

Sometimes teams go over at the end of the season because of regular season and playoff bonuses that must be paid out, But The League would be very upset if a team intentionally broke the cap

Thanks to @Doc_Dave for sig

bobo82

This is the QB who I thought would make it big for Hamilton...WRONG!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_McPherson
I'm heading to the basement in search of my old Timm Rosenbach jersey (seems appropriate, eh?).  If I can find that old, hardly worn gem, from '94, I'm takin' 'er in for a new name plate. ???
LMAO and OMG at the mere mention of these two plugs McPherson and Rosenbach . I have to laugh at these two clowns names coming up in this thread because if I don't look back and laugh I'd cry .  :'(

Quite possibly two of the worst starting QB's in this teams history , if not the top two period .
Yup , the early nineties was a sad and embarrassing time to be a Cat fan . The team just couldn't get out of the way of itself in stepping in front of one disaster after another . The team actually acquired Damon Allen for the "92" season and wound up 11-7 that season after going 3-15 the season before . So what does the team do in their infinite wisdom ? trade Allen away in the off season and decide to go with hotshot Heisman runner up  McPherson as their starter in "93" after he road the pine as the 2nd stringer in his first two seasons with the club . The team fell to 6-12 in "93" finishing with 5 less wins then the season before .In short the guy was a walking talking disaster waiting to happen . His one and only year as our starter saw him throw up 21 ints compared to only 6 td passes and having an unbelievably bad completion avg of 41.3 %. 

Needless to say that 1993 season was McPherson's last as a Cat as the team announced that they had signed another hotshot QB for the "94" season from the NFL name of Timm Rosenbach . Yup , this was the guy the team proclaimed was the guy to lead us out of the wilderness and back to glory . Not surprisingly Rosenbach to put it bluntly absolutely STUNK as the starter and didn't last the season as the team released him after 11 games played in that "94" disaster of a season that saw the team actually wind up with a worse W/L record ( 4-14) then the year before . :o Rosenbach ending up tossing as many ints as tds in his short time here throwing 10 of each and only completed 52.7 % of his passes .

Yup , it's kinda ironic and funny that I had a conversation recently with my son (2ez) about the Cats and their current situation in regards to little Johnny Arsehole and we wound up talking about how both the McPherson and Rosenbach signings were indeed very similar to the teams management then and now and their attraction to shiny objects and how it seems that history will indeed repeat itself if the team winds up signing this loser to a contract . ??? But then again they say that bad luck comes in threes and McPherson and Rosenbach already hold down spots #1 and #2 on that list.....hopefully the team comes to their senses and there won't be a number #3 .

 
15 GREY CUPS for HAMILTON BASED TEAMS
12,13,15,28,29,32,43,53,57,63,65,67,72,86,99

stevehvh

"The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously."
- Hubert H. Humphrey

Grover

bobo you're gonna love this!

CFL personnel men question Johnny Manziel’s demands

“That Manziel agent demand is garbage. He’s an idiot. I hope Hamilton stands their ground and he goes and pursues his ‘other professional opportunities.’ To call out Collaros and say he had very little success in the league is dumb. All the guy did was lead his team to the Grey Cup and was on his way to an MOP season before tearing his ACL. The guy doesn’t deserve a penny more than Vince Young. What has he done in his career aside from drink his way out of the NFL? ” one CFL source said.

“I wish someone would call his agent and tell him to tell me what his client has done aside from boozing and partying himself out of a job. He hasn’t done a thing since college… that was years ago. I hope they let him sit on the neg and I would love to know what these other opportunities are,” another CFL personnel man said.

“I didn’t think he was that good at the NFL level. If he loves football he should hope to play in the CFL and stay there forever,” an NFL executive says.

If playing football in Canada actually comes to fruition, one front office man believes there is someone who might meet Manziel’s demands.

“I could definitely see Kavis [Reed] paying him.”


MUCH MORE HERE

http://3downnation.com/2018/01/13/cfl-personnel-men-question-johnny-manziels-demands/

smogmonster

bobo you're gonna love this!

CFL personnel men question Johnny Manziel’s demands

“That Manziel agent demand is garbage. He’s an idiot. I hope Hamilton stands their ground and he goes and pursues his ‘other professional opportunities.’ To call out Collaros and say he had very little success in the league is dumb. All the guy did was lead his team to the Grey Cup and was on his way to an MOP season before tearing his ACL. The guy doesn’t deserve a penny more than Vince Young. What has he done in his career aside from drink his way out of the NFL? ” one CFL source said.

“I wish someone would call his agent and tell him to tell me what his client has done aside from boozing and partying himself out of a job. He hasn’t done a thing since college… that was years ago. I hope they let him sit on the neg and I would love to know what these other opportunities are,” another CFL personnel man said.

“I didn’t think he was that good at the NFL level. If he loves football he should hope to play in the CFL and stay there forever,” an NFL executive says.

If playing football in Canada actually comes to fruition, one front office man believes there is someone who might meet Manziel’s demands.

“I could definitely see Kavis [Reed] paying him.”


MUCH MORE HERE

http://3downnation.com/2018/01/13/cfl-personnel-men-question-johnny-manziels-demands/
While I agree with the sentiments of the above I also find it to be more than a bit cowardly to slam an athlete and not put your name on your thoughts.  Get some stones "CFL personnel men".  Who publishes such anonymous comments so haphazardly?  I expect better from Justin Dunk.
Permanence, perseverance and persistence in spite of all obstacles, discouragements, and impossibilities: It is this, that in all things distinguishes the strong soul from the weak.
Thomas Carlyle

Lennywasout

If Dunk was given these statements “off the record “ then it’s not Dunk fault names are not published with the quotes.  Perhaps there would be repercussions from CFL head office.  These sentiments from these GM”s reflect the reality of dealing with Johnny Swelled Head.

I agree wholeheartedly with the one particular comment...let him sit on the neg list until Jan 2019 unless someone gives us a fantastic deal to trade for his rights.  
 


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