#### EastVanMark

lets start again

If you miss and I run it out of the endzone....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one
ok
If I kick it out.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward
There isn't one
ok then

If I block the kick....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one
Interesting

If you hit the upright or crossbar.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one. But there is one if you miss even more
But all I hear is that you get a point for missing a field goal!
You get this reward for failure?  Yet in those examples of failure, examples of missing a field goal....there is no point?

What gives?
What gives, is in none of those other examples did the kicking team get rewarded for not accomplishing its goal, while if they miss the field goal by an even larger margin, and the receiving team could do nothing about it, they DO get rewarded with a single point.

#### ro1313

lets start again

If you miss and I run it out of the endzone....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one
ok
If I kick it out.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward
There isn't one
ok then

If I block the kick....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one
Interesting

If you hit the upright or crossbar.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one. But there is one if you miss even more
But all I hear is that you get a point for missing a field goal!
You get this reward for failure?  Yet in those examples of failure, examples of missing a field goal....there is no point?

What gives?
What gives, is in none of those other examples did the kicking team get rewarded for not accomplishing its goal, while if they miss the field goal by an even larger margin, and the receiving team could do nothing about it, they DO get rewarded with a single point.
They could have done plenty

They could have blocked the kick
They could have stopped them before they got in range

But the bottom line is you don't get the point because you missed the field goal....You admitted it you don't get rewarded for missing a field goal...never did,
never will

You were rewarded for stopping the other team from getting the ball out of their endzone

#### CatsFaninOttawa

Yes, you do get rewarded for missing a field goal. Always has, always will (unless they change the rule)

Gaining a point for a loss in hockey is a good point, however I'm thinking of more on the field of play points not points in the standings.

Very close actually. A team lining up for a field goal is trying to accomplish that specific goal. The ball missing the goal posts but sailing through the endzone is a byprouduct of that. Its would be like awarding a goal in hockey for hitting the post. After all, the other team did allow a shot on net. So why don't they count that as a goal or 1/2 a goal? Because that would be awarding failure. (just like the way the rouge does in that instance).

No, allowing a team to gain a point without giving the opposing team an opportunity...now THAT is ridiculous.
If you miss and I run it out of the endzone....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?

If I kick it out.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward

If I block the kick....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?

If you hit the upright or crossbar.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?

All 4 cases....You failed....You don't get a reward

Now how did you not have an opportunity?

I started on my own 10 yard line...marched the ball down field
How many opportunities did you have?  You failed each and every time

You had an opportunity to block it....you failed to do so

From where I stand....That point is a reward for your failures...not mine
Exactly. All the more reason to stay consistent and not allow the reward for not being able to kick the ball through the uprights and keeping the ball in the field of play. None of the scenarios mentioned awarded points for failures, so why should this one be any different
Why? Because they succeeded in doing something. They kicked the ball across the opposition's goal line without allowing the opposition to bring it back out. It doesn't matter how they kick it (other than a kickoff due to not earning the field position prior to the kick), it's all the same.

Here's one. First and ten on the opposition's 25. There's a good possibility of scoring a touchdown on the play, but they only get 11 yard. One could say that they failed to get the touchdown, but were rewarded with another first down.

#### ro1313

Chris Berman reports on the Grey Cup to American viewers, explicitly on how the game ended. This would be an embarrassment to the CFL and, most importantly, the country.

But that's is the issue right there!
No offence to the original poster but the issues has always been....what the Americans and the CFL haters think

Lets get rid of the rouge and maybe they will like us

Lets get rid of no yards and they will want to be friends

Maybe if we move the posts to the back of the endzone......

Know what?
F'em   nothing we do will change what they think!
We can make the CFL exactly the same as the NFL...field size. number of players...rules....and it wont change....because its not the NFL!

I am not willing to change OUR game one bit...even if it would make a difference.  This is our game.  If they don't like it the way it is...To hell with them....Its their loss

But maybe if WE stopped saying it was a reward for failure.........

#### EastVanMark

lets start again

If you miss and I run it out of the endzone....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one
ok
If I kick it out.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward
There isn't one
ok then

If I block the kick....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one
Interesting

If you hit the upright or crossbar.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one. But there is one if you miss even more
But all I hear is that you get a point for missing a field goal!
You get this reward for failure?  Yet in those examples of failure, examples of missing a field goal....there is no point?

What gives?
What gives, is in none of those other examples did the kicking team get rewarded for not accomplishing its goal, while if they miss the field goal by an even larger margin, and the receiving team could do nothing about it, they DO get rewarded with a single point.
They could have done plenty

They could have blocked the kick
They could have stopped them before they got in range

But the bottom line is you don't get the point because you missed the field goal....You admitted it you don't get rewarded for missing a field goal...never did,
never will

You were rewarded for stopping the other team from getting the ball out of their endzone
No. Once again, we are looking at "other" factors that "could" have happened from before the kick. I'm diluting it down to a field goal attempt. None of that other stuff is relevant.

Just like in hockey, the other team COULD have stopped them from advancing on the ice, they COULD have taken the puck away from them, but that STILL doesn't mean that the team gets a goal for missing the net.

In football, the kicking team tried to kick a field goal (that was their goal running onto the field), missed, the other team had no chance of fielding the ball, and the kicking team was awarded a point. Bottom line, the kicking team just got a point for missing a field goal. Always have, always will.

#### Aerial

A kick is a kick though.  Does reason for kicking the ball matter?  Shouldn't matter how you kick the ball to get a rouge.  What matters is the rules applied for how a rouge is awarded, and a point is a reward as most see it.  But kicking the ball with your feet is a kick, regadardless if it's from the ground or dropped from your hand.  That's why a dropkick is allowed for an extra point, doesn't matter if it's held or not.  But you can't kick the ball as in a punt from the hands where the ball doesn't hit the ground for a point after touchdown.  Them's the rules.
"Canadian football does in fact have 4 downs, its just that as Canadians we are very polite and punt on the third down" -John Candy, SCTV

#### Xvys

The Rouge isn't a "reward for failure".  It's a reward for field position, just like all the other scoring points.

You advance the ball into your opponent's EZ and your reward is 6 points.  Your bonus reward is the convert, which is no longer automatic.

You advance the ball close enough that could can kick the ball through the uprights (drop kicks still count) you are rewarded with 3 points.

You tackle your opponent in their end zone, you are rewarded with 2 points and then get the ball back either by scrimmage or k/o

You advance the ball far enough into your opponent's zone that you can scrimmage kick (this includes a missed field goal and k/o) the ball into your opponent's EZ and he can't return it out (or out the back), you get a single point, the glorious Rouge.

I've seen literally hundreds of games at all levels of Cdn Football decided by the Rouge, so take it out and you've simply moved one step closer to the boring, plodding, antiseptic four down game played south of the border.  No thanks.
Well said!

#### Aerial

Yup.  Some teams might find it easier to get a rouge by trying a field goal if they have no punter worth anything even if they couldn't care less about the 3 points with extra risk, they just want to be sure they get one point..  A kick is a kick as the rules state.

#### EastVanMark

Yes, you do get rewarded for missing a field goal. Always has, always will (unless they change the rule)

Gaining a point for a loss in hockey is a good point, however I'm thinking of more on the field of play points not points in the standings.

Very close actually. A team lining up for a field goal is trying to accomplish that specific goal. The ball missing the goal posts but sailing through the endzone is a byprouduct of that. Its would be like awarding a goal in hockey for hitting the post. After all, the other team did allow a shot on net. So why don't they count that as a goal or 1/2 a goal? Because that would be awarding failure. (just like the way the rouge does in that instance).

No, allowing a team to gain a point without giving the opposing team an opportunity...now THAT is ridiculous.
If you miss and I run it out of the endzone....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?

If I kick it out.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward

If I block the kick....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?

If you hit the upright or crossbar.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?

All 4 cases....You failed....You don't get a reward

Now how did you not have an opportunity?

I started on my own 10 yard line...marched the ball down field
How many opportunities did you have?  You failed each and every time

You had an opportunity to block it....you failed to do so

From where I stand....That point is a reward for your failures...not mine
Exactly. All the more reason to stay consistent and not allow the reward for not being able to kick the ball through the uprights and keeping the ball in the field of play. None of the scenarios mentioned awarded points for failures, so why should this one be any different
Why? Because they succeeded in doing something. They kicked the ball across the opposition's goal line without allowing the opposition to bring it back out. It doesn't matter how they kick it (other than a kickoff due to not earning the field position prior to the kick), it's all the same.

Here's one. First and ten on the opposition's 25. There's a good possibility of scoring a touchdown on the play, but they only get 11 yard. One could say that they failed to get the touchdown, but were rewarded with another first down.
Then should they be awarded a single if they roll the ball through the end zone bowling style? Cause afterall they did advance it did they not? How about an incomplete pass that goes through the endzone. The team did succeed in doing something, but should it be rewarded with a point?

#### ro1313

.

In football, the kicking team tried to kick a field goal (that was their goal running onto the field), missed, the other team had no chance of fielding the ball, and the kicking team was awarded a point. Bottom line, the kicking team just got a point for missing a field goal. Always have, always will.
WOW

If they get a point for missing a field goal....
Why do they not get a point if the ball is returned for a TD?
The field goal was missed.....no point!
And again you say there was nothing they could do.....they could have blocked it

In hockey.....there is only ONE way to score...put the puck into the net

In football there are 6

1) Carry or throw the ball into the endzone   6 points
2) Repeat the process after scoring a TD   2 points
3) Kick the ball 32 yards between the uprights after a TD  1 point
4) Kick the ball between the uprights from anywhere on the field 3 points
5) Force the other team back into their endzone and tackle him  2 points
6) Kick the ball into or through the endzone and prevent the other team from getting it out....1 point

Your hockey example is apples and oranges

But based on your logic...The  team was trying for a touchdown...they failed  is a field goal a reward for failure to score a touchdown?

#### ro1313

Then should they be awarded a single if they roll the ball through the end zone bowling style? Cause afterall they did advance it did they not? How about an incomplete pass that goes through the endzone. The team did succeed in doing something, but should it be rewarded with a point?
And just when you started to act like an adult

Its a sign of desperation

#### EastVanMark

.

In football, the kicking team tried to kick a field goal (that was their goal running onto the field), missed, the other team had no chance of fielding the ball, and the kicking team was awarded a point. Bottom line, the kicking team just got a point for missing a field goal. Always have, always will.
WOW

If they get a point for missing a field goal....
Why do they not get a point if the ball is returned for a TD?
The field goal was missed.....no point!
And again you say there was nothing they could do.....they could have blocked it

In hockey.....there is only ONE way to score...put the puck into the net

In football there are 6

1) Carry or throw the ball into the endzone   6 points
2) Repeat the process after scoring a TD   2 points
3) Kick the ball 32 yards between the uprights after a TD  1 point
4) Kick the ball between the uprights from anywhere on the field 3 points
5) Force the other team back into their endzone and tackle him  2 points
6) Kick the ball into or through the endzone and prevent the other team from getting it out....1 point

Your hockey example is apples and oranges

But based on your logic...The  team was trying for a touchdown...they failed  is a filed goal a reward for failure to score a touchdown?
They don't get a point because the ball was returned i.e. the receiving team had a chance to return the ball. As the rule exists now, the kicking team can get a point even if the receiving team couldn't return it. That's the problem.

Don't forget the last way to score:

7) Miss a field goal badly, don't let the other team a chance to play the ball, get a point anyways.

#### ro1313

They don't get a point because the ball was returned
So then you don't get a point for missing a field goal....you get a point for preventing the return.....Return....no point   no return   point

7) Miss a field goal badly, don't let the other team a chance to play the ball, get a point anyways.

1 foot wide and landing 5 yards deep is no more badly that 1 foot wide and out the back

and again  you had 50 chances   every time I made a play you had a chance to stop me...including blocking the lick

#### EastVanMark

They don't get a point because the ball was returned
So then you don't get a point for missing a field goal....you get a point for preventing the return.....Return....no point   no return   point

7) Miss a field goal badly, don't let the other team a chance to play the ball, get a point anyways.

1 foot wide and landing 5 yards deep is no more badly that 1 foot wide and out the back

and again  you had 50 chances   every time I made a play you had a chance to stop me...including blocking the lick
But you didn't set out to that. You tried to kick a field goal and failed but the ball traveled through the end zone (again not what you intended to do) but you still got a point.

You can miss the uprights by 20 yards on a FG attempt and still get a point. What you could or could not BEFORE the field goal attempt is irrelevant

#### BCRiderFan

lets start again

If you miss and I run it out of the endzone....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one
ok
If I kick it out.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward
There isn't one
ok then

If I block the kick....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one
Interesting

If you hit the upright or crossbar.....do you get the point?
Where is the reward?
There isn't one. But there is one if you miss even more
But all I hear is that you get a point for missing a field goal!
You get this reward for failure?  Yet in those examples of failure, examples of missing a field goal....there is no point?

What gives?
What gives, is in none of those other examples did the kicking team get rewarded for not accomplishing its goal, while if they miss the field goal by an even larger margin, and the receiving team could do nothing about it, they DO get rewarded with a single point.
They could have done plenty

They could have blocked the kick
They could have stopped them before they got in range

But the bottom line is you don't get the point because you missed the field goal....You admitted it you don't get rewarded for missing a field goal...never did,
never will

You were rewarded for stopping the other team from getting the ball out of their endzone
No. Once again, we are looking at "other" factors that "could" have happened from before the kick. I'm diluting it down to a field goal attempt. None of that other stuff is relevant.

Just like in hockey, the other team COULD have stopped them from advancing on the ice, they COULD have taken the puck away from them, but that STILL doesn't mean that the team gets a goal for missing the net.

In football, the kicking team tried to kick a field goal (that was their goal running onto the field), missed, the other team had no chance of fielding the ball, and the kicking team was awarded a point. Bottom line, the kicking team just got a point for missing a field goal. Always have, always will.
Exactly, and there's no "embarrassment" here. If someone doesn't like our rules, go watch some other league. I'm proud of our game.
Grey Cup wins last decade, okay 11 years

BC - 2
Cal - 2
Mtl - 2
Tor - 1
Edm -1
Ott - 1
Ham - 0
Wpg - 0

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_G ... _champions

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